Group N Motor mounts?

I just got some Group N motor mounts from eBay. I've already upgraded the shifter bushings, Group N transmission mount, and pitch stop. The motor mounts are the last piece of the puzzle, IMHO.

 

What do I need to do/not need to do? I've heard it isn't a bad job, like 2 hrs, but then I heard from my dad that the repair manual says you need to drain the coolant and disconnect the radiator?

 

Any help/direction would be greatly appreciated before I dive in. Thanks!

Edited June 9, 2020 by Jolbaru_LGT

My coolant system was left untouched by Surgeline who did the install for me. Very much recommend them, by the way. Almost no more NVH but a ton better driveability with the manual transmission.

Group n motor mounts are worth every penny. Takes 30 min to do both.

Group n motor mounts are worth every penny. Takes 30 min to do both.

 

SOLD! I was actually shocked at how heavy the package was they came in. They're some serious motor mounts. Tomorrow I think I'll give it a shot. These projects always seem worse than they are, it was maybe taking off some exhaust pieces that scared me. Hopefully I won't need any goofy looking wrenches like a stubby ratcheting or anything.

Also to be correct, both motor mounts, the left and right are the same part?

Also to be correct, both motor mounts, the left and right are the same part?

 

Different part numbers but same part I believe. I didn't actually install them myself since I had it in the shop for other things at the same time so I can't confirm.

If I remember right, the base mount is the same for either side, it's the bracket between the mount and the engine that is unique per side.

 

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Genuine-Subaru-Group-N-Engine-Mount-Pair-STi-Impreza-WRX-Forester-Legacy-GT-NEW/143014589665

 

If you look at the main picture in that auction, you can see that the metal plate between the mount and the engine is mirrored between the two sides.

 

I've done this a couple times, it's not too bad, just be careful to brace everything well.

I did it by unbolting the downpipe from the midpipe.

Unbolt the dogbone (top of the tranny) so the engine can lift and pivot slightly.

Then unbolted the existing engine mounts.

I think I also loosened the bolts from the mount to the engine at this point.

 

I placed a board under the oil pan and slowly jacked up the engine.

Watch the hoses and lines all around, if I remember right you can get it clear of the subframe without unhooking anything else.

I put a small 2x4 between the engine and subframe to brace incase I somehow knocked the engine off the jack, I wanted to keep all my fingers.

 

Remove the old mounts, install the new ones.

Pay careful attention to the orientation, they will bolt to the engine either way, but "backward" will have the angles with the subframe all wrong.

Once bolted on, remove your brace, lower slowly, should fit in the holes in the subframe with minimal adjustments.

Then reverse what you did to prep and you should be good to go.

Edited June 10, 2020 by Infosecdad

Protip: 3/8" flex-head ratchet with a swivel joint and some extensions will make this job a million times easier. Forget getting a torque wrench on the bolts that go from the mounts to the block, and also forget using a torque wrench on the mount bolts unless you pull the swaybar. Otherwise, Infosecdad's post above details everything you need to know.

Will I need new gaskets for the exhaust?

Depend what you current have and their condition

If you still have the stock donut gasket there, I would probably replace it.

If you have something else, maybe? Again depends on what/how it is

Depend what you current have and their condition

If you still have the stock donut gasket there, I would probably replace it.

If you have something else, maybe? Again depends on what/how it is

 

Everything is stock. I'm certain the substrate "fell out" a while ago. but it wasn't changed to anything aftermarket. I'll look into getting donuts and gaskets and whatnot. It's just hard to know what gaskets I need to order.

 

I'm looking at Subaru parts diagrams and it's kind of confusing. I know when I start to take it apart, it'll be obvious which gaskets I need, but I'd like to order it all before I start.

Edited June 10, 2020 by Jolbaru_LGT

I apologize for the "newb" questions, but I can see the exhaust manifolds and the gaskets I'd need. There are two of them. But which is the uppipe and downpipe? Can anyone circle these and the gaskets I'd need to order for reference? Pretty sure I have an idea, but I just want to make sure.

If you want to replace all the gaskets due to age or leaking, cool.

That would be 10 gaskets in addition to the donut gasket listed below (I can help with part numbers if you are doing this).

If you are going that route, you'll need to plan to pull the downpipe and carefully support the turbo.

It'll take a few hours more than just doing the engine mounts.

 

Otherwise, the only gasket you would need due to disconnecting something for installing the motor mounts, is the donut gasket between the downpipe and midpipe.

 

https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru_2005_Legacy-25L-TURBO-5MT-4WD-GT-Wagon/Catalytic-Converter-Gasket-Rear/49250589/44022AA123.html

What he said ^^^^.

 

Replacing the exhaust manifold gaskets isn't warranted unless they are leaking. Taking the exhaust manifold off the engine is easier than putting it back.

 

Beware of "WhileIamThere" syndrom. I'd limit the work to DP gaskets and call it a day.

If you want to replace all the gaskets due to age or leaking, cool.

That would be 10 gaskets in addition to the donut gasket listed below (I can help with part numbers if you are doing this).

If you are going that route, you'll need to plan to pull the downpipe and carefully support the turbo.

It'll take a few hours more than just doing the engine mounts.

 

Otherwise, the only gasket you would need due to disconnecting something for installing the motor mounts, is the donut gasket between the downpipe and midpipe.

 

https://parts.subaru.com/p/Subaru_2005_Legacy-25L-TURBO-5MT-4WD-GT-Wagon/Catalytic-Converter-Gasket-Rear/49250589/44022AA123.html

 

I ONLY want to do what's necessary to get the old motor mounts out, and the new group N ones in. So, I'll order that donut gasket and that's it. From what I gather, disconnecting that along with the TMIC and pitch stop mount, then disconnect the old motor mounts, and that will let me lift the engine up enough from the oil pan, to sneak off the motor mounts and put the new ones in. The turbo and exhaust will still be connected, except at the downpipe and midpipe connection. I think I've got it now. Let me know if I don't, but thanks again!

Edited June 10, 2020 by Jolbaru_LGT

If I remember correctly, I didn't even touch my exhaust when I originally installed my group-N mounts, just undid the dogbone and lifted the motor. Had enough space to get the mounts out from between the block and the subframe.

Don't forget the heatshield for the passenger side motor mount..

if you have sn engine crane you can skip the oil pan lifting.

 

patience is important. you may have to jiggle the engine to get it into place.

Hmmmm, well, I guess I already ordered the donut... MMMMMMN, Donut. I'll see how it goes. Yeah, no engine lift in my garage. yet....

Honestly, you probably need that donut anyway if it's still original.

 

I know it can be done without disconnecting the exhaust at that point, but I didn't want to risk stressing the exhaust; so it was worth it to me to do that little bit.

you do know that you dont have to remove any exhaust parts/piping to do the engine mounts right? last time i did them was last year on a 2013 WRX STI and I only popped the hood to ensure that when i jacked the engine up, components didnt hit the hood. Didint take the IC off, didnt unbolt the pitch stop, just unbolt the mount nuts, jack the engine up for clearance, and swapped out the mounts.

Well that’s good to know. Maybe Ill take the donut back if I don’t need it. Thanks!

you do know that you dont have to remove any exhaust parts/piping to do the engine mounts right? last time i did them was last year on a 2013 WRX STI and I only popped the hood to ensure that when i jacked the engine up, components didnt hit the hood. Didint take the IC off, didnt unbolt the pitch stop, just unbolt the mount nuts, jack the engine up for clearance, and swapped out the mounts.

 

Ok, so this isn't completely correct. I just finished the job today and it turned out to be a PITA. Let me explain.

 

I put the car on jackstands, front and rear, obviously opened the hood, took off the dreaded belly pan, and used a jack with wooden blocks screwed together for safety to lift the engine by the oil pan. I got the old motor mounts loosened and free, so I could lift the car up. I couldn't see the two rear bolts on each MM, but I thought if I lifted, I'd see them. There they were. And holy ship are those things a pain. I got the Right(passenger's side) one off, and couldn't get the unseen rear bolt back in.

 

It's at a weird angle and you just can't get in there, without jacking up your hands in the process. But, I couldn't even get the rear bolt started. For the life of me. So, I had to buy a 1.25 pitch M10 tap to clean it out. After a re-tapping, I finally got it started, then I found if I physically went beyond the rear of the crossmember, there's enough space to get a ratcheting 14mm in there and snug it in. The left(driver's) side was WAY easier. Then, came to lowering it.

 

Yikes! It didn't want to go through the holes of the crossmember or whatever it's attached to. I then thought about that dogbone... Yeah, you SHOULD loosen that. It just messes up the entire angle of re-installation. So, I went and removed the TMIC and loosened my aftermarket Grimmspeed dogbone. The entire engine shifted and it all went into place. I lowered it down, and bolted everything in, and put it all together.

 

So, in conclusion, I didn't touch the exhaust, but if I were to do it again, I'd definitely disconnect the dogbone. I really can't see how you could do the job without removing it. Maybe it's different on a 2013 WRX STI, but the 2005 Legacy GT definitely needs it disconnected at one end, the end closest to the front of the car. Oh, and take your time reinstalling those rear bolts on the MM. They suck! Maybe thread them without the new MM in the way just to see the angle they go in, and if it'll actually start. Be ready to use both hands, and maybe swear alot. Hopefully you won't have to re-tap the threads like I did.

ah, you had an aftermarket Grimmspeed dogbone. the STI i worked on had the OEM one, which has more play in the bushings. thats why i got away with not taking it out.