Mods that require a tune?

Ive heard that with any slight mod, you need to do a tune (exhaust, intake, etc.) I also heard that, even stock, you should have the LGT tuned because the stock tune can cause issues.

My concerns: does the stock tune really cause issues? If so, what issues? Also, is it necessary to have a tune if you have any kind of mod done to your car? And if tuned, is the SI Drive still usable?

 

All ive got done right now is a muffler and resonator delete. So I wasnt too worried about getting a tune, but want to make sure nothing is going to happen if I dont get a tune eventually. I plan on doing a catless uppipe and high flow catted downpipe as my next mod.

yes

Hi,

 

Welcome to the forum, the first steps everyone will probably tell you is go through the various sections of the forum and the Sticky's....you'll get a lot of info with that.

 

You can also check out Cryotune's FB site (https://www.facebook.com/cryotuneperformance ) they've recently posted some interesting comparisons between stock map, COBB OTS (Off The Shelf) map and Custom tune maps.....you'll be surprised!!

 

In short, yes just about any mod (exhaust, intake, turbo, etc...) will require a tune to get the maximum benefits and avoid running lean which will lead to engine failure and even for better MPG. I also believe the SI drive can be used to switch between 2 maps (I don't have that in my 2005)....example: 1 map used for commute driving for better mpg (say 10psi) and then when you want to have some fun you switch to Map 2 (16psi and max tuning).

 

I think most would also recommend to start by ensuring you car is in top shape order before adding any mods and tuning.....no sense adding a bunch of bolt-on's if your car can't handle the added hp/tq. Check if you have any leaks (oil, coolant, evap/vacuum, exhaust), not sure if this is applicable for 2008 however there was a well known issue with the banjo bolt which feeds oil to the turbo....there's a filter which would get clogged and restrict oil to the turbo causing it to fail. Make sure you have adequate brakes and suspension, bushings, timing belt and components, ensure any recalls were done, change fluids (tranny / diff) depending on when it was last done, and the list goes on....I would highly recommend having a leak and compression test done to ensure your engine is in good condition.

 

You might also be interested by starting with a COBB Accessport which will provide you with a bunch of maps to support with Stage 1 & 2 upgrades, you get the added benefit of viewing in real time your ECU readings and can also datalog them along with other "bells and whistles".

 

Hope this helps a little, enjoy reading and take it 1 step at a time....you'll enjoy the experience much more and you'll avoid spending lots of $$$.

 

 

Cheers,

If you’re not sure how old the spark plugs are install new ones before the tune

you mod, you tune...

 

 

so on...

 

good luck.

Oh don't waste your money on a CAI the one the car came with is hard to beat.

Not required for safety with your current mods. Factory tune can still handle an uppipe change, but you will absolutely have to get a tune for a downpipe.

 

Factory tune is a bit too lean for most folks, although it helps emissions. A simple stage 1 from Cobb would be fine for you if you want a set it and forget plan until the downpipe.

 

I also strongly recommend XRT tuning, if you want remote tuning.

Awesome thanks guys. About 4k miles ago the short block was replaced at the dealership (just before i bought it.) Only thing that went wrong so far was my ocv's. Replaced them and havent had any issues since. The short block included a nee turbo and timing chain. Think I need to have a compression test done with the new engine? Also, the only reason I was considering a pro tune as opposed to the accessport is the cost. Ive also heard a pro tune may be better for thr car, rather than the accessport. But if you guys have experience with the accessport and think its the way to go, then ill go ahead with that. The price isnt too much different between the two and I do like the option of different maps.

Were the heads rebuilt when the short block was installed ?

 

If not a compression test may be a good idea.

 

Do you see any shiny stuff in the oil when you change it ?

 

Send a oil sample off to Blackstone Labs, google them. If the sample comes back clean, no metal, you should be safe.

 

Cobb AP is good if your not good with a Lap Top. The two recommended Tuners, Mike of tuningalliance@gmail.com or Dave at Cryo if your on the west coast. I think both may offer a tune and Cobb AP special, or they have in the past.

 

If you use Mike tell him I sent you to him. He has a real day time job so he may take a day or so to get back to you, but trust me, there is no one else I would let tune my car. He is that great.

 

If your good with a Lap Top you can try open source tuning with them. Read about this stuff in the Tuning Forum here.

Awesome thanks guys. About 4k miles ago the short block was replaced at the dealership (just before i bought it.) Only thing that went wrong so far was my ocv's. Replaced them and havent had any issues since. The short block included a nee turbo and timing chain.

 

LGT is a timing belt, not a chain, that needs to be replaced every 105,000 miles or 105 months whichever comes first.

Will have to call the dealership and see about the heads, but the oil looks good. Wouldnt hurt to get a test done though. I think that AP will be good for me after I ensure everything is safe and reliable.

Also inspect the spark plugs - they shall all look identical. It's a diagnostic trick that is overlooked today when people read codes and takes a guess. Before codes you had to use ears, look at plugs and do test drives to narrow down engine problems.

 

 

Also clean the MAF and make sure that all hoses are OK so you don't have any vacuum or boost leaks before doing any tune.

Oh yea, zip-tie all the vacuum hoses, they can blow off under boost. A lot of us early on, learned that the hard way.

Personally I wouldn't zip-tie them, I'd use real hose clamps instead.

 

 

A matter of taste though.

 

 

http://www.bedug.com/pics/Fun4/HoseClamp.jpg

Gear clamps aren't actually that great. They don't create uniform pressure on the hose (due the flat section containing the gear) which can cause leaks. They can cut into the hose or have the rubber squish into the slots (usually due to over tightening). And they supposiedly can loosen over time, though I've never had that happen to me.

 

There is good reason why you don't seem them used by OEM's.

 

Spring clamps are good, and usually what OEM's use.

https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon.com/images/I/717EmYVU5VL._SX425_.jpg

 

These type are also good

 

http://www.hps-siliconehoses.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/650x/040ec09b1e35df139433887a97daa66f/f/i/fic_2.jpg

 

Both are frequently referred to as fuel line clamps.

 

Zip-ties can be good enough as they are decent at putting equal pressure around the hose and usually you are just trying to compress the hose enough after the flare just to prevent the hose from sliding off. The actual seal is on the flare itself.

Gear clamps aren't flat at the gear, they are actually rounded, at least the decent ones. And you have to pick the right size.

 

 

 

The real reason for OEMs to not use them is money. The spring version is cheaper.

 

 

I have never seen the leak issue due to a gear clamp, but I have seen it due to aged hoses, rusted to death clamps, badly tensioned clamps, wire clamps that cuts the hose and lack of clamps.

 

 

Maybe it's because I grew up on a farm I don't trust the cheaper alternatives - there you want the hoses to stay in place with no doubt of it coming off. When you finally need to get the hose off you might need a knife though.

I never through of securing the vacuum hoses. Much appreciated advise guys. I think the first thing ill do is secure the hoses and replace the plugs and wires. Anyobe know of any benefits with upgrading the coil? Ive heard some controversy on this topic, not sure how well these engines react to them.

Then im going to have my exhaust welded with some new tips. Then will look into picking up an accessport.

 

Sent from my LG-H910 using Tapatalk

These cars don't have plug wires. they are coil on plug. Stock coils are fine. I still have the ones the car came with.

 

make sure the air filter is clean, the MAF sensor is clean, new NGK plugs. Make sure the two ground wires from the heads to the chassis are in good shape. To make your own new ones is easy, just get some good wire and terminals, crimp the them and seal the crimp with RTV. Wire brush the chassis where you'll attach the wires.

These cars don't have plug wires. they are coil on plug. Stock coils are fine. I still have the ones the car came with.

 

make sure the air filter is clean, the MAF sensor is clean, new NGK plugs. Make sure the two ground wires from the heads to the chassis are in good shape. To make your own new ones is easy, just get some good wire and terminals, crimp the them and seal the crimp with RTV. Wire brush the chassis where you'll attach the wires.

 

Funny you mention the grounds, I recently noticed 1 of mine is torn in half and the other doesn't look in great shape.

 

What gauge wire would you recommend using....I'm guessing I could use some battery ground wire I have laying around?

 

Thanks,

high quality zip ties like Thomas and Bett's work really well for securing vac lines. also Turkeylords blue tee replacement is always a good idea if you're going for higher boost levels than stock.

 

http://www.company23.com/VacuumT

To get back to the original question of what mods require a tune I’d suggest looking at it from a different approach. Subaru and other OEMs are bound by emissions regulations and the calibrations often reflect that. Even with a stock car I would be looking at ways to improve the tune which ultimately may increase the power and efficiency.

 

But before you worry about tuning the car I’d make sure it is healthy, like the others have suggested. Do all the normal maintenance and maybe consider a compression check and cylinder leakage check to insure you’re starting with a good engine rather than trying to mask the symptoms of a bad engine with tuning.

Funny you mention the grounds, I recently noticed 1 of mine is torn in half and the other doesn't look in great shape.

 

What gauge wire would you recommend using....I'm guessing I could use some battery ground wire I have laying around?

 

Thanks,

 

Yeah definitely get those grounds sorted, bad grounds cause all kinds of havoc on these cars. I replaced mine with 10g wire.