Service -- not feelin'in the love --- should I ?

Ok, we have owned the 2015 Outback for 10 days. I e-mailed the sales guy with an after purchase question and he has not returned my e-mail. Plus there was a small dent in the one door (a door ding from another car) and the dent guy that the dealer was supposed to send out has yet to show up. I've e-mailed several times.

When we test drove the car the brake pedal was low, like air in the lines. After test drive they took the car into service, bled the brakes, test drove again and the pedal was fine.

The car was State inspected on June 18th and we purchased the car on June 25th. What mechanic would have put an inspection sticker on the car with a mushy, low pedal? Plus this is a CPO car and the inspection report says the rear pads are 6 which is darn close to 50%, which is where they are to be changed for CPO.

This car was a lease, supposedly a leased car of the woman that lived next door to the sales guy. I would have guessed that as a lease servicing would have been done at the dealer. I just called the service department and asked if all software upgrades have been done to the car. Their response .... we can't check, you must bring the car in for a service appointment. What? Our two Volvo's can be accessed by VIN and the Volvo dealers (as part of happy customer service) will look up the VIN and tell me if any upgrades are available.

So she puts me on hold and comes back to say that because I just bought the car they will hook up the car for free. Ok....I'll go with that but I'm wondering if I am being snookered. The up-date check is free but then to apply the update is going to cost $125???

Since she is the service manager I asked her to look at the mechanic notes about the brakes. She read them to me -- brakes checked, pads ok, bled brakes. So my next question was of course, brakes are a sealed system so how did air get into them? She says -- I don't know.

ok, I'm a car guy, she is a service manager and she could at least give me her thoughts on the matter. I have my theory....she has no theories.

The reason I say not feel'in the love is that in 2016 we bought a car from a big dealer in the area. The purchase experience and after purchase was great. The Honda we bought from them was serviced by them and we received all service records. Their carfax showed servicing records, etc. The carfax from our Outback shows not one service record reported by the Subaru dealer. The 2016 dealer went out of the way to prevent any after purchase remorse. We had an Outback picked out at the 2016 dealer but they aren't a Subbie dealer and couldn't give the CPO on the car. I am having a bit of buyers remorse thinking that maybe we should have forgone the CPO warranty and just gone with the 2016 Honda dealer?

Sorry this post was so long but if there is one thing that gets me ticked off is when people don't return questions. I can handle the answers but it is the non-communication that will tick me off.

True. I'm accustomed to corporations that have leased cars and for convenience, necessity (required maintenance schedules) and value when the car goes off lease, the company requires the employee to go to the dealers do for work.

But yep - you care correct and individual may not act in the same manner.

I can't really help much but it's a bad assumption to think that because the car was leased that the maintenance was done at the dealer. I've leased 5 cars and the only time they saw the dealer for service was for warranty work.

So just in case I need it, I called SOA and have a case number.

Dealers, ya gotta watch um. Our Volvo had an extended warranty on the PCV system (yes it is a system and hard to repair). To replace the intake has to come off and a bunch of other bits but it was covered at 100% warranty. After picking up from the dealer I checked (I always check) the work. Well wouldn't you know it but the PCV hose was hard as a rock, they didn't change it. SO I called them and they said they only replace parts that they feel are necessary. I said, Volvo is paying you to replace all the parts and the labor to replace ALL parts. He said, bring it back in and we will do it. Who knows if they replaced the intake O rings but the job looked complete. When I picked up the car, they gave me a $50 gift card. Probably to keep my mouth shut so I didn't call Volvo of America. But imagine how many warranty replacements they did for people who didn't know what to check for and they received payment for doing something they didn't do. Sigh!

This sucks and I am sorry for your less than stellar experience. Call SOA and see if they'll do anything for you, 800-782-2783.

So just in case I need it, I called SOA and have a case number.

 

Dealers, ya gotta watch um. Our Volvo had an extended warranty on the PCV system (yes it is a system and hard to repair). To replace the intake has to come off and a bunch of other bits but it was covered at 100% warranty. After picking up from the dealer I checked (I always check) the work. Well wouldn't you know it but the PCV hose was hard as a rock, they didn't change it. SO I called them and they said they only replace parts that they feel are necessary. I said, Volvo is paying you to replace all the parts and the labor to replace ALL parts. He said, bring it back in and we will do it. Who knows if they replaced the intake O rings but the job looked complete. When I picked up the car, they gave me a $50 gift card. Probably to keep my mouth shut so I didn't call Volvo of America. But imagine how many warranty replacements they did for people who didn't know what to check for and they received payment for doing something they didn't do. Sigh!

Excellent.

Well now I am even finding more things that have me worried. The coolant recovery tank is at or below the L mark. Either (1.) the dealer didn't top off the coolant or (2.) in less than 300 miles I've used coolant. If it is the second I am not going to be a happy camper.

Also looking at the CPO check list I see that the dealer didn't check mark Change oil filter or change engine oil #6 and #8). Why not?

I'm including a picture of the oil filter that to me doesn't look like a filter that was just supposedly installed on June 17th and has less than 300 miles on it.

Ha getting anal here discussing clean / dirty oil filters. If I weren't finding discrepancies I wouldn't be looking at such things.

I am not a photographer and I fear that the oil filter picture doesn't clearly illustrate what I am trying to explain. Or maybe they just have filters that have some kind of odd dirt on the top and sides. Who knows?

Excellent.

Never ever never never never buy an off lease car.

It's a minor step up from a rental.

Never ever never never never buy an off lease car.

 

It's a minor step up from a rental.

Not sure you can generalize. People who buy cars I've turned in off lease get well maintained and cared for cars. That said, any used car is a bit of a crap shoot, leased or not. Always buy used from a new car dealer and get the extended warranty (certified) to minimize the risk.

Like I said before I am familiar with corporate leases and the home office tells you to get the car serviced. I am sure that there are people with individual leases that beat the cars but in the end, damage outside of wear and tear the lessee will pay for. So if that car dies during your lease period because you didn't get the oil changed, you will be paying for that car.

With the lease, there is a reason that the car is sitting on the lot. With a non-leased car you just have to wonder why the car is sitting on the lot. Were the people tired of the car or is there something else wrong with the car.

We'll see how this all plays out with this dealer.

Not sure you can generalize. People who buy cars I've turned in off lease get well maintained and cared for cars. That said, any used car is a bit of a crap shoot, leased or not. Always buy used from a new car dealer and get the extended warranty (certified) to minimize the risk.

Well now I am even finding more things that have me worried. The coolant recovery tank is at or below the L mark. Either (1.) the dealer didn't top off the coolant or (2.) in less than 300 miles I've used coolant. If it is the second I am not going to be a happy camper.

 

Also looking at the CPO check list I see that the dealer didn't check mark Change oil filter or change engine oil #6 and #8). Why not?

 

I'm including a picture of the oil filter that to me doesn't look like a filter that was just supposedly installed on June 17th and has less than 300 miles on it.

 

Ha getting anal here discussing clean / dirty oil filters. If I weren't finding discrepancies I wouldn't be looking at such things.

 

I am not a photographer and I fear that the oil filter picture doesn't clearly illustrate what I am trying to explain. Or maybe they just have filters that have some kind of odd dirt on the top and sides. Who knows?

They are not claiming to have done an oil change or installed a new filter. The document you posted shows that neither the oil nor filter was changed.

Never ever never never never buy an off lease car.

 

It's a minor step up from a rental.

I got my 14 as a 19k lease return, it was immaculate...only issues I have had were the direct result of Subaru dealer tech screwups.

dealer could not diag p0171... I ultimately fixed it.

dealer cracked front differential housing, trans replaced at 40k

I swapped in a 20mm rsb, ford led fogs from a mustang, instrument cluster from a limited model

next up hid

oem tires made it 40k

I am going to the dealer today to have a talk.

The coolant recovery tank is 98% empty and there was no way anyone checked it or topped it off during the inspection.

I dropped the ball on this one because I usually check things a lot more when I buy a car. I was relying on their small promise, a promise that this car is certified used, it went through an extensive check, etc.

Last night I shined a flashlight down into the coolant recovery tanks and tried my best to take a picture of how low the coolant is in the bottle. The pictures aren't very good but you can see how far down at the bottom the blue coolant sits.

They are not claiming to have done an oil change or installed a new filter. The document you posted shows that neither the oil nor filter was changed.

So I am one of those 65 year old guys that has changed his own engines, I do most all my own work and have done so for my entire driving life.

I was 16 when I had my neighbor bring his backhoe to life out a Volvo P544 engine out so that I could install a new one.

Took the car to the dealer today and one thing that ticks me off is when I tell these service managers that I know about cars and they proceed to lie to me. They put coolant in the car but when they came to tell me it was finished the service manager and another manager something came out to talk to me. Felt like I was being tag teamed.

Manager says we had to let the engine cool a bit and the coolant level did come up to almost the L. I didn't say it but I was thinking BS!!!! I left it sit all night and it didn't come up and this morning it was still almost an empty bottle. manager says, in the summertime if the coolant is below the low level, they don't top it off for fear of it bubbling out of the recovery tank. My response was that if you can't fill the coolant recovery bottle to spec without having the bottle burp out the coolant....well you have more than a low coolant problem going on. He just stared at me.

He swears they changed the filter and oil. The reason is because there is a sticker on the windshield.

I told him that during the initial road test the brake pedal went almost to the floor and I think if I would have kept my foot on the pedal it would have made it to the floor. I said the tech bled the brakes and everything was ok.

I told him because it is a sealed system, I wonder how air got into the lines. Service manager says, it is impossible to get air in the lines so I was not correct. I said so you are going to argue with me? I said that the day of the test drive, the tech said that there was air in the lines.

Manager also said that although the pads are at 6 (50%) they didn't change them. I said so I am a silly millimeter off or maybe the tech guy is a millimeter off? No response.

I don't think I bought a problem car, at least I hope not. I am just complaining about the people involved and what they did or didn't do for the CPO inspection. When it comes to doing what they say they did, I can say this, the place we bought our Honda CR-V from smokes this dealer.

It will be interesting to see how things go at my July 11th appointment for software upgrades. In my area if you buy a certified used Volvo (we had two) the dealer does any software upgrades before they put it out on the lot.

This isn't the first time I've seen a CPO car in this type of condition. Some service depts. are great, but some really just don't care.

It's possible that you got air in the brake system by a sloppy brake fluid replacement.

Another reason for mushy brakes is the calipers sticking to the guiding pins - a relatively easy fix since it usually only requires a cleaning and re-greasing of the pins and some time.

Maybe but the dealer didn't say anything about changing the fluid flush but the brake fluid looks very, very clean.

It's possible that you got air in the brake system by a sloppy brake fluid replacement.

 

 

Another reason for mushy brakes is the calipers sticking to the guiding pins - a relatively easy fix since it usually only requires a cleaning and re-greasing of the pins and some time.

Maybe but the dealer didn't say anything about changing the fluid flush but the brake fluid looks very, very clean.

Check the service book - I think it's listed as part of ordinary service for certain mileages/times.

Then with a bit over 36,000 someone may have flushed the fluid. But for some reason the dealer, who is the dealer that previously leased the car, doesn't want to come forward with any maintenance they did to the car.

I really can't see the woman that was leasing the car taking it for a brake fluid flush, to someone outside the dealer, so near to the time her lease was up. I'd say most people don't even know about flushing brake fluid. I probably do it more than others and flush @ every 2.5 years (I driver @ 10,000 a year).

Very odd but I like that the fluid looks nice and clean.

"They" say that brake fluid should be flushed and filled every 30K miles. Personally, unless you drive very hard, I usually wait to at least 45K before even thinking about it.

The car was State inspected on June 18th and we purchased the car on June 25th. What mechanic would have put an inspection sticker on the car with a mushy, low pedal?

State inspections are not even worth the dam paper that they get printed on. Its just a way for the govt to stick their hand into your pocket and hassle you.

Plus this is a CPO car and the inspection report says the rear pads are 6 which is darn close to 50%, which is where they are to be changed for CPO.

There is really no reason to change the pads at 50%. Its wasted material. You could negotiate a better price on the car as you'll need to change the pads sooner.

This car was a lease, supposedly a leased car of the woman that lived next door to the sales guy. I would have guessed that as a lease servicing would have been done at the dealer. I just called the service department and asked if all software upgrades have been done to the car. Their response .... we can't check, you must bring the car in for a service appointment. What? Our two Volvo's can be accessed by VIN and the Volvo dealers (as part of happy customer service) will look up the VIN and tell me if any upgrades are available.

I was told that they don't provide that info for security and privacy reasons. If you get your my subaru account and add your vehicles VIN, it still won't show any previous info. It does not mean that SOA does not have that info. They just won't give it to you.

The easiest way to have this info is to ask for the dealer to print it for you, before you buy the car.

Then with a bit over 36,000 someone may have flushed the fluid. But for some reason the dealer, who is the dealer that previously leased the car, doesn't want to come forward with any maintenance they did to the car.

 

I really can't see the woman that was leasing the car taking it for a brake fluid flush, to someone outside the dealer, so near to the time her lease was up. I'd say most people don't even know about flushing brake fluid. I probably do it more than others and flush @ every 2.5 years (I driver @ 10,000 a year).

 

Very odd but I like that the fluid looks nice and clean.

The previous owner of the car could have done it somewhere else as a part of a packaged deal. I know of a few small shops that will prepare the car for a lease return.

Its definitely frustrating purchasing a CPO vehicle and then spotting a few red flags. I would just change the brake pads and brake fluid. Its something that you would do later, and right now its bothering you... so might as well get it done early and try to enjoy the car.

Maybe it was done by a shop that will prepare for a lease return by taking care of maintenance/ service requirements. Probably be a lot less costly than taking it to a dealer. I just don't like how the dealer pretends that they are so confused about all this? Just tell me, "hey by the way the fluid looks we think the PO had the brake fluid flushed or --- oh yes, we flushed the fluid before selling the car, etc."

I'm not saying I don't like the car, I just find it kind of weird.

The previous owner of the car could have done it somewhere else as a part of a packaged deal. I know of a few small shops that will prepare the car for a lease return.

 

Its definitely frustrating purchasing a CPO vehicle and then spotting a few red flags. I would just change the brake pads and brake fluid. Its something that you would do later, and right now its bothering you... so might as well get it done early and try to enjoy the car.

If she came back to lease another car, I am certain the dealer did not ask her one question about the maintenance on her current car. All they would care is to get another new car out the door.

As discussed above she could of gotten 10K jiffy lube oil changes and did min required maintenance. (Most people who lease usually follow manufacturers recommendations)

OP, I would of asked for service docs and requested some of the stuff to be done before delivery.

Having said all of that, you can easily top the coolant off and brakes appear to have still some time left. I would get the flushed for good measure if you think there is air in the system.

Enjoy your new car and find a better dealer or a good indy.