1997 Legacy issues

Ok so I mentioned in my introduction thread that I have a 1997 Legacy. I traded my 1996 minivan for it. But it clearly has issues. First off it needs an axle bad, smoke rolls off of it when I stop, the brakes are spongy as hell, the rear struts are shot, I think I smell a little oil burning, The lowest pully on the engine wobbles like a son of a gun, and when it's cold it just sounds crappy. It is a base model and has 250,000 miles on it. It has been abused. There are cigarette burns all over the seats and door panels, everything was covered in ashes when I got it, and every single one of the switched is broken off the driver side switch panel. As for the engine, it's actually pretty clean under the hood and and leaks no fluids that I've noticed, but I still haven't even checked the oil in it. I'm gonna try my darnedest to give another life and pull another few hundred thousand miles out of it. I was just wondering, why would the pully wobble?

The crank pulley is wobbling or one of the idlers for the timing belt? If either of those are wobbling you need to remove them and look at why..the crank pulley has a woodruff key to hold it in place, I would bet that the key wore a groove in the back of the pulley. I'll also bet it wasn't tightened with enough torque previously and slipped under load at some point and stayed there. May need another pulley and key.

The crank pulley is wobbling or one of the idlers for the timing belt? If either of those are wobbling you need to remove them and look at why..the crank pulley has a woodruff key to hold it in place, I would bet that the key wore a groove in the back of the pulley. I'll also bet it wasn't tightened with enough torque previously and slipped under load at some point and stayed there. May need another pulley and key.

 

I appreciate your reply man I really do. Yes it is the crank pulley. How exactly would I go about replacing the pulley and key. I know the basics but I wouldn't exactly know how to pull pulley off or the key. I hope that doesn't sound stupid lol. I'm by no means a master mechanic but I'm not afraid to take on a challenge and I have been very successful in the recent past. Also what type of damage could this lead to because it is currently my everyday driver

Well it could damage the crank key way and possibly damage the oil pump and seal, its pretty easy to remove, can stick a flathead screw driver in the access hole on the passenger side of the transmission if its a five speed or disconnect the coil and put a large breaker bar on the frame rail by the battery with a 22mm socket and bump t start the ignition to break the bolt free. Important to disconnect the coil so the car doesn't start accidentally. If you have to buy a new pulley I would just look at a salvage for it might get away from it cheaply if done sooner than later. You can find a variety of woodruff keys at an auto parts store or just go to a dealership. The crank pulley is torqued down at 96 ft lbs i believe.

the crank pulley wobble is not uncommon.

usually caused by improper torquing when the timing belt is replaced.

most of the time it is correctable.

some times it is not easily fixed.

 

you biggest concern is to correct it BEFORE you have a complete failure.

if the timing belt, or any component, fails you will have valve damage.

this will require an expensive valve job and head gasket replacement.

so you want to catch this before it fails.

(it is also possible that there could be damage without a complete failure.)

 

so you need to replace the timing belt, all idlers, and the water pump.

(water pump is not required but it only adds about $50 and it all but guarantees no failure in the next 60k miles.)

 

i get my timing belt kits from ''theimportexperts'' on ebay.

they cost about $135 shipped including the water pump.

 

i also recommend new cam and crank seals, and an o-ring for the oil pump.

if the seals are not leaking, you don't have to do them ,

but it is recommended.

it adds about $30 - $35 to the cost for the parts.

and they will be easily accessible with the timing belt removed.

 

to fix the wobble you will also need a

crank sprocket

crank pulley

wooddruff key

they don't have to be new, just in good condition.

there are several good write ups on how to fix the wobble.

the crank pulley wobble is not uncommon.

usually caused by improper torquing when the timing belt is replaced.

most of the time it is correctable.

some times it is not easily fixed.

 

you biggest concern is to correct it BEFORE you have a complete failure.

if the timing belt, or any component, fails you will have valve damage.

this will require an expensive valve job and head gasket replacement.

so you want to catch this before it fails.

(it is also possible that there could be damage without a complete failure.)

 

so you need to replace the timing belt, all idlers, and the water pump.

(water pump is not required but it only adds about $50 and it all but guarantees no failure in the next 60k miles.)

 

i get my timing belt kits from ''theimportexperts'' on ebay.

they cost about $135 shipped including the water pump.

 

i also recommend new cam and crank seals, and an o-ring for the oil pump.

if the seals are not leaking, you don't have to do them ,

but it is recommended.

it adds about $30 - $35 to the cost for the parts.

and they will be easily accessible with the timing belt removed.

 

to fix the wobble you will also need a

crank sprocket

crank pulley

woodruff key

they don't have to be new, just in good condition.

there are several good write ups on how to fix the wobble.

 

Thanks a lot for the extra info, do you have a link on one of the write ups or something that would be awesome.

 

Also I just had a few other questions, My subaru is AWD, however it doesn't seem to do great in the snow like I've always heard. I couldn't even get it out of the driveway this morning, and it's not the only AWD Subaru I've ever had trouble in. I drove my mother in laws 2007 Legacy and it slide around every turn. My FWD minivan never ever had trouble, even on solid ice. Could the bad axle cause it to not wanna perform like it should? Also I've read about how easy a 2.5 swap is. If it's really as easy as I've heard it's pretty much just plug and play right? But I've also heard that the 2.5 is much less reliable. Is the swap worth the extra 30ish horspower?

Ok so I mentioned in my introduction thread that I have a 1997 Legacy. I traded my 1996 minivan for it. But it clearly has issues. First off it needs an axle bad, smoke rolls off of it when I stop, the brakes are spongy as hell, the rear struts are shot, I think I smell a little oil burning, The lowest pully on the engine wobbles like a son of a gun, and when it's cold it just sounds crappy. It is a base model and has 250,000 miles on it. It has been abused. There are cigarette burns all over the seats and door panels, everything was covered in ashes when I got it, and every single one of the switched is broken off the driver side switch panel. As for the engine, it's actually pretty clean under the hood and and leaks no fluids that I've noticed, but I still haven't even checked the oil in it. I'm gonna try my darnedest to give another life and pull another few hundred thousand miles out of it. I was just wondering, why would the pully wobble?

The crank pulley on my 2.2 legacy broke off while it was driving along. On inspection it had started to break up around the key area and the whole thing just came apart. There was no shaking beforehand like you have, so I had no idea that it was breaking up. I was told by the Subaru people that it was a "known" problem, but I should be ok as my motor was a non interferance one. There was no valve damage, all was replaced and I was up and going again in no time at all. I would get your pulley fixed as quick as possible if you don't want to breakdown anytime soon.

Thanks for the replies everyone. I plan to do the repair ASAP, however funds are limited so it may be another month.. Hopefully it holds up that long. Just wondering is this still a problem in newer legacy's? My mother in law just got a great deal on a 2007 Legacy with a newer engine. The engine has about 45,000 but the body only has about 150,000. I was just wondering why (with the reliability of a Subaru) would this 2007 need an engine at around only 100,000 miles? I think it's a 2.5 engine but I can't tell for certain.

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/122229-95-legacy-crank-bolt-stripped-can-i-swap-the-engine/?hl=%2Bcrank+%2Bpulley+%2Bwobble#entry1030771

 

http://www.ultimatesubaru.org/forum/topic/73653-messed-up-crankshaft-keyway-big-picture/?hl=%2Bcrank+%2Bpulley+%2Bwobble+%2Brepair#entry607652

 

http://www.miata.net/garage/hsue/LoctiteCrank1.html

I would think a month of it wobbling like that may destroy the crank end and key way. If you can findbthe pulley at a yard you may spend 10-30 bucks and the woodruff key set for 3.

 

Not that expensive for something that will keep that motor in your car. Not only that, it could very well come off at any time like on the road and it weighs about 11 lbs, imagine that bouncing down the road at you.

I understand but it was this way when I bought it. I know the person who had it before me only had it a little over a month. So I really have no idea why it's doing it. I will most certainly call around tomorrow and see if I can find a cheap one, but I would think that getting one from a junkyard is somewhat of a bad idea? With the problem being so common it wouldn't only be hard to find but who know how long a used one will last? If I had the money I would change it out tomorrow no problem but I'm just leaving the crappiest job in the world for a better one so my recent paychecks have been extremely thin.

Honestly its only a common problem when its put on wrong to begin with, that type of problem doesn't just occur like a bad cv joint or any other component that needs to be looked after. It's completely ok to get a used pulley if its in good shape. These motors aren't like inline 4's 6's or v type motors..we don't need harmonic balancers, gravity and centering is on our side. Just like everything that is expected to work properly needs to be installed correctly.

Honestly its only a common problem when its put on wrong to begin with, that type of problem doesn't just occur like a bad cv joint or any other component that needs to be looked after. It's completely ok to get a used pulley if its in good shape. These motors aren't like inline 4's 6's or v type motors..we don't need harmonic balancers, gravity and centering is on our side. Just like everything that is expected to work properly needs to be installed correctly.

 

oh ok I understand. I'll certainly call around in the morning. But if it can't be found does anyone know where I can get the basic parts at online. The pulley, sprocket, and key. I can't find the sprocket and key anywhere, not even ebay and places like autozone don't have any of it listed on thier website.

subarupartsforyou.com

I found it listed on Napa, Harmonic Balancer Assy Part no: NOE 6005330. It is also on Autzone's site: http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/1997-Subaru-Legacy/Harmonic-Balancer/_/N-j9fnrZ93y2h. It comes with a new bolt, washer, woodruff key and is $69.00. Out here a harmonic balancer/crank pulley is $23.00 at the Pick n Pull so it might be worth it for you time wise to just order one. They can be a pain to get off but not so bad once you know the tricks.

 

Sometimes you just need to know what to call it. But I don't see a problem with getting one at a yard.

 

I was just wondering why (with the reliability of a Subaru) would this 2007 need an engine at around only 100,000 miles? I think it's a 2.5 engine but I can't tell for certain.

 

Your car probably needed an engine because of a headgasket failure or loss of oil. That's my guess.

I found it listed on Napa, Harmonic Balancer Assy Part no: NOE 6005330. It is also on Autzone's site: http://www.autozone.com/autozone/parts/1997-Subaru-Legacy/Harmonic-Balancer/_/N-j9fnrZ93y2h. It comes with a new bolt, washer, woodruff key and is $69.00. Out here a harmonic balancer/crank pulley is $23.00 at the Pick n Pull so it might be worth it for you time wise to just order one. They can be a pain to get off but not so bad once you know the tricks.

 

Sometimes you just need to know what to call it. But I don't see a problem with getting one at a yard.

 

 

 

Your car probably needed an engine because of a headgasket failure or loss of oil. That's my guess.

 

Thank god for you sir. I feel pretty dumb not searching for harmonic balancer. Thanks so much. Oh and by the way the 2007 wasn't mine it was my mother in laws. I've just always been under the impression that a subaru would run for ever so I wouldn't think that a 6 year old Subaru would have already had an engine replacement, and at only about 100,000 miles. Someone must have been REALLY hard on it. Again thanks a bunch

Hello everyone again. It's been a few days since I've been on. I just wanted to express some other concerns about my Legacy and hope some of you could shine some light on my problems.

 

Ok first of all it's got no power. When I take off I have to put the pedal on the floor to get it to move. It does real well at around 50-60 miles an hour but getting it up there can be a challenge. It probably takes a full 10 seconds to get up to 60 miles an hour maybe more. I had it up in the 90's on the interstate trying to get to that 100mph but before I could it either started beeping at me or something was squealing pretty bad.

 

My next concern is with my check engine light, I had it checked and it said (1)the knock sensor is bad and (2)either it has a vacuum leak or the gas cap isn't tight. I can not find a leak anywhere and I know for damn sure my gas cap is tight. Also my check engine light blinks?

 

The third thing on my list is a loss of oil. I am leaking oil, not too bad but decently I guess. Every time I stop I leave a puddle about the size of an average house sponge, it's somewhere on the right side of the engine below where you actually but the oil in. I know the valve cover is pretty dirty on that side and most things are pretty caked up with oil. I haven't really been checking it I just put a quart in every other day depending on how much I drive it.

 

Next on the list would be my breaks, they are crap. I'm not sure if they're bad or maybe need bled. They stop the car ok but I have to put the pedal on the floor to make them work, it's better if I pump them before I use them, the brake fluid is full and does not leak. Also the emergency break does not work at all. There is absolutely no difference when I pull it.

 

Also my car idles like SHIT. When I first start it up it's really up there for about 10 seconds and kinda sounds like you've got your foot on the gas but then it comes down to about 1200 RPMs until I drive it. The first time I stop at like a stop light or stop sign it goes down to around 200-400 RPMs. It's feels like it's gonna bounce me right out of it.

 

And last is my gas mileage. I'm getting the gas mileage of a large SUV. I just filled it up yesterday, and I've done a lot of running due to christmas but it's been a lot of interstate. I'm at right about a quarter tank now with only a little under 150 miles on the trip.

 

Now I will admit I still haven't done a thing to this. It has the crank pulley wobble which I've put almost 1,000 miles on it like that. It hasn't done any damage that I know of yet, although the wobble isn't as severe as I thought it was at first, it's actually pretty tame. I have called every junk yard within like 50 miles and no one has one. So of course in the next 2 weeks I will being buying a new harmonic balancer. I'm really hoping to save this thing and I wanna do it without completly rebuilding the engine or replacing it. I'd like to one day give it to my daughter when it has around 1,000,000 miles on it. The body is halfway decent I will say, it has you're typical Subaru rust but nothing too serious yet. Just really want some help from some real subaru people. Thanks a bunch in advance, and I'm sorry it was so long.

You're doing pedal-to-floor 0-60 runs and trying to get it up to 100mph with a blinking check engine light and wonder why it's not running very well? I know this isn't a constructive comment, but damn. If your car isn't in good shape the last thing you want to do is flog it.

You're doing pedal-to-floor 0-60 runs and trying to get it up to 100mph with a blinking check engine light and wonder why it's not running very well? I know this isn't a constructive comment, but damn. If your car isn't in good shape the last thing you want to do is flog it.

 

Oh dear lord no. I made up to the 90s on the interstate and it built up to it for a while. I have to put the pedal on the because if I don't I don't make it out any further than 10 mph. The only reason I know it takes so long to get up to 60 is simply because the interstate speed is 70 and if I'm at a dead stop it takes forever to get back to the speed limit. But once I get it up passed about 60 it does real well it cruises excellent at around 70-85 mph. Very smooth nice ride

Ok first of all it's got no power.

timing is off?

did you correct the crank pulley problem?

did you use the correct timing marks?

your knock sensor is bad.

my check engine light, I had it checked and it said (1)the knock sensor is bad and (2)either it has a vacuum leak

both od these will steal power.

a bad knock sensor will retard the timing to the safest, no knock position to prevent damage, also no power.

a vac leak just steals power, find the leak. check the filler neck for the gas tank.

I am leaking oil, not too bad but decently on the right side of the engine below where you actually but the oil in.

it could be the cam shaft seal,

did you look at them, or replace them when you did the timing belt?

or it probably the valve cover gasket.

buy some brake clean spray, several cans, and clean the bottom of your engine.

then check it every day to see where it gets oily first.

have to put the pedal on the floor to make them work, it's better if I pump them before I use them,

bleed the brakes, or even better, flush the old fliud and then bleed the brakes.

the hand brake shoes may be shot,

but it sounds like maybe they need adjusting or may even be disconnected.

Also my car idles like SHIT.

you have a vac leak, or your timing is off?

I'm getting the gas mileage of a large SUV.

of course, your car runs like crap, your knock sensor is bad,

you have some sort of air intake leak, and very probably your timing is off.

there is no way the computer can make this engine run efficiently under these conditions.

 

replace the knock sensor, $15 on ebay.

look for the air leak, find it and fix it.

check you timing, adjust as needed.

and if you have not done so recently, new plugs and wires.

then check your mileage.

Oh dear lord no. I made up to the 90s on the interstate and it built up to it for a while. I have to put the pedal on the because if I don't I don't make it out any further than 10 mph. The only reason I know it takes so long to get up to 60 is simply because the interstate speed is 70 and if I'm at a dead stop it takes forever to get back to the speed limit. But once I get it up passed about 60 it does real well it cruises excellent at around 70-85 mph. Very smooth nice ride

 

Ah, that makes more sense. Sorry for assuming

Thanks for all the useful information. I started to think maybe my timing is off like johnegg said. However, I found an old can of seafoam in my father in law's building and though, why not give it a shot. Now the can was only about 2/3 full and they say to use about 2 cans. Anyhow I put a little in the gas tank, a little in the oil, and then in the vacuum line. It's didn't die despite drowning it in seafoam I had to shut it off. When I started it back up there was one HELL of a smoke show, I can't imagine what it would've been like using 2 cans. Anyhow, the difference is unbelievable. It has so much power now then it did before. I no longer have to hold the gas to the floor to get it to take off. It's still not 100% but much better than before.

Also the more I look at it the more I'm wondering if the crank pulley is actually wobbling. It seems very tame. I'm gonna try to post a vid later if this site will let me.

If you put that in your oil and intake you might want to do an oil change and possibly spark plugs. The seafoam is like a degreaser it breaks oils and carbon down, you may have watered your oil down. I know it wasn't a whole can but that stuff is pretty powerful. It's recommended that you put some in the oil 100 miles prior to a regular oil change, and that you replace the spark plugs because of fouling later on since you washed everything in the upper cylinders.

If you put that in your oil and intake you might want to do an oil change and possibly spark plugs. The seafoam is like a degreaser it breaks oils and carbon down, you may have watered your oil down. I know it wasn't a whole can but that stuff is pretty powerful. It's recommended that you put some in the oil 100 miles prior to a regular oil change, and that you replace the spark plugs because of fouling later on since you washed everything in the upper cylinders.

 

Thanks a bunch for the tip, I've read before that it's highly recommended to change the oil shortly after, I've never heard of the spark plugs though, either way I planned to do both this coming week.

Cool noticeable improvements ahead