October 2004 Car & Driver Comparo - 3RD Place?!?!

Well, it appears that Patrick Bedard and gang religated our GT Legacy to a disappointing 3rd Place :evil: Here are the Highs, Lows, Verdict: Highs: Three Bags full of squirt, super-readable instrument display, low cowl lets the sunshine in Lows: Rather Heavy clutch, junky sound when the doors close (?!?), lots of obvious plastic around the interior (again ?!?!?) The Verdict: A Getaway Subie for bank jobs I am disapointed especially with the comments on the interior -- really miss the mark! I think that is the most nicely done upgrade on the 2005 model! Specs: 0-60 5.7 secs 1/4 mile - 14.2 @96 top gear (50-70) 8.1 ide dBA = 40 full throttle dBA = 73 lb per bhp = 13.6 These specs, and the HP and Torque ratings were the highest in the comparo the finals: 4. Audi A4 1.8 T 3. Legagy GT Limited 2. Volvo S40 T5 1. Acura TSX sob, sob -- I thought for certain #1 in this one (though I knew C&D were really on about the TSX) Rob

Could you let us know how C&D weighted the rankings other than the usual power, acceleration, handling? A lot of us can't figure out how the S40 took second even if you factor in creature features. Ken

Wow, that is very disappointing! I don't know about them but I am extremely happy with mine.

Typical magazine review. You simply can't get a fair shake being a suby. Japanese car of the year, what the hell do Japanese know about cars anyway? :lol::lol: Good numbers though!

One more thing, how can they say that the interior is full of plastic? Oh, and that the doors are light. Did they even test the car?

Um.... [img]http://www.columbusracing.com/ubb/graemlins/bsflag.gif[/img]

[quote name='Dr. Zevil']Typical magazine review. You simply can't get a fair shake being a suby.[/quote] C&D loved the wrx, the forester xt...

There's already a thread on this topic started several days ago and listing all this info., you should of done a search first!

[quote name='Driver72']There's already a thread on this topic started several days ago and listing all this info., you should of done a search first![/quote] The only one I have seen was about someone posting that C&D was going to have the GT on the September TV show. Perhaps you could point in the right place! Rob

That's the same post. Read into it a bit, the results were posted a day or so after that and there is now 7 pages of "talk" about the results. Obviously we all think the LGT got robbed. The best performing car and the second lowest price with nearly as good as interior as the other 3 "premium brand" cars and it didn't win. conclusion = Car and Driver is NOT for driving enthusiasts. They apparently think a name and interior design out weigh performance.

[quote name='Driver72']There's already a thread on this topic started several days ago and listing all this info., you should of done a search first![/quote] I did just see that you did update the TV post with this information. most of that post was speculative and I lost interest. It did eventually make it in there, though Rob

[quote name='RobCatron'][quote name='Driver72']There's already a thread on this topic started several days ago and listing all this info., you should of done a search first![/quote] The only one I have seen was about someone posting that C&D was going to have the GT on the September TV show. Perhaps you could point in the right place! Rob[/quote] That was the one, haha. Someone posted in there the results. :)

Somewhat surprising. I test drove every one of those cars and chose the LGT. If the TSX had any kind of juice, I could understand, but I don't know how anyone can drive that car and not think it feels underpowered. Just my .02.

I don't need C&D or my neighbors to confirm that the Leg GT meets my test for fun and function. My kids think I am crazy for not buying a BMW AWD wagon or Porsche Cayene(sp) and my wife is kind enough to tolerate my appreciation for the a simple, pure, driving machine, but she would prefer I buy a Benz E series wagon with 4matic. Fact is, I will feel better and have more fun in my Leg GT, than any of the cars my kids,wife and neighbors think is appropiate. I want Suby to get good reviews for very selfish reasons. Granted I cannot drive to the level of a Leg GT, but I hope Suby offers an even more potent Leg GT for me to spend money on and if the Leg GT is not successful, we will not get more fun Suby toys. If you need a car that gets automatic, brain dead praise, buy the BMW or Acura. Not to say the BMW/Acura engineers have created car magic, but it is to easy to say they are TOPs, without really thinking. I cannot wait to get my GT and give all my view of Leg GT. Right now, I am talking about something I have only test driven. Maybe I will miss my inline BMW engine, but I will not miss the BMW emblem on my forehead.

Well, the Volvo S40 is a clear competitor to the Legacy, so at least they're rated similiarly. If there was a car or two in between them, that would be messed up. As for C&D and all the other US auto mags- I think they're trying so hard to be Top Gear and CAR like in terms of their writing, articles, and reviews, so I really have no respect for any of those car mags. And the lows just prove my point: [quote]Lows: Rather Heavy clutch, junky sound when the doors close (?!?), lots of obvious plastic around the interior (again ?!?!?) The Verdict: A Getaway Subie for bank jobs [/quote] It's the British that usual poke fun at crap plastics in US cars. Junky sound? Definetly sounds like C&D trying too hard to be CAR-like And I bet the heavy clutch had some reference to an Olympic runner's workout or something like that. The thing that really makes it funny is that I swear that in a review of the old Subaru Legacy RSK or one of the other limited edition ones this is what exactly CAR said- that it would be a perfect car for the bank robbers of London. Bank Jobs? You know eventually they're gonna start writing like this- "As for us Yankees, this Subaru saloon is the proper getaway car for the more unsavory elements of American society. As long as my bank isn't blagged, I can recommend this as a choice getaway vehicle to the bank robbers of America." I wouldn't buy an Audi A4 because of reliability, wouldn't buy the TSX because I'm coming off of an Accord and don't want a upscale Accord, so really I just see it as Legacy v. S40.

[quote name='il collaudatore']Well, the Volvo S40 is a clear competitor to the Legacy, so at least they're rated similiarly. If there was a car or two in between them, that would be messed up. As for C&D and all the other US auto mags- I think they're trying so hard to be Top Gear and CAR like in terms of their writing, articles, and reviews, so I really have no respect for any of those car mags. And the lows just prove my point: [quote]Lows: Rather Heavy clutch, junky sound when the doors close (?!?), lots of obvious plastic around the interior (again ?!?!?) The Verdict: A Getaway Subie for bank jobs [/quote] It's the British that usual poke fun at crap plastics in US cars. Junky sound? Definetly sounds like C&D trying too hard to be CAR-like And I bet the heavy clutch had some reference to an Olympic runner's workout or something like that. The thing that really makes it funny is that I swear that in a review of the old Subaru Legacy RSK or one of the other limited edition ones this is what exactly CAR said- that it would be a perfect car for the bank robbers of London. Bank Jobs? You know eventually they're gonna start writing like this- "As for us Yankees, this Subaru saloon is the proper getaway car for the more unsavory elements of American society. As long as my bank isn't blagged, I can recommend this as a choice getaway vehicle to the bank robbers of America." I wouldn't buy an Audi A4 because of reliability, wouldn't buy the TSX because I'm coming off of an Accord and don't want a upscale Accord, so really I just see it as Legacy v. S40.[/quote] I thought the writing in the article was some of the silliest and poorest that C&D has ever done. Really - so silly, it was hard to follow (and I am actually a big C&D fan). I have to agree with your assesment, though! Rob

I am having a hard time believing these reports of the results. Particularly the comment on the clutch and no points for the GT's AWD handling characteristics. There has got to be a catch unless underpowered understeer is the new black.

I agree with those who say "who cares, you like your car and that's all that matters" The people that write those articles have different views about cars, obviously. Actually, I am a old school Honda guy, I was hoping that the TSX and LGT would have been the top 2, in any order. But I am surprised the LGT was #3....that surprises me. But, if they approach the test in a way that appeals to the majority, then the outcome is to be expected, and we should be glad the LGT is low on the list. C&D needs to help the "majority" of people understand what might be best for them. And the fact that a less powerful, more fancy Honda can be on top shows you that the majority of people that drive a car at 7/10ths will never appreciate a LGT. The character of the LGT is more for people who drive +9/10ths. So, a LGT is a little overkill to the majority of the car buying public. They even stated the LGT was best for a bank robbery getaway. That is all the info some of us need....hahahaha :lol: That is like saying "its the car you need if you have a exciting life" and the TSX is the car you need if you just want to get from point A to B in the nicest, flashiest and quietest way. Remember, alot of people will only drive point A to B in heavy traffic, and never take their car out after hours just to drive it after the traffic has died down. I know in Seattle there is little oppurtunity to unleash even a TSX's level of power between the hours of 5am to 8pm.

eww...isnt the volvo a Mazda 3?? id take the Mazda 3...hehe TSX is an accord...but its still a nice car but Legacy getting 3rd place is ridiculous... :evil: :evil: i still want one though

[quote name='TurboAddikt']...the TSX is the car you need if you just want to get from point A to B in the nicest, flashiest and quietest way. [/quote] Well, I drove the TL and the TSX before I bought by LGT. Overall I liked the looks of the TL best, the TSX next and the LGT last. Oh, I get it! You're supposed to DRIVE these things. Hmmm... That's a little different story. The TL rode well and was fairly quiet (about the same as the LGT). But the FWD and the suspension simply couldn't handle the engine. The TSX felt more balanced than the TL and handled well (not as good as the LGT, but well). But the TSX was underpowered, had a harsh ride and was VERY noisy on the road. Lots of tire noise. However NONE of this is relevant. The ONLY thing that is relevant is the size of the company's advertising budget! Get clue ladies and gents! It's not about cars any more. It all about getting advertising dollars. Honda and Volvo spend the bucks. Subie does NOT. Simple as that. The car mags have turned into nothing more than paper-based infomercials. Not worth the paper they are written on. Regards, Dan.

To those who asked, they deffinitely marked down the LGT for the RE92's. Though they did comment that they were good for being all season tires. Both the TSX and A4 I believe had summer only tires on them. They also said there was more body movement in the LGT then they expected. I was surprised that the S40 kept up as well as it did with the LGT. By 120mph the S40 passed the LGT. They did comment on the gas mileage. But had the A4 or Volvo been AWD, I believe the gas mileage would of been similar. I still disagree with this article. The LGT was easily the most bang for the buck. I mean the Mag is called "Car and DRIVER" not "car and casual passenger" <<Though I may start refering to it as such.... -Nick

Sorry to repeat what's already been said, but I just don't get how an underpowered FWD car wins a comparo of sports-oriented sedans. Even Road and Track, which I thought was less hardcore than C&D, basically said the TL just could not be taken seriously as long as it's FWD. Maybe the TSX being lighter and more balanced handles better, and with less power does not have as much torque steer? Funny how most of us tout Subaru's strength as being handling, with AWD, low center of G and all. "Oh yeah, let's see that <fill in the blank> keep up in the twisties!". Yet ironically, in this comparo the Subaru was the quickest in a straight line and apparently lost in handling (and interior, styling, etc). Oh well, maybe we would have taken 2nd with better tires.

Well said -- as always -- MtnSub. The tires hurt. In fact, I wish the mags just put every one of these "comparison" test cars on the same tire make and model. That would eliminate a lot. If they complained about vague steering response in the GT, well, I know why... the RE-92s! That's it. As for body motion... yes, there is some roll. But it's very controlled, not sloppy. Still, that can be fixed in a heartbeat with springs and/or bars. Does anyone who got the mag recall the 5-60 Street-start time??

[quote name='racerdave']Does anyone who got the mag recall the 5-60 Street-start time??[/quote] Volvo 7.1 Subie 7.6 Acura 7.9 Audi 9.4

how old are those editors?