Alignment advice

Did my tire rotation for the second time yesterday. Once every 7500 miles is the plan. 2010 LGT, stock wheels and tires

All but the lt rear were wearing perfectly. The left rear showed wear along the inner edge of the tire. Not down to the cords wear, but definitely headed in that direction.

From searching the forums it appears you all recommend 0 toe at all four wheels, and -1-1.5 degrees camber.

Car suspension is stock struts etc. Only change was kartboy endlinks on the factory swaybars.

I attached the completed alignment specs from when it was done in October of last year. If I'm reading this right the LT rear is towed out .1 degrees ... which is apparently enough to cause the inner edge wear. The rt rear is toed out .05 degrees and shows no wear. I'm looking for zero in both those boxes correct?

that alignment was done poorly. your rear toe should be 0.00000000 with a thrust angle of 0.00000000

camber should be even on both sides too.

take it back and have them do it right.

Poorly is directly related to who is evaluating it. I see a bunch of green so it's within tolerance from their perspective but clearly not optimal. I asking to confirm optimal before I take it back to have it done again.

You answered one question - 0.0 toe at each wheel is what I'm asking for......

How about a camber target? from my search I see -1 to -1.5 seems to be the sweet spot, but there is a whole bunch of modded/upgraded/lowered suspensions in those posts. I dont see that even as an option on their specs. Any suggestions for a factory ride?

this is North east PA. Not so hot roads on stock wheels and tires. Spirited driving, but not a racecar.

For your stated needs:

Front camber - just get it in the middle of the green (IIRC that's between -0.05 to -1) AND even left/right

Front toe - 0.00 both sides

Rear toe - 0.00 both sides

Thrust angle - 0.00

Front caster and rear camber is not adjustable from the factory on our cars.

Positive toe is toe in. As scubaboo said, 0 toe all around

That right reat camber is concerning. 1.3 degrees out from the left rear. Only fix is an adjustable arm. Could do the right side only and make it match the left. Or go both sides depending on what you want to spend.

Front camber, I went for the max that was able to be matched on both sides.

Definitely want to get that alignment redone.

^Oh, about the front camber, going towards the positive end of the front camber range will give you more straight line stability, going towards the negative end will give better turn in.

Also, suspension work like bushes and arms are recommended to be done in pairs.

Perfect, That's what I was looking for, thanks for the advice. Even if we cant get it to perfect, I have the direction to move toward.

Car has 126k miles on it. Likely some worn parts showing up in the results. Everything looks to be original in the rear but those endlinks.

I missed the positive camber up front. Upper bolts on the struts at the hub are factory cam bolts, get that adjusted. They look like regular bolts and if the tech wants to half ass it... possibly skipped it/didn't look in the system for adjustment (alignment software will tell them how to adjust, but they have to look first.)

Toe set is most important. Camber would be great to be even, but within .1 - .3 is good enough.

Ageed that doing both rear camber arms would be best.

You have an in spec alignment, but not necessarily a good alignment. I would have at least have them adjust the front camber to match. The rear camber is not adjustable unless you buy adjustable rear LCA. As for the toe, I would like to see less toe and have it match.

On one of my vehicles, I put in an aftermarket suspension that uses specialized narrow tools for adjustment of the front camber. As result most alignment shop wouldn't touch it, so their was a bunch owners who did their own alignments. I did my own alignment and fooled around with the settings at the time. I prefer the way my vehicle drove with a slight bit of front toe. On my Legacy, I had the shop put in a little bit of front toe and zero in the rear. I have seen good argument for 0 toe all around (less tire wear), slight bit of rear toe as well (help with rear tracking)

Poorly is directly related to who is evaluating it. I see a bunch of green so it's within tolerance from their perspective but clearly not optimal. I asking to confirm optimal before I take it back to have it done again.

 

You answered one question - 0.0 toe at each wheel is what I'm asking for......

 

How about a camber target? from my search I see -1 to -1.5 seems to be the sweet spot, but there is a whole bunch of modded/upgraded/lowered suspensions in those posts. I dont see that even as an option on their specs. Any suggestions for a factory ride?

 

this is North east PA. Not so hot roads on stock wheels and tires. Spirited driving, but not a racecar.

for camber, id just go as negative as you can while being equal on both sides. your stock camber adjustments can only go so far, and their limits are well within streetable specs.

and "poorly" is objective here. if the shop wont spend the time to get both side to be equal, then they did a poor job, period. the rear toe is the most critical aspect of a car's alignment. Having any kind of thrust angle throws off the rest of the car.

green/=good. balance=good

you want the best alignment? Subaru dealer... they do enough of them so they can dial t right into perfect provided parts are not worn/damaged

lol all you want but I have 3 Subaru and NONE of them have ever com back from a dealer with an improper alignment when they were done... they all came back driving straight and true...and even wearing tires. The problem with places like tires plus is they work on many cars and they may or may not know what is accepted for insert car brand here...

both if the dealers that I use here have one guy that takes care of alignments and they both do an outstanding job.

i'm sure your anecdotal experiences at dealerships are all positive.

driving straight and true with little wear isn't all that's required for a good alignment, and I've heard countless dealership horror stories regarding alignments, including working at a Subaru dealership and seeing the horror shows first hand.

finding a shop you trust, that you know will do a good job, dealership or not, is whats most important. going for just green on the spec sheet without understanding car balance and how imbalances exacerbate themselves on the limits for grip is the sign of a bad alignment tech.

Perfect, That's what I was looking for, thanks for the advice. Even if we cant get it to perfect, I have the direction to move toward.

 

Car has 126k miles on it. Likely some worn parts showing up in the results. Everything looks to be original in the rear but those endlinks.

No prob.

Wear, very possible. Rear camber angle has a direct effect on rear toe angle in our cars.

i'm sure your anecdotal experiences at dealerships are all positive.

 

driving straight and true with little wear isn't all that's required for a good alignment, and I've heard countless dealership horror stories regarding alignments, including working at a Subaru dealership and seeing the horror shows first hand.

 

finding a shop you trust, that you know will do a good job, dealership or not, is whats most important. going for just green on the spec sheet without understanding car balance and how imbalances exacerbate themselves on the limits for grip is the sign of a bad alignment tech.

lol and I am sure your anecdotal evidence is just as good amirite?

fact is I had cars aligned outside of the Honda Acura Susbaru Ford, Chrysler dealer and more often than not, had to take it back. Take it to the local dealer, never had to go back, not even once.

so if you want to have a dick measuring contest, sit down already, you lost.

I wanted to say thank to you folks for your guidance on my alignment. Got the new tires installed and specifically requested

zero toe at each wheel

-.05 camber front and rear, most importantly even on both sides

What I got:

zero toe at each wheel

Front camber -.05 each side

Rear camber is -.06 left and -1.8 rt. No adjustment on the stock parts. they suggested adjustable LCA's To even the rear. I passed for now. No money after the $800 tires!

The car drives way better. Less twitchy

Its the first time I've ever gone in and asked for specifics, vrs just do an alignment.

It's good you they were able to even out everything that can be adjusted. Yeah thats about as good an alignment as you can get without adjustable rear lower arms.

That's pretty much factory alignment spec, at least on our market cars. Mine was a nice stable straight line mile muncher with those specs.

What tires did you put on?

It's good you they were able to even out everything that can be adjusted. Yeah thats about as good an alignment as you can get without adjustable rear lower arms.

 

That's pretty much factory alignment spec, at least on our market cars. Mine was a nice stable straight line mile muncher with those specs.

 

What tires did you put on?

https://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Continental&tireModel=PureContact+LS&partnum=245VR8PCLS&fromSurvey=true

Those - made in the USA amazingly enough! So far nice and quiet, really good in the rain. Stick pretty well although I’m mid tune with XRT and haven’t pushed them too hard yet.

I’m on my second set of those tires. I love them! Reasonably quite at highway speeds and great grip!

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I see you missed the point. It's ok. You do what works for you. As for the dick measuring contest, I'm the only contestant here, so if that's losing, I'm the biggest loser.

I did not miss the point, you did... who do you think is (generally speaking) going to do a better job aligning the car... one tire shop that does not know the in and out of each make or the local dealer?

I have been driving cars since they were mostly V8 with a carburetor powered and I can tell you from personal experience that I have NEVER, EVER taken a car back for a realignment that was done at the local Honda, ford, Subaru, Chrysler, GM, Toyota, etc dealer... I have on multiple occasions had to take cars back to shops like tires plus, goodyear, firestone, etc because they could not line up the car correctly on the first try...

I have had my 14 Legacy for 5 years and it was aligned once in 74K miles by Subaru dealer

I have had my 2003 Legacy for 7 years and it has been aligned once in the 80K miles I had it by a different Subaru dealer, no issues

Now if you can find a guy that is good at it with your make of car, by all means, use them but from my personal experience, you cannot go wrong with a competent person whom only works on said cars... We have 5 dealers here for Subaru and I only use 2 of them...

point is, people whom work on nothing but one make of car are (generally) very good at what they do.