Bonbon's Bilstein BTS kit

I bought our 05 back in 09 and since have always disliked how the car handled.

So I began changing suspension parts slowly:

2009: 20mm Whiteline rear swaybar+bushings

2012: rear avo endlinks, avo reinforced rear swaybar brackets, 00-04 rear kyb dampers, rallitek HD rear overload springs

2014: changed every single bushing in the rear (mix of whiteline and oem); also changed the front control arm bushings as well as front swaybar bushings; also installed new kyb front dampers

 

And STILL not pleased after all that .

 

SO, thanks to Dispatch20, I got a fairly nice deal on a used BTS kit from Japan. I paid around 950$ shipped to my door. I installed it about a month ago first without any lift kit and the rear was sagging baaad! So I then installed a 2 inch rear lift kit and it started to look a bit even I am planning to add 3/8 inch spacers in the front.

 

My impression:

Car feels more controlled and does inspire confidence now. The 'Tahoe feel' is kinna gone but not quite. I can tell the front suspension dampening rate feels perfect, but NOT the rear . Especially today, we went on a 2 hour drive with bikes on the roofs, a full trunk, two kids and two adults. It was pretty bouncy in the rear. I can tell the rear Bilstein springs are definitely softer than the Rallitek.

 

So, tonight I took off the rear suspension and put back my kyb with rallitek springs. I will then send my rear dampers to Bilstein USA for a rebuild and an increase in the damping rate, although I am not sure yet how much this variable needs to be changed... In any case, I've been in contact with them and they told me they can modify the shocks and stuff no problem and it is not too costly.

 

Side note: the rear dampers have five 'height settings' and mine were on the third setting.

 

Car without lift kit:

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245270&d=1487648924

 

 

Car with 2 inch rear lift kit

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245271&d=1487648924

 

 

Here are the height measurements in cm taken from hub center to fender lip:

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245410&d=1487824385

Here are some pics of the kit:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=241849&d=1481046695

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=241850&d=1481046695

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=241851&d=1481046695

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245265&d=1487648420

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245276&d=1487650707

Here is a picture of the five 'height' settings I mentioned earlier. Now that I think about it, I am not sure if these really adjust the rear height... Maybe they adjust how stiff the rear feels? Not sure...

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245274&d=1487649868

 

Here is a picture of the rear lift kit I am using (from Anderson Fab design).

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=245275&d=1487649868

I'm interested in the outcome of your upgrade of the rear shocks. The springs are actually made by Eibach for Bilstein to pair with their shocks/struts for the tuned suspension, BTS, kit. I'm using the top "height" setting on the rear and I tend to agree that it adjusts the preload and not the height.

Xt2005 - Did you ever measure the sag on the BTS prior to the spacers? Your pic definitely looks saggier than I remember mine to be.

 

From the other thread, this is how my empty vehicle sits (unloaded, measured from metal lip at highest point under each fender center arch):

Front Left: 29"

Front Right: 29 3/8"

Rear Left: 28 7/8"

Rear Right: 28 7/8"

 

If you want a stiffer spring response on the BTS, then you place the perch in the highest position to increase spring preload. It will raise the rear a little as a side affect.

I'm interested in the outcome of your upgrade of the rear shocks. The springs are actually made by Eibach for Bilstein to pair with their shocks/struts for the tuned suspension, BTS, kit. I'm using the top "height" setting on the rear and I tend to agree that it adjusts the preload and not the height.

 

Are you honestly satisfied with how the rear performs, especially on bumpy roads and with camping gears and what not in your trunk (and with the added power you have) ? Just curious.

 

Xt2005 - Did you ever measure the sag on the BTS prior to the spacers? Your pic definitely looks saggier than I remember mine to be.

 

From the other thread, this is how my empty vehicle sits (unloaded, measured from metal lip at highest point under each fender center arch):

Front Left: 29"

Front Right: 29 3/8"

Rear Left: 28 7/8"

Rear Right: 28 7/8"

 

If you want a stiffer spring response on the BTS, then you place the perch in the highest position to increase spring preload. It will raise the rear a little as a side affect.

 

Yes I made some measurements. I will post them later. What is your current perch setting?

Yes I made some measurements. I will post them later. What is your current perch setting?

 

Middle perch setting. I just checked my Outback, and the gap between the top of the tire is a little less in the back than the front. But I doesn't look nearly as saggy as your pic prior to the spacers. That's strange.

 

My typical driving is with an empty vehicle. My road trips are with my wife and 2 younger kids (~40 lbs each kid) along with a suitcase and backpack. Overall, not super loaded.

Middle perch setting. I just checked my Outback, and the gap between the top of the tire is a little less in the back than the front. But I doesn't look nearly as saggy as your pic prior to the spacers. That's strange.

 

My typical driving is with an empty vehicle. My road trips are with my wife and 2 younger kids (~40 lbs each kid) along with a suitcase and backpack. Overall, not super loaded.

 

I always carry quite a bit of stuff in my trunk (2 car audio amplifiers, fairly large craftsman toolbox, a bunch of other tools, survival gears, etc....). My guess is I have about 100lbs of dead weight in the trunk at all times.

 

I just updated the first post with the measurements I made earlier.

 

Also, I've just been driving a bit with the rallitek springs and 00-04 kyb dampers in the rear (and the bts in the front). It actually feels pretty good. I am surprised.

I always carry quite a bit of stuff in my trunk (2 car audio amplifiers, fairly large craftsman toolbox, a bunch of other tools, survival gears, etc....). My guess is I have about 100lbs of dead weight in the trunk at all times.

 

I just updated the first post with the measurements I made earlier.

 

Also, I've just been driving a bit with the rallitek springs and 00-04 kyb dampers in the rear (and the bts in the front). It actually feels pretty good. I am surprised.

 

I finally got out to measure my ride height (BTS5058j, no spacers, stock everything else except for whiteline swaybar and avo bracket, minimal extra trunk weight). Measured from center of the hub to the intersection with metal fender directly vertical.

 

FL = 16.5" = 41.9 cm (you had 41 cm)

RL = 16.2" = 41.2 cm (you had 38.5 cm)

 

With ~200lbs of wheels+tires in the hatch area, I got:

RL = 15.75" = 40 cm

 

With ~800lbs of flooring material in the hatch area, I got:

RL = 14.2" = 36 cm (extrapolated from a previous measurement done in a different way; measurement was from fender to ground & didn't account for tire 'droop' under load)

 

It's fairly dark in my garage, but I attached a pic of the sag with 200lbs in the trunk, and what constituted the 200lbs. If the sag was linear with weight (which it's not), then I'd have to add about ~300-400lbs to match your baseline sag. This is pretty surprising. Am I missing anything?

 

I (160 lbs) can stand on my tailgate and the car barely sags at all from that.

Also, in my review I made a claim: "The BTS kit is about 20% better than fresh KYBs and stock springs" and "If I had to do it again, I probably would not do it again based on the expense". How do you feel about the $ and the value of the BTS kit?

Measured from center of the hub to the intersection with metal fender directly vertical.

 

 

Wait, not sure I follow here. I measure from the center of the hub to the lip of the fender, which is in plastic. Maybe I should provide a picture of what I measure in order to avoid confusion.

In any case, your picture definitely shows less sag. Are you sure you are in the middle perch setting in the rear?

Maybe my rear dampers are simply shot or something. We will see how it goes once I get them back from Bilstein usa.

Also, in my review I made a claim: "The BTS kit is about 20% better than fresh KYBs and stock springs" and "If I had to do it again, I probably would not do it again based on the expense". How do you feel about the $ and the value of the BTS kit?

 

I concur with your assessment in that the Bilstein kit is about 20% better than the fresh kyb (with 00-04 in the rear). I could tell right from the beginning better control on bumpy roads at a fairly high rate of speed.

 

The $ value? mmmh I will tell you how I feel about it once I get the rear dampers back, although I still don't regret the purchase. In the end, I just want to get rid of the under damped rear end which I have been experiencing since day one. I am so sick of it! So I was super surprised when I experienced that again with the bts. But again, maybe the rear dampers are shot. And it is not helping that my DD to go to work is a lowered outback with Bilstein HD and pink springs. So I may be expecting too much of the BTS...

 

On a side note, I've been driving some more with the bts in the front and kyb in the rear with rallitek overload springs and it is really quite good! But I can still feel the under damped rear a bit, but not too bad really.

 

Thanks for all your measurements by the way.

Wait, not sure I follow here. I measure from the center of the hub to the lip of the fender, which is in plastic. Maybe I should provide a picture of what I measure in order to avoid confusion.

In any case, your picture definitely shows less sag. Are you sure you are in the middle perch setting in the rear?

Maybe my rear dampers are simply shot or something. We will see how it goes once I get them back from Bilstein usa.

 

Yeah, it is a plastic fender, I apologize. I'm positive it's the middle perch as I remember reading both pro and con reviews of the highest perch setting. I didn't want to try it.

 

I attached a couple pics of how I measured (no trunk load). I only had two hands to take the pic while holding the tape measure so the pics do not show a very accurate measurement.

No problem man. That's exactly how I've been measuring the height. Thanks for taking the time to post the picture .

So yeah, mine definitely sagged more than yours.

 

WRX USA, that'd be interesting if you could post these measurements when you have a moment.

I just measured my car. It wasn't perfectly level but the measurements were nearly identical left to right. I have just over 40k miles on my BTS-5056 that I bought new and I'm also running the SpecB aluminum bits, including the rear upper control arms. I have maximum 50lbs of gear in the back.

 

Front Left: 40.3cm (41.9cm Dispatch20, 41cm xt2005bonbon)

Rear Left: 38.4cm (41.2cm Dispatch20, 38.5cm xt2005bonbon)

 

The ride feels fine. I have developed a minor rear end clunk that I need to look into that could be endlinks or tophats.

I just measured my car. It wasn'5 perfectly level but the measurements were nearly identical left to right. I have just over 40k miles on my BTS-5056 that I bought new and I'm also running the SpecB aluminum bits, including the rear upper control arms. I have maximum 50lbs of gear in the back.

 

Front Left: 40.3cm (41.9cm Dispatch20, 41cm xt2005bonbon)

Rear Left: 38.4cm (41.2cm Dispatch20, 38.5cm xt2005bonbon)

 

The ride feels fine. I have developed a minor rear end clunk that I need to look into that could be endlinks or tophats.

 

 

Thanks for taking the time to measure your ride. Very interesting... Your rear is sagging as much as mine was then. So I am wondering if Dispatch20 rear perch setting is really on the middle setting (i.e. third 'ring').

I also have the 6MT which is easily another 100lbs, biased towards the front.

Thanks for taking the time to measure your ride. Very interesting... Your rear is sagging as much as mine was then. So I am wondering if Dispatch20 rear perch setting is really on the middle setting (i.e. third 'ring').

 

Middle setting!

 

I agree that this is odd.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

yeah odd. what is the part number on your rear dampers? Same as what I posted in the OP?

Another variable I forgot about on mine was the JDM front fender. I'd assume the wheel arch is exactly the same but I've never confirmed.

yeah odd. what is the part number on your rear dampers? Same as what I posted in the OP?

Yes, it's the same part number. My label is a little different, though. It doesn't list the obvious date code like yours but it does have "47B15" instead. Maybe it means the 47th week of 2015 similar to DOT stamps on tires.

 

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G890A using Tapatalk

My OEM springs were 17 inches (hub to fender). So at 16.2 inches, it looks like the BTS kit is lowering you just under an inch. Or basically as expected.

 

I am going off a post I made in 2012 though. So who knows if I even knew how to measure back then

quick measurement on mine and it's 42.2 cm in the rear and 42.8 cm in the front. stock 9 year old suspension cept rear avo bar, brackets and new moog endlinks on all corners.

 

edit: oh, and my battery isn't in there, among some other lighter things. i do have some tools on top of the manifold though.

Sorry for late reply but it's been busy at work and last post disappeared into internet...

 

There were no specific specs for rear shocks re-build. I simply asked for slightly more slow speed damping. I don't know how much this contributed to overall result as shocks had been incorrectly assembled and this had contributed somewhat.

 

Simply. It's not perfect, but to make it better I need to buy a different car. I cannot point any flaw in suspension as currently it is.

Would I do it again? Definitely yes for this car!

 

Looking at the picture I can say that saggy rear with BTS is an indication of problems. Before (new BTS) I had springs in second highest groove with slight sag. Now they are middle groove and no sag what so ever.

Looking at the picture I can say that saggy rear with BTS is an indication of problems. Before (new BTS) I had springs in second highest groove with slight sag. Now they are middle groove and no sag what so ever.

 

I don't have exact measurements yet but here is a picture of car as it is. No load in trunk. Actually biggest difference with rear shock rebuild was dynamic load carrying capability.