Rear Brake Job - 6th Gen

Can we use a 3.6r rear calipers to replace 2.5 rear calipers?or are they same calipers?

 

 

a part search shows same 2 part # s for right and left rear calipers.

I searched model year 2015 FYI. Should all be the same.

a part search shows same 2 part # s for right and left rear calipers.

I searched model year 2015 FYI. Should all be the same.

 

Thank you!!

Thank you!!

 

and I don t even own a Legacy anymore. Still getting subscription notifications . I have a 2018 WRX. .

I took my 2016 Subaru Legacy to the dealer because I was hearing a clunking noise from the front end at 30,000 miles. The dealer suggested a brake service which would cost $85 per axle. They said brakes are NOT covered under the factory warranty. I replaced the front brake pads, shims and lubed the caliper slide pins and I have not heard the clunking noise again. Was I misled about the brakes not being covered under the factory warranty?

The dealer ... said brakes are NOT covered under the factory warranty.

Your dealer lied. From the 2016 Legacy/Outback Warranty & Maintenance Guide you should have received with your new Legacy, page 4:

Wear Item Limited Warranty

WEAR ITEM COVERAGE is 3 years or 36,000 miles, whichever comes first.

Items covered are brake pad/shoe linings, clutch linings, and wiper blades.

Your dealer lied. From the 2016 Legacy/Outback Warranty & Maintenance Guide you should have received with your new Legacy, page 4:

 

Gee, go figure...

 

FWIW, SOA told me the fraying seat belt in my 2005 wasn't covered under a lifetime warranty, she changed her tune, when I told her the page number in the warranty book...

 

Never trust a Dealership or SOA to tell you anything that will save you money.

 

Kind of like an Insurance Company, remember, they are not in business to give you money.

That is why we call them Stealersips!!!!!!!!!

That is why we call them Stealersips!!!!!!!!!

 

Yep, been calling them that in the 4th Gen forum for almost a decade now.

 

Being 63y/o, The best advice I can give you young guy's is to find a good mechanic and stick with him. I use the guy my Dad did, my son uses him too. He gives us a cash price and some things are done for free.

 

example, My 05 GT Wagon, I just had to have them take a Koni insert out of a front strut they installed years ago, I brought them a junk yard strut to install it in. I picked the strut up, installed it in the car, took it in the 4 wheel alignment. When I pick the car, there was no charge for he strut/insert change over. When I asked about it, he said, don't worry about it. The alignment was $68.00.

 

When I picked up my 09 from having the timing belt changed, I mentioned how nicely the wagon drove after alignment, the Tech said, he spent a lot of time under the car, good to hear it drives well.

Edited June 23, 2018 by Max Capacity

Originally Posted by ammcinnis View Post

Your dealer lied. From the 2016 Legacy/Outback Warranty & Maintenance Guide you should have received with your new Legacy, page 4

 

 

Shame on me for not doing my homework before going to the dealership! I also replaced my rear brake pads. I did NOT disconnect the battery. With the caliper/e-brake motor off there is plenty of room to service the brakes, no need to disconnect anything else. I also had no problem compressing the "screw" type caliper piston(adapter #7). This is an excellent how to:http://www.paulstravelpictures.com/Subaru-Outback-Rear-Brake-Pads-Replacement-Guide/

I did NOT disconnect the battery. With the caliper/e-brake motor off there is plenty of room to service the brakes, no need to disconnect anything else.

It's not a matter of access. The EPB system will occasionally apply and release the parking brakes without notice. It would be problematic (and potentially hazardous) to have this happen while servicing the rear brakes.

It's not a matter of access. The EPB system will occasionally apply and release the parking brakes without notice. It would be problematic (and potentially hazardous) to have this happen while servicing the rear brakes.

 

Under what conditions would the electronic parking brake activate on its own? The only stories I have come across are people accidentally touching the switch inside the car while they have the rear brake caliper off, not the result of a SKYNET infected parking brake;)

Under what conditions would the electronic parking brake activate on its own?

Here are three such conditions I've seen described in Subaru tech documents. There may be others:

The Sliding Prevention feature of the EPB allows for self activation of the EPB motor to increase the tension to the brake pads, if the parking brake had been previously set. Sliding Prevention is activated if the wheel speed sensors detect vehicle movement within 15 minutes of the EPB activation.

The Temperature Compensation feature of the EPB functions by calculating brake component temperature from information obtained by the CAN and HCU. The Ambient air temperature, vehicle speed, road incline, service brake use frequency, and other vehicle information are considered when calculating brake component temperature. Higher temperatures equate to expanded parts which will contract as they cool. This could produce a situation where the initial EPB activation is not strong enough to maintain vehicle position. Compensation for high temperature is achieved by two methods;

1. The EPB is activated with the Engine operating or CAN still operating. All necessary data is available to the EPB control unit (HCU) and the EPB motor applies additional mechanical force to the brake pads.

2. The EPB is activated with the Engine off and the CAN in sleep mode. Data to determine brake component temperature is not available to the EPB control unit (HCU). The initial EPB activation will be limited to learned values. An additional application of the EPB motor will be self activated by the EPB control unit (HCU) 2 minutes and 30 seconds after the EPB was initially set. This will tighten any clearances that may have developed from contracting brake parts.

An Automatic adjustment procedure is performed if no EPB operation is detected. The EPB control unit (HCU) monitors the driving mileage and will self activate the EPB with the engine off once every 1864 miles (3000 kilometers). This procedure repositions the ball nut clearance from the back face of the hydraulic piston and tests the EPB motor drive circuits. The EPB will remain on after the adjustment. EPB release is accomplished with the automatic release feature or manual release while pressing the brake pedal.

(Emphasis added.) Edited June 27, 2018 by ammcinnis

The EPB control unit (HCU) monitors the driving mileage and will self activate the EPB with the engine off once every 1864 miles (3000 kilometers).

 

So the EPB is self aware, thanks for the info!

So am I safe to service the rear brakes with the battery disconnected?

So am I safe to service the rear brakes with the battery disconnected?

Yes, according to the FSM. You will also have to unplug the EPB actuator at the caliper, in order to swing the caliper up off the rotor to remove/install the pads and retract the piston.

 

The important point is that the EPBs can self-actuate at any time, as long as the battery is connected. I once walked out into the garage at just the right time to hear the EPB system on my Legacy execute an automatic adjustment cycle. It only took a couple of seconds, but it caught me by surprise. I've also heard the EPB do a temperature compensation cycle numerous times.

Edited June 27, 2018 by ammcinnis

That's really interesting information. Thanks for sharing. Never would have imagined that the EPB is "smart".

 

I could see where the temp adjustments are needed. The motor is probably set to cut off when just the right pressure is detected when initially applied and needing an adjustment once the brake components cool off.

Guess such a thing was not needed in the non electronic versions as folks would have over yanked anyway and that they had the drum for the parking brake.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Max powers View Post

So am I safe to service the rear brakes with the battery disconnected?

Yes, according to the FSM. You will also have to unplug the EPB actuator at the caliper, in order to swing the caliper up off the rotor to remove/install the pads and retract the piston.

 

The wiring for the EPB and the brake hose are both long enough to set aside the caliper without disconnecting. I used a caliper hanger hook to hang the caliper from the strut. The next time I service my rear brakes I will be safe and disconnect the battery!

Very interesting read.

I bought my 2016 Legacy 2.5i Limited about a month ago. All of the rotors and pads were bad and the dealer I bought the car from paid for new pads and rotors all the way around. I decided to use Subaru parts. The whole job only took about 3 hours. To address the rear E brake issue, I disconnected the negative battery terminal and unplugged the E brake connectors from the calipers. I had no problem installing the rear pads. The only thing I would remind everyone is that you'll need a 7mm hex wrench to unbolt the caliper from the caliper bracket. I joined the forum after the brake job so I didn't think to take pictures.

Posted a video of me manually retracting the e-brake using needle-nose pliers.

Neg battery was disconnected AND e-brake connector removed.

It's very clumsy but you should be able to duplicate.

Hey folks -- my 2015 needs it's rear brakes done and I just wanted to double check--

 

This job is safe to do WITHOUT putting the car into "brake service mode" with SSM or OBDII as long as one releases parking brake, disconnects the neg terminal on the battery AND removes the electronic connector to the EPB on the caliper.

 

Didn't know if the "brake service mode" does more than disabling the EPB from actuating, such as re-calibrating the EPB after exiting the service mode.

 

Also -- any recommends on good non-subaru OEM replacement pads/rotors. I typically get Raybestos stuff from Rock Auto.

 

Thanks,

 

David

This job is safe to do WITHOUT putting the car into "brake service mode" with SSM or OBDII as long as one releases parking brake, disconnects the neg terminal on the battery AND removes the electronic connector to the EPB on the caliper.

Yes. All "brake service mode" does is fully retract the EPB jackscrew in both rear calipers. If you don't have an SSM tool, you can manually retract the jackscrews using simple hand tools. Subaru supports either method.

 

Didn't know if the "brake service mode" does more than disabling the EPB from actuating, such as re-calibrating the EPB after exiting the service mode.

No. Regardless of the method used to retract the EPB jackscrews, you still need to perform a simple manual initialization after replacing the rear pads. Do yourself a favor and download a legal copy of the Factory Service Manual ($35 from the Subaru Technical Information System web site) and review the brake service section before starting. Brakes are too important for your safety and others' to just bungle along.

 

N.B. Some third-party scan tools will reportedly allow you to enter Subaru's "brake service mode" but provide no way to exit from it. Recovery from this condition requires an actual SSM tool, which usually means paying a dealer to do it for you.

 

... any recommends on good non-subaru OEM replacement pads/rotors ...

OEM pads are Denso, also available from Rock Auto. Edited July 18, 2021 by ammcinnis

I've had no issues since doing it myself with needlenose pliers and then putting the brake on and off 5 times after the job. I use my ebrake a few times a week and I tracked it right after with no issues. Stoptech also makes good pads.

Catching up, this thread is a very good read, lots of good info.

 

I'm at 155K+ at the moment. Front pads replaced, rotors still in spec but at the bottom end of useful life, next time they will be replaced.

Rear pads, working on the second set of replacements. Subaru seems to have put a big bias towards the rear brakes as the pads wear out much faster than the fronts.

Some time after both the front and rear pads were done I noticed a shimmy to the car when I hit the brakes. It wasn't in the steering wheel. Odd thing is it would come and go, sometimes getting better as you drove, other times the opposite.

After finally getting on my nerves long enough I took it to the shop I use and told them something was warped and after driving the car and experiencing the issue themselves they recommended rear rotors.

Original rear rotors replaced at 155k, everything is back to factory smooth and I'm happy.

Yes. All "brake service mode" does is fully retract the EPB jackscrew in both rear calipers. If you don't have an SSM tool, you can manually retract the jackscrews using simple hand tools. Subaru supports either method.

 

No. Regardless of the method used to retract the EPB jackscrews, you still need to perform a simple manual initialization after replacing the rear pads. Do yourself a favor and download a legal copy of the Factory Service Manual ($35 from the Subaru Technical Information System web site) and review the brake service section before starting. Brakes are too important for your safety and others' to just bungle along.

 

N.B. Some third-party scan tools will reportedly allow you to enter Subaru's "brake service mode" but provide no way to exit from it. Recovery from this condition requires an actual SSM tool, which usually means paying a dealer to do it for you.

 

OEM pads are Denso, also available from Rock Auto.

Thanks for the reply --

 

Curious - do the calipers screw retract to a certain point THEN slide in as normal ? Or do they screw retract all the way flush?

 

I've got a copy of the FSM but always like to triple check multiple sources before getting started.

 

I've had good luck with the Raybestos Element 3 coated rotors and pads, and can get pads and rotors front and rear for $175 from Rock Auto.

 

Good to know the Subaru pads are Denso. Do you know if the rotors are also Denso?

 

Was tempted to put Subaru parts back on but it's looking like around $500 for pads/rotors from my local dealership.

 

Thanks again,

 

David

 

Sent from my Pixel 5 using Tapatalk

"the calipers screw retract to a certain point THEN slide in as normal"...this

 

Also be aware if you are in a State that does inspections and your car needs an inspection after your rear brake job be aware that disconnecting the battery resets your service counter etc. You will need to drive 50 miles or more to allow inspection of the vehicle in some States.

 

Just did my rear brakes at 46k miles. Just started to hit the wear indicator in the last couple of weeks. Went smoothly thanks to this thread.