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Noname 08 OBXT Rebuild Thread


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Yea I want to replace the bottom grounds. I made cables but the ring terminals were too small. I'll have to order some online. Not entirely sure where to put the passenger side one though. It was on the heat shield but that thing is rusty as crap. Some people were suggesting adding one to the head on that side but I can't figure out where.

 

Yea I have diy tgv deletes so it should, in theory, be on the fuel rail heat shield. I'll have to look when I get a chance to. I know there is also the one on the starter bolt. I shouldn't have undone the battery ground to chassis, I think that's on the driver side strut tower from some reading, but it flickers with the key in the on position so I need to check that as well. Maybe I'm just really unlucky and it was working fine before but it decided to crap out while sitting a few months.

 

 

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Yea I want to replace the bottom grounds. I made cables but the ring terminals were too small. I'll have to order some online. Not entirely sure where to put the passenger side one though. It was on the heat shield but that thing is rusty as crap. Some people were suggesting adding one to the head on that side but I can't figure out where.

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Mine has always been on one of the valve cover bolts on that side.

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OK cool. Mine disintegrated and I was thinking that might be a good spot but wasn't sure about undoing those bolts.

 

The big engine grounding thread brought up that the exhaust there might need a ground for the o2 sensor. So possibly better to run three. Driver head to frame rail, passenger valve cover to frame rail. Heat shield to frame rail.

 

Although like I said my exhaust is a pile of rust. Just don't have the money to replace yet. I'd love to have coated grimmspeed up dp cross pipe. I think it looks real good.

 

 

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I have some of those heat shield removed from my wagon. With the two grounds I had made up, everything seems to work fine.

 

Knock on wood...

305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD).  CHECK your oil, these cars use it.

 

Engine Build - Click Here

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Well I decided I don't want to do this again do I ordered new fuel hoses and clamps and the two throttle body pre heater hoses (although I only remember one). I think that's everything under the manifold. That'll end up being all new coolant hoses and all new fuel hoses and most of the vacuum hoses are new. Only soft stuff not new is fuel vent line, map hose, heater core hoses, and throttle body hose. But I think I can replace all those without pulling anything.

 

I'm going to hope the crank sensor issue is just a cleaning or connection problem. Some reading around says it could be an issue if the timing went off. I had the shop so that so I'm hoping that's not it.

 

 

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Busy weekend. Got parts Saturday morning and finished pulling the intake manifold with tgv and fuel rails attached. Replaced the leaking coolant hose, both throttle body coolant hoses, all the soft fuel lines, and the fuel evap lines under the manifold. Noticed I had a slight leak at the passenger ocv so pulled the banjo, cleaned it, new crush washers.

 

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Had trouble getting it fully reattached last night so finished assembly this morning. Refilled the coolant triple checked everything. It's a lot harder with it not on the engine stand. Ran it for about fifteen minutes since it's already run 7-10 or so prior. Did an oil change. Noticed the coolant return for the turbo was weeping just a tiny bit. Managed to get the ratchet on it and it was real lose. Snugged it down and looked over everything again and drove it just over 50 miles. Another oil change and it seems almost good to go.

 

 

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While I drove it, I had btssm running as set up above with the addition of rpm and throttle plate %. However I can't get those fuel corrections like that. I need to play with it more. I never got any misfires or fkc or flkc. But my boost and target boost consistently don't match (I'm not boosting so it's showing negative numbers). My boost is about 3psi higher than my target consistently.

 

I also have the timing degrees on there but no idea what it means. It shows numbers lol. I'm assuming if the fkc is 0 still that means it's not pulling timing? My iam is 0.5 not 1 but I read that will happen when the battery is disconnected for a while. It did not change from 0.5.

 

What I didn't notice had happened until the end of my drive though was I had 6 knock events. I looked at them but not sure how to interpret them. I did notice the vvt is not the same in some but I was using kline not can and saw that sometimes they'd both be raising and one would jump and they'd match up. It was basically always the same on vvt.

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The other issue I had I think is not related to the rebuild but may be something with a cv joint? Or the front differential (which is part of the trans right?) I get this squeal/whine. It's a noise that was there before but I didn't do any city driving prior. At low speeds it's a weird squeal and it raises in pitch as you roll faster. Does it with clutch in or engaged in gear. All gears.

 

Above say 10mph or so, it's so high pitched it's more a whine. I can hear it just barely. If I give it power, it gets louder but it's still there regardless of engine rpm or gearing.

 

I noticed the drive side cv axle has a small amount of in and out play. Maybe 1/8 inch. It's minimal but more than the passenger side. Both boots are in good shape. No tears no grease leaking. But maybe it needs a transmission fluid change?

 

 

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Otherwise it went well. Felt good and was nice to drive it around. Clutch and brakes were fine. The smoke died down quickly. There was some exhaust smell but that was nearly completely gone by the time I was done.

 

About five minutes in to my drive, I went to mess with the a/c and the screen came on and didn't flicker on me over the next two hours. No flicker on the radio screen either, so hopefully that resolved itself. It was still doing it at the very beginning of the drive.

 

 

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Well I went for a drive after work. Just over 100 miles now. But something is definitely off. I'm showing knock events. I just have btssm running with a bunch of gauges up sitting in the passenger seat, so it's kinda hard to see sometimes. But I have knock events, showed a misfire on 1,2, and 4 at some point and fkc at some point.

 

There's also this almost imperceptible stutter or surge? I can only notice it on extra smooth roads and if I'm barely on the throttle.

 

I have all of them as just like a word doc. I'll need to sit down and see if they make any sense and read up on some other "I have knock" threads and see what I can sort out.

 

The gas also isn't exactly fresh. Not sure how much that comes into play? Should I fill it up with fresh gas, it's at 1/4 tank right now or let it run low. Should I stop driving it all together?

 

 

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How many misfire counts did you see in a single cylinder? As I previously mentioned, if it is random and the count is pretty low (like <3), then you should not really worry about it. But, if it gets repetitive, especially at idle and in a given cylinder, then you need to do further diagnostics.

 

As for the knock event, you will never be 100% free of knock. Have you 'pulled an LV' yet? There is a little 'LV' button as part of the BtSsm app which reports a table of 'fine learned knock correction' as a function of load and rpm. You would like that table to show zeros everywhere. But you may have a few cells here and there with negative corrections. You want to avoid such corrections at high load though.

 

Is your IAM one yet?

 

How are you four long term fuel trims looking like?

 

And it is a good thing that your VVT angles are the same. This angle will usually be non zero as you increase the load range (i.e. step on the gas). You want to watch that they are almost identical, and that one is not lagging behind.

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Hmm. I thought the goal was to be knock free. Or is that knock free in certain conditions? I thought knock was what killed engines. Or maybe detonation is which is sometimes knock? And knock and misfire are different correct?

 

I only saw 1 on 3 of the cylinders. Nothing had more than that. Highest fkc was uhhh -5.63. I thought maybe it was at higher rpm or maybe higher throttle (not that I've gone over 25% yet) but doesn't seem to be consistent. Haven't sat down to look at them yet.

 

Fine learned knock correction is still 0. Iam is still 0.5 and hasn't changed. LV is ranging but I think the highest was just over -3% and the table is all zeros from memory. I'll check tomorrow when I get the reader and computer to connect. I might try to run can on btssm. Ecuflash didn't have the option for the patch and I think the kline is slow. I can watch it tick through changes. I'll keep an eye on the vvt though.

 

No registered problems at idle. It doesn't feel "smooth" but idk. I don't think it's rough either. Maybe this weekend I'll go test drive an older wrx and get a feel for another turbo boxer engine. Maybe I'm just being over paranoid like with the smoke at start up.

 

Thanks though. It's not super easy finding interpretations of this info. As I go through if it's still looking good, I'm going to get an etune from cryo. But want to catch what I can for now.

 

 

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Just read through the first bit of the knock sticky and it makes a bit more sense now. I glazed at some point and stopped, but just like tearing into the car, it makes more sense now that I'm doing it.

 

I did see merchgod reference the "knock control sticky" but I don't see this. Maybe they are referring to the knock control strategy explanation thread in the rom raider forums?

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I've always seen a roughness count here and there. Wouldn't worry about single counts. On the FKC side, check for rattles. I had a rattling oil line and trans dipstick driving -10 deg FKC just cruising and also shifting under load, scared the crap out of me.

 

You pulling proper vacuum, and have you checked fuel pressure?

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I'm not entirely sure how to check either of those? It's running negative boost?

 

I am planning to give it a going over to make sure nothing has come loose. I don't have a fuel pressure gauge. Are these things I would see in logging? Or do you mean checking for leaks with like smoke testing or starter fluid?

 

OK good to know on the occasional roughness. I want to check for anything vibrating, I don't think there is much of anything to do so. How'd you end up figuring the trans dipstick? From underneath or just listening?

 

 

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The knock sensor can pick up noise from rattling from loose pieces, or when shifting, and stuff like that. It will then interpret that as knock, even though it is a false knock. But even then, it will remove some timing as you saw. And yeah, knock is a result of detonation (ignition happened at the wrong time).

 

 

 

A misfire (or roughness) count of 1 or 2 is nothing to worry about. Did you install a lightweight crank pulley and/or lighweight flywheel?

 

 

Can you actually post your four long term fuel trims? If they are all within +/-3%, then that is great.

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As in the boost reading should be about -9 psi at idle, maybe -7 psi cruising off-power. But, like xt2005bonbon said, if trims are good you're good on vacuum leaks. Fuel pressure, you have to add a sensor to measure. But, trims would be high if fuel pressure was low, too.

 

As for the dipstick, I looked around for anything that could rattle, and saw the handle touching the underside of the IC. Rotated it so it wasn't touching, then went on my way. No unusual knock reports for the next day, then I picked up another -10 pull during a quickish shift under load. Looked, and the dipstick had rotated back until it was rattling against the IC again. Stowed the dipstick in the trunk and capped the fill port, hasn't happened since. The Perrin clone I run is pretty thick, so maybe not even possible with a stock TMIC

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That's crazy that it picks up shifts. OK good to know. I did install the grimmspeed light weight pulley but excedy stock weight flywheel. I forgot that can mess with engine readings.

 

I forgot my laptop this morning but when I get home I'll pull my learning views again. I'm trying to average about 100 miles a day so hopefully that'll show me any issues if they exist.

 

 

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OK yea my boost readings are around there. I think 8.something at idle and I haven't hit any boost yet.

 

I'll get in there and knock things around and see if I can find anything loose. I still have the turbo heat shield off because I thought it would be easier for visual inspections, I'll stick my head in there and check that dipstick just in case.

 

Thanks again for all the help. I've said this whole time that taking things apart and getting them back together is the easy part. It's diagnosing problems that's difficult. For now more driving and more reading on things. I don't care to learn to tune, but I care to be able to interperet the info to search for issues.

 

 

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I have stray high FKCs at really weird times (like shifts or low load/low RPMs) that I'm pretty sure is something banging around in the engine bay after I finished my engine swap. I need to track it down, but as long as they are in the low/no load ranges, I'm not too worried at the moment.
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^ what Infosecdad said. low/no load ranges is no big deal IMO as well, but can be quite annoying. You don't want to see recurring non zero FLKC values on the far right columns of your LV. Those will most likely be real knock events registered.

 

 

I have seen a few videos (and I think Infosecdad too :)) about the negative effects of using lightweight crank pulleys, where they could potentially damage the engine due to resonance if I recall correctly. Having said that, I have those on my engines. But I will probably get rid of these.

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OK cool. All great info.

 

Yea the lwcp is a thing. From what I could gather, on larger v engines they are typically a harmonic dampener but on our engines that didn't seem to be the intent or the effect. Our crank pulleys do separate, damaging engines sometimes. Idk if that, like the oil pick up is more prone to certain years. But that's also not to say a bit of an nvh increase from the lwcp isn't showing some false knock.

 

I made a spread sheet last night of all the knock events I've had to see it easier. They are all below 3k rpm, most are below 40 g/s MAF, and most are below a 0.9 load, so from my reading that corresponds with "low load" ranges.

 

 

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Yeah, the OEM crank pulleys do separate. And that was one reason why I used an LWCP. Another reason was to be able to shift quicker. But that reason is kinna meh now.

 

 

Yeah, looks like low load 'knock'. But at the same time, you have not gone into boost yet right? So you have not hit the high load ranges.

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That's correct no boost yet. Just been edging up towards the transition. Most of those are at like -1 or -3 psi.

 

I've been following the cobb break in more or less and I realized today that they say for like the 100-500 mileage to do no more than 40% throttle and 4500 rpm. I've been running up to 4500 rpm but not pushing the throttle even near that much. I read it as a hold your horses thing to prevent people boosting like crazy on the new engine. But honestly even without boost it's so much better than what I came from so I don't really see a need, city driving, to hit boost at all. I might have been happy with the NA haha.

 

Granted when that turbo kicks in is sure fun. So no I haven't hit those higher loads. I imagine at some point I SHOULD but it seems like for engine break in, the idea is varying the rpm and idk how load plays in. I can certainly hit 3-5psi boost and 40% throttle. But it's so fast I can't do it on my work commute unless I get on the highway lol.

 

 

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Feel like the odd one out sometimes. But coming from a 100hp fwd 270k econobox to this beast. I honestly have trouble controlling it. Noticed that on the one toll booth launch I did before the engine went. I can't even comprehend adding 100 more hp.

 

 

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