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Vehicle recovery (snow and sand)


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OK I've been reading a bunch about all this stuff. My main question is, does anyone recall if the screw in hook on the front actually threads into the frame rail or not. I haven't had my bumper off in a while and can't remember.

 

Other than that, I don't think there are any points on the front and there's basically none on the rear. I have a hitch so not worried about the rear so much.

 

And I'm not concerned about buried in 12 inches of snow up to the doors so we aren't talking extreme stresses here with broken snatch straps and twisted frames and etc.

 

 

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I don't think the front tow-hook does screw into the frame rail, which is what made me consider installing a hideaway tow strap. I'll go verify right now.

 

As for the rear. I haven't installed my hitch. There is a metal look on the underside in front of the rear bumper, on the bottom of the spare tire well, I believe. You'd tear your bumper off trying to access it though, so it wouldn't do you any good unless you took off your rear bumper.

MILKRUN  - Click Here

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Yea that one on the rear is the factory tow/tie down point, but I wouldn't trust it much, knowing how weak floor plans are. The hitch is 4 big bolts directly into threaded holes on each frame rail giving you the effect of an equalizer strap. If you can't recover off that, you've really messed up or need to learn better recovery skills.

 

The front one is either on the radiator support (terrible) or a plate welded onto the end of the frame rail (good enough). I did think about looking too see if I could add a second point to the driver side.

 

Don't misunderstand, I'm not trying to get over my hubs in mud. I don't even plan on true off roading. But I want to understand what to do if I slide off the road into a soft snow bank. I realize I can call a wrecker but I don't always have signal in the mountains and so long as I can make sure my recovery point doesn't rip off when jo bob is winching me out, all the better.

 

 

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the front is attached to a plate on the frame.

 

If you expect to be in need of a tow, i'd have your tow straps already attached. Joe bob idd as isn't going to have much patience while you root around for the tow eyebolt.

 

Also if you have not installed the hard skid plate, I'd do that too

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Yea if I ever get myself in that situation, I'll be starting with a shovel and hoping I can be pulled out with a shackle on the hitch. But if not, I'll have the front attached before anyone really comes along. Getting that tow bolt on is quick.

 

I already have the 3/16 primitive Racing plate with stinger tail and the differential cover. Also plan to carry my own equipment and shovel. My lady friend got plowed in at my apartment after an 8" storm the other day and a shovel would have been nice.

 

Is this all overkill? Sure. Have I ever been stuck in my 3" tall civic? Nope. Do I want to pretend I'm a rally driver? Yes.

 

 

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have you pm'ed Gex? he moved from wannabe rally to bot/built/racing a rally car. He can give you a list of what not to do which might save you a bit on the learning/digging.

 

My limited experience with rally indicates skid plates are a requirement. When things get woolly, ability with a shovel is the least of your issues. On road racing tracks, the trees have tires and fencing. In rally, not so much. :)

 

Regardless, have fun. i had a blast until the skid plate issue.

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I'm actually going to a meet and greet pre rallyx season in early March. Also meeting one of the volunteer captains for Idaho rally and will likely be volunteering it. This specific outback likely won't stage rally and will see very limited actual racing.

 

I'm thinking that once my civic is no longer in use, I might rebuild the engine so it's not leaking everywhere and use it for rally x and maybe cage it. Or buy a fiesta. Or an already log booked car.

 

I suppose I've mixed ideas. Skid plates are for pretend rally and doing dumb stuff in moab. Shovel is for when some idiot gets plowed in at the ski resort or I manage to put my front wheels in sand in moab and need to be winched, or when I'm the dumb idiot at the ski resort. Unfortunately I don't know any good unpaved back roads near me to test any of this on just yet.

 

I'll def reach out to gex though. Are they rallying an lgt?

 

 

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That's actually a really good point. Sometimes if I see a ski patroller cruising around I try to follow them to work on my skiing ability.

 

I figure rallyx is a great way to learn to handle on low friction surfaces and will hopefully translate to better understanding of the car in snow storms. We don't get much ice. Not really a competitive person so not trying to win either. I'll be in prepared right off the bat because of the tune.

 

Hoping to get out to moab this summer which should be fun too. Basically hard pack dirt roads and usually pretty open/safe if you don't take the perfect line.

 

 

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"not a competitive person"?

Unless you are dead, when you are in the starting gate waiting for your turn, your heart's gonna be thumping and you'll be itching to get moving. You'll get all done, sitting there wondering how you got all wound up in 65 seconds. Then you'll get out of the car and realize you're a bit jittery from the buzz. You'll get your time. Then you'll start seeing other times.

Pretty soon, you'll be up for your second run. You thought your heart was pounding the first time?

 

By the end of the day, you'll be driving home with thoughts of better faster parts suspension brakes engine. Next time!

 

Or go home rake the zen garden and contemplate the alignment of the individual rocks upon and adjacent to each other....

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I've wanted a proper zen garden since middle school lol.

 

Don't misunderstand, I have no doubt I'll wreck my car hard trying to push myself in a stage rally. It's a concern actually due to at least 3 blown discs in my back and my potential Co driver having had a lumbar burst fracture while we were mountain biking together.

 

However an outback in prepared that only has a stage 1 tune on all seasons is going to be rubbish. Not compared to a built up miata (rallyx). I've done a fair number of competitions and pushed myself to injury and have learned I just don't care enough about winning. But maybe motorsports will be different. I got real irritated at the go kart track this weekend because someone decided to t bone me on a hair pin during what felt like a good lap.

 

 

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On topic a bit more. I'm hoping to pull off my front bumper and do some car work in the next couple of weeks. I'll see if there's any way to fab up some front recovery points.

 

I don't think I have any machines at work that I could use to test a factory tow hook to destruction (I haven't checked I just assume it's not rated) but maybe I can convince someone at black diamond to test it. I know they have machines and blogs written about various shock loading of straps and carabiners. Things that are rated to 22kn so nearly 5000lbf. I'd think they'd have equipment for a straight pull. Unfortunately I don't currently know anyone who works there.

 

 

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Can I suggest a bit of safety? Simpson makes a head restraint system that works with regular seatbelts as well as full harnesses when you upgrade. https://www.simpsonraceproducts.com/simpson-hybrid-head-neck-restraints

 

If i had one 10 years ago, I'd be alot healthier today. 23mph spin into a guardrail changed my life.

 

If you have never seen this video,

ask yourself how that driver feels now about his cheap helmet and no head restraint system. Granted a Stilo rally helmet is at the very top end for helmets, however, $1000 for a head restraint system is pretty standard price.
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On topic a bit more. I'm hoping to pull off my front bumper and do some car work in the next couple of weeks. I'll see if there's any way to fab up some front recovery points.

 

I don't think I have any machines at work that I could use to test a factory tow hook to destruction (I haven't checked I just assume it's not rated) but maybe I can convince someone at black diamond to test it. I know they have machines and blogs written about various shock loading of straps and carabiners. Things that are rated to 22kn so nearly 5000lbf. I'd think they'd have equipment for a straight pull. Unfortunately I don't currently know anyone who works there.

 

 

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Might be overthinking this? unless you are going Cherry2000 and winching your rig down a glory hole? Your car weighs 3700lbs loaded. A tow rope is 10-15 feet long. A slow steady pull is going to work far better than a big boingy snatchem strap.

 

I used to carry a locking rescue biner rated at 10k and a 20ft length of 2 inch webbing. Never failed, but didn't test in a mud bog though

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Might be overthinking this? unless you are going Cherry2000 and winching your rig down a glory hole? Your car weighs 3700lbs loaded. A tow rope is 10-15 feet long. A slow steady pull is going to work far better than a big boingy snatchem strap.

 

 

 

I used to carry a locking rescue biner rated at 10k and a 20ft length of 2 inch webbing. Never failed, but didn't test in a mud bog though

 

 

 

Been looking up a lot of recovery stuff recently which is what's cause me to be concerned with rated stuff and going bigger. Uphill recovery with mired up to the rims (not unreasonable imo) is 1.25x so only about 5000lbs resistance with gear. If I'm on a paved road, I could likely shovel out of that honestly. But that's about the worse I would expect. Basically deep ish sand on a long uphill straight and me accidentally bogging down.

 

I got worried when I started reading about factory tie downs snapping off and injuring people because they are usually not rated for recovery. My civic has a bent one due to using it as a jack point.

 

 

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Can I suggest a bit of safety? Simpson makes a head restraint system that works with regular seatbelts as well as full harnesses when you upgrade. https://www.simpsonraceproducts.com/simpson-hybrid-head-neck-restraints

 

If i had one 10 years ago, I'd be alot healthier today. 23mph spin into a guardrail changed my life.

 

If you have never seen this video,

ask yourself how that driver feels now about his cheap helmet and no head restraint system. Granted a Stilo rally helmet is at the very top end for helmets, however, $1000 for a head restraint system is pretty standard price.

 

 

 

I'll look into that. I've hit one guard rail in my life (angled but straight on) and already have a blown disc in my neck. $1000 is nothing next to nerve pain.

 

That was painful to watch. I thought Ara required head restraints now. Maybe they didn't when this was taken.

 

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Edited by Nonamedude
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