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2017 Legacy is very unstable at highway speeds


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I'm not the guy that posted that and I know nothing about the laws here or anywhere else. But...

 

We as drivers look at this as if my speedo says I'm doing 50 and I'm really doing 60 (understated), that's bad. I could get a ticket.

 

However, when looking at laws, they think differently. If you're speedo says' you're doing 60 and you're really doing 50 (overstating), that means that your odometer is also overstating. And that means that instead of your warranty being 36,000 miles your warranty is now only 30,000 real miles. Or, if it's a 36,000 mile lease, you get cheated out of 6,000 miles. To a lawmaker, that's bad.

 

That's a very interesting comment. Despite my recent research on speedometers themselves, I had not considered the point you have raised. After reading your post I have consulted Doctor Google and it seems the answer is not the same for all vehicles. The first link below appears to support your comments 100% .... but the others following, seem to indicate that there are exceptions to your theory.

 

http://pugetsoundblogs.com/roadwarrior/2006/02/15/are-vehicle-odometers-accurate/

 

 

https://www.quora.com/Does-the-speedometer-and-odometer-work-in-tandem

 

And finally, this last website contains the following paragraph ...

 

" .. The odometer, which directly reflects what the sensors are recording, doesn't have the same built-in inaccuracy as the speedometer. If your speedometer is off, it doesn't necessarily follow that the odometer is inaccurate too ..."

 

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/globe-drive/culture/commuting/why-you-may-not-be-driving-as-fast-as-you-think/article11487709/

 

Thanks for the post, I'd be interested in what others on the forum think.

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The difference here is that the odometer can be optimized to be as correct as possible and land in the top of the statistical bell curve where you have 50% of the vehicles showing less and 50% showing more than actual distance. That to account for the wear and variations in tire sizes the car is approved for.

 

 

 

For the speedometer it's bad if it shows too little so generally it's designed to show more than the actual speed, sometimes up to 10% more. So in those cases it's more like it's showing too much for like 95% or even more of all cases.

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  • 10 months later...
Since my 2018 Legacy 3.6r ( fully loaded) was unstable in handing at 65+ on highway, sold it last December and purchased CPO Hyundai Genesis 3.8 AWD Ultimate model. Took a 2,000 plus road trip to Florida in January through all sorts of very poor weather and it was rock steady. No buffeting, etc. Feel infinitely safer driving this vehicle and do not miss the Legacy at all. I was very disappointed with the Legacy, to say the least. Perhaps my Legacy had some flaw that was not able to be detected by the dealer, but I had two prior Subarus (both Foresters) and each had mechanical and design flaws, so I will never again consider a Subaru. Three times burned is enough. I have put 7000 miles on my Genesis since purchases, and have encountered absolutely no issues. The overall build quality appears vastly superior to the Legacy.
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Since my 2018 Legacy 3.6r ( fully loaded) was unstable in handing at 65+ on highway, sold it last December and purchased CPO Hyundai Genesis 3.8 AWD Ultimate model. Took a 2,000 plus road trip to Florida in January through all sorts of very poor weather and it was rock steady. No buffeting, etc. Feel infinitely safer driving this vehicle and do not miss the Legacy at all. I was very disappointed with the Legacy, to say the least. Perhaps my Legacy had some flaw that was not able to be detected by the dealer, but I had two prior Subarus (both Foresters) and each had mechanical and design flaws, so I will never again consider a Subaru. Three times burned is enough. I have put 7000 miles on my Genesis since purchases, and have encountered absolutely no issues. The overall build quality appears vastly superior to the Legacy.

 

Sometimes, this is what you have to do, move on. Nice choice, I rather like the Genesis.

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In USA is the Genesis in the same ballpark price as a Legacy?

 

Quickly comparing brand new MSRP's at a glance it looks like the Legacy will run right around $34k while the Genesis will be around $40k for about as similar equipment packages and set up (AWD/Horsepower) as you can get. For a sedan, I would call that a higher price range since it is where a lot of the luxury brands start.

 

Note: This is for the G70 with AWD and the "elite" package compared to a fully loaded Legacy. The G80 starts at $42k.

 

Interestingly, they charge $3,000 more for a manual transmission option which is normally cheaper on other brands (if even offered).

Edited by crudzinskas
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I have a 2018 3.6r and have no stability problems, I drive on long trips at 70-85 mph. I did change out the rasb to 20mm right after I bought the car so I don't know what it was like with the smaller stock bar.

 

What's done is done for this guy and he's happy now. But I did the same thing as you the day I brought the car home with a fatter RSB. Never seemed to wander except when pushed by a semitruck air dam (everything does). I also had the TSB spring replacement in the rack to fix a rattle and it seemed to snug up the steering feel ever so slightly (maybe just in my head).

 

I've put 18,000 miles on my Legacy 3.6R since I brought it home in June - a lot of highway miles. Loved every mile.

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  • 1 month later...
This past long July 4th weekend, my wife & I drove to Stowe VT (& then home on Sunday). 325 miles one way hitting speeds up to 90 mph. No wandering steering, no unstable car. I am surprised I still have brakes after that trip as I had to do some hard braking, but they seem OK (37,7xx miles on car).
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Hello again. I think the problem is in different roads/highways that we use.

 

I started this thread in 2017 and since then have driven 4 times to Colorado Springs from Chicago using I-80. Most of the I-80 between Chicago and Nebraska is heavily used by trucks, however once I enter Colorado and go on I-76 I think portion that is not used by heavy trucks car is very stable. This did not happen once it repeats every time I hit that road car is very stable. So in my opinion our cars are very sensitive to the inperfections in the road. So depending on the road you use our opinions will be different. If someone else can confirm using I-80 from Chicago to Colorado let me know if you noticed same problems.

 

I also have 21mm rear sway bar and perrin steering dampener lock or whatever is called :)

 

Suggestion for all: Please if you do not notice any issues with stability please say which highway you used and rough location, so that others that live in the same area with noticeable stability issues can try their cars and confirm my experience mentioned above. This can help us who are taking future road trips to also try to select that part of the highway and try to finally figure out what is happening.

Edited by aki334
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The only highway I've noticed any feeling of sensitive steering on is NC540 between NC55 and US64 in Cary/Apex, NC. The way they textured the pavement on that stretch of highway "pulls" randomly on car tires. I noticed it on my BRZ and my wife's Forester as well.
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I've never noticed anything like this in my 19 sport, except when I had to swerve 2 lanes over to avoid a bad wreck at 75mph... 18" wheels, stock lousy Goodyears... back end felt like it wanted to whip around, but didn't.

 

Sent from my SM-N950U using Tapatalk

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  • 2 weeks later...
  • 1 month later...

I had some free time and took the car for free alignment check. In the wheel alignment place I did not go to the waiting room but instead decided to watch from behind the yellow line the screen as the tech was checking the alignment. Once everything was setup, I noticed that the screen had everything in green except one red. Tech approached me and said that FR is out of spec (.10 degree toe in ). While thinking that the .10 degree of toe in is not much especially when the car is loaded and under the acceleration, I still said "sure do the alignment". And then I could not believe the difference. Tested the car for 500 miles great feel. I will post the alignment specs that I had and currently have. The car only has 16K on the odometer because it was not fun to drive at all. I was really thinking I am wasting my garage space with this POS it is not fun to drive at all and was thinking to trade it. Now I like it and will invest in more mods to make it even more fun. My current upgrades are: 20mm rear sway bar and pereen steering dampener - yes it fits.

 

So gentlemen: lets share screen shots of our alignment specs and say if your new alignment settings made a big improvement for you in the steering feel so we can try to copy similar numbers the next time we go for alignment.

 

In conclusion: do not think that if the car you bought is brand new that it is perfect. So what I think was happening is that the FR was fighting the rest 3 wheels that were going straight and that that was confusing steering torque sensor to constantly give imputs to the motor for steering assistance making it very very light and in constant need for micro steering adjustments which was very tiring and not fun at all for long trips. Now I can literally let the steering wheel out of my hands at 80mph and will tract straight. If you do not have that feeling then something is not right.

 

Lets please share the screen shots of our previous alignment specs and our current specs and talk about how and if any improvements we noticed.

Edited by aki334
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  • 2 months later...

Update: just got back from 1200 mile trip and was very disappointed. I think our cars have serious problems with suspension setup. Who ever says I do not feel any problems is not driving on the problematic highways. Try taking I-70 eastbound from Colorado and go east towards Chicago. I have to say it is embarrassing watching small cars like focuses and Jettas and Hyundai moving 80mph + in crosswinds while my car is going like I am drunk if I want to keep up with them. Research it is not only legacy it is outbacks, imprezas, foresters all of them. Even my son at one point said look at that little focus sims like it is not bothering him at all.

bottom line: 20mm rsb, pereen steering lock will not help you at all in this situations.

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I think our cars have serious problems with suspension setup.

Of course, that fails to consider all the Gen 6 Legacys (and their drivers) that don't experience stability problems.

 

Try taking I-70 eastbound from Colorado and go east towards Chicago.
I've driven my 2015 Legacy on I-70 between Denver and Kansas City numerous times, including up to 45 mph gusty crosswinds, dodging tumbleweeds, without a problem. Yes, the Legacy reacts to strong wind gusts, but no more than any other vehicle I have driven over the years. Edited by ammcinnis

"If you don't know where you're going, any road will take you there." ~ The Cheshire Cat (Alice in Wonderland)

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I drove about 800 miles over the Thanksgiving break, including ~200 miles on I-40 through NC during a very strong wind/rain storm that passed through on Wednesday. My 18 Legacy didn't have any issues with crosswinds or varied tarmac conditions at any time during the trip.
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I drove over 400 miles north on I79 then East on I80 and back during the Sunday storm. Took my daughter back to college....wind, snow, freezing rain....no problems at all. In fact, 1st time I made that trip in my 16 Legacy in nasty weather. Never felt more confident making that trip.
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I have a non-standard alignment on my '17 Outback 2.5i: 0 toe and -0.5* camber at all 4 corners (Moog camber adjustable arms in rear, and a camber bolt in front). It makes a world of difference! The stock alignment with no front camber and -1.5* rear camber plus some rear toe understeers like a pig - the setup is undoubtedly intended to prevent even the most inept from ever provoking oversteer. The car is transformed with the new alignment, turning in easily and drifting at the limit instead of plowing.

 

 

I have other mods also:

 

 

1) Continental 245/50-19 DWS-06 tires on Enkei 19x8 Raijin wheels (45 mm offset)

 

 

 

2) Whiteline 24 mm front and 22 mm rear adjustable sway bars, both set on soft

 

 

3) Perrin steering damper lockdown

 

 

4) Philips Vision Plus bulbs for high- and low-beam, and fogs - much brighter and whiter than OEM

 

 

The smaller-than-stock offset of the wheels maintains clearances with the wider tires (no rubbing), and the performance of the DWS-06 is far better than the OEM tires, especially on snow. I also highly recommend the Philips bulbs for much better lighting for little cost.

 

 

Once Bilstein makes struts/shocks for the Legacy, I'll swap out the OEMs and drop the ride height a couple of inches while improving the handling. A side benefit is that getting the kayaks loaded will be a lot easier - the roof is a bit too tall to make it easy.

 

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Edited by ronemus
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Update: just got back from 1200 mile trip and was very disappointed. I think our cars have serious problems with suspension setup. Who ever says I do not feel any problems is not driving on the problematic highways. Try taking I-70 eastbound from Colorado and go east towards Chicago. I have to say it is embarrassing watching small cars like focuses and Jettas and Hyundai moving 80mph + in crosswinds while my car is going like I am drunk if I want to keep up with them. Research it is not only legacy it is outbacks, imprezas, foresters all of them. Even my son at one point said look at that little focus sims like it is not bothering him at all.

bottom line: 20mm rsb, pereen steering lock will not help you at all in this situations.

 

In a recent post in the thread "What's the furthest from Home you've taken your Legacy" george 2493 stated that he did a 3 month trip and almost doubled your journey distance .... after giving his Legacy a workout like that, I would be very interested in his views as to whether he also feels "our cars have serious problems with suspension setup."

 

Here is his post ...

 

" ... I did a 3 month trip this summer all across North America. I live in New Jersey. I drove down to Georgia, out to Colorado and Utah, THEN Wyoming, Idaho, Montana, through Alberta, British Columbia and Yukon Territory, then hit anchorage and homer Alaska, then same route back to Utah, then to Texas, New Mexico, Nevada, back to Utah and Colorado, then back to Jersey. 21,000 miles in my 2.5 legacy. Camped out of her the whole time. Best I averaged was 37mpg and 620 miles in one tank ..."

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