How To Replace Crank & Cam Seals

 

While you're replacing the the timing belt, it's a good idea to get the cam seals replaced and it's also a good idea to pull the driver side AVCS filter out.

 

 

Cam and crank seals, ran me about $35 at the local dealer with tax. Love how cheap oem Subaru seals are!

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256548&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Part Numbers

Crank Seal: 806733030

Intake Cam Seal: 806742160

Exhaust Cam Seal: 806732160

 

Intake Cam Bolt: 13199AA000

Exhaust Cam Bolt: 13199AA010

 

Steps

You will need to pull the AVCS cover off the intake cam gears to get to the 10mm Allen bolts under.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256549&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

I tried to break the bolts loose with the belt on, while I was able to get 3 of the 4 cam bolts loosened this way, I wouldn't advise it because you can jump a tooth and bend some valves. Subaru does have special cam tools, but they are very costly and is not a must if you have a spare belt.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256550&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

These bolts are torqued at about 70-110 ft-lbs, and sadly the 10mm hex drive socket only really comes in 3/8" drive. I broke a few adapters trying to get it to break loose. At the end of the day it's best to buy the 1/2" drive 10mm hex drive socket.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256551&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Another way that worked for me is using the 10mm allen key and a breaker bar. I did end up stripping it slightly, since it's Craftsman replacement is free (stick to lifetime warranty tools for this job!!!). By this bolt I started wrapping the belt in unique ways to hold it still, this is the safest way to loosen these bolts, since other cams can sit in their off positions.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256552&stc=1&d=1507642960

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256553&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Sadly it was too late, I already stripped the insides enough that by the time I got the 10mm allen key it was too late. I dried to drill it out, but there is no room, you can weld lug nut, but I didn't wan to put that much heat on it thus resorted to cutting the bolt off. Once I took one quarter off the bolt head it spun by hand easily!

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256554&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

I finally invested in a seal puller, this is well worth the cost for saving headaches. Intake side is fairly loose thus easy to get the seal puller in.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256555&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Exhaust side was a little tricky, try not to scratch the cam gear shaft.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256556&stc=1&d=1507642960

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256557&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

To install them back I simply use a big socket and tap the seal in, to not get it to go in too far, I will usually tap around the seal with the socket.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256559&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Do keep in mind that there is this misalignment stock, which could make the seal be crooked.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256560&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Crank is by far the easiest to do, just pull the crank gear off and use the puller

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256562&stc=1&d=1507642960

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256563&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Once again, using a socket to punch in, since I couldn't tap the socket around the crank due to low clearance I used an extension to make sure it's flush with the cover.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256564&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Driver side cover removed so that I could get to the AVCS bolt, it's really a good idea to pull that banjo filter while you have the cam gears off.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256565&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

It's a good idea to get new cam bolts since your existing ones will probably be after you are done with them stripped.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256561&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Re-tightening the cam bolts requires you to wrap the belt again to hold the cam steady. FSM calls for 22.1 ft-lbs and then 45* more. For intake cams this translates to about 70ft-lbs, for exhaust cams this translated to over 100ft-lbs. I think intake is lower due to oil presence in the threads.

 

Once I got the bolt to 22.1ft-lbs, I made markings to see how much I need to tighten it more to get 45*.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256566&stc=1&d=1507642960

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256567&stc=1&d=1507642960

 

Reinstall all cam gears, reinstall timing belt and go rest, definitely not an easy job due to the stupid allen bolts.

http://legacygt.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=256558&stc=1&d=1507642960

Edited October 10, 2017 by covertrussian

One question. With the pulleys completely off, how do you keep the camshafts from spinning and bending the valves?

When you take your timing belt off, the driver side cams will usually spin into their off position themselves. I usually hold the sprockets and spin them to off position slowly one by one. Once they are off the lobe you can rotate them quite a bit, just stop spinning it as you feel the lobes hitting the rockers.

Thanks for the excellent guide btw. I'll be doing a timing belt soon but hopefully I won't need to mess with any of these seals. They look like a lot of work!

Hey CR, I'll be doing this in the coming weekends. I noticed someone already commented on how to realign the cams and position the valves. My question is, how do you know which way is closed? Certainly don't want to mess this up. Perhaps it's worth the money to have someone do it.

It's the same as doing the timing belt, if you've ever done one you kind of know. The driver side cams go to their off position when the belt is off, this can be verified by carefully trying to spin one sprocket at a time. When the lobe is on the round portion it will spin easily, when you get to the lift portion you have to put more power into spinning it. Follow the FSM of the spin directions and you will be fine.

It's the same as doing the timing belt, if you've ever done one you kind of know. The driver side cams go to their off position when the belt is off, this can be verified by carefully trying to spin one sprocket at a time. When the lobe is on the round portion it will spin easily, when you get to the lift portion you have to put more power into spinning it. Follow the FSM of the spin directions and you will be fine.

 

I have done a few timing belts. I was concerned about removing all the cams. What you're saying makes sense though. Thanks for the guidance.

One question. With the pulleys completely off, how do you keep the camshafts from spinning and bending the valves?

 

I seem to have misunderstood this question. Once the pulleys are off, the cams should already be in their off position. You can still spin them by hand, but due to much less leverage, it will be much harder.

 

The trick becomes to tighten all sprockets back on. This is where I did it one cam at a time. Put sprocket on, hand tighten the bolt, make sure all other cams are in off position. Tie belt around that one sprocket and torque it down, then make sure this cam is in off position, and go to next cam.

 

By making sure all cams are in their off position and by tightening one at a time, you eliminate the risk of two cams pushing the valves down at the same time, thus minimizing the risk of valves touching.

I seem to have misunderstood this question. Once the pulleys are off, the cams should already be in their off position. You can still spin them by hand, but due to much less leverage, it will be much harder.

 

The trick becomes to tighten all sprockets back on. This is where I did it one cam at a time. Put sprocket on, hand tighten the bolt, make sure all other cams are in off position. Tie belt around that one sprocket and torque it down, then make sure this cam is in off position, and go to next cam.

 

By making sure all cams are in their off position and by tightening one at a time, you eliminate the risk of two cams pushing the valves down at the same time, thus minimizing the risk of valves touching.

 

"I see", said the blind man...

 

Retightening makes total sense now. You're saying be extra careful to keep valves closed when tightening as not to cause interference.

 

How were you able to reset timing. I looked at the FSM but I had little luck.

 

When you re-install the cam sprocket, aren't the timing marks going to be awry? Or does the cam gear only sit one way on the shaft? Are you using the lobe to guess about where the cam timing marks should be in relation to the cam shaft?

That's right, you want all other valves closed just in case your belt slips. The exhaust bolts get tightened over 100lbs.

 

There is a peg in the cam and a notch on the sprocket, you can only put it back on one way, so no worries there. Once everything is bolted up, follow the FSM instructions for rotating the cams and reinstalling the belt.

That's right, you want all other valves closed just in case your belt slips. The exhaust bolts get tightened over 100lbs.

 

There is a peg in the cam and a notch on the sprocket, you can only put it back on one way, so no worries there. Once everything is bolted up, follow the FSM instructions for rotating the cams and reinstalling the belt.

 

 

Confidence restored!

Same goes with the crank belt pulley, only one way it will go on . Just keep the RH pulleys separate from LH ones, but even then I think they might be the same on both sides.

 

You can see the sprockets cut for the peg on the cam here:

http://i160.photobucket.com/albums/t188/covertrussian/Cars/05%20LGT/Engine/General/Engine%20Seals/CIMG0726.jpg

So I started the morning with my STi steering rack swap. Then I went to the oil cooler, then to the crank and cam seals.

 

Got all the new seals in. I just have to torque those babies down tomorrow. I see how you have it set up with the vise grips. What's holding the belt beyond that?

 

I have a cam tool, but that only works with two people and I think I'll be flying solo tomorrow. Actually, now that I think about it, I might be able to fit the cam wrench and have it against the frame for leverage.

Definitely use the frame, especially since you have the right tool for the right job.

 

I wrapped the belt around either the crank or one of the idlers. Just need a stationary item.

I did not do this when I did my timing belt because needed it back on the road but it needed it on the cams would I be able to do this one cam at a time without taking timing belt off or does that large plate need to come off that is between the cam gears and the head?

 

TIA,

Anthony

Large plastic plate doesn't need to come out to get to the seals it (only if your trying to get the banjo filter out). But you can't remove one cam at the time without removing the belt first.

All of the photos have been reuploaded to the site and fixed in the first post.

Here are some videos on pulley removal! I hope this helps. Watch these before damaging anything. ~shaun

 

Crank Pulley Removal:

 

Cam Sprocket Removal:

 

Stop linking to that horrible crank removal how to video. Perfect way to destroy the crank pulley and then help it chew belts after.

 

On the other hand, the cam seal video is good, that's how I removed mine, and show pictured in the first post.

When you make a how to article or video, you take responsibility for showing people on how to do something properly without any damage. That method will have people destroying their crank pulleys, which cost more then the removal tool btw, even if you've done it 100 times just fine.

 

With that out of the way, there are a ton of videos on proper crank pulley removal. I would spend your efforts elsewhere.

I finally did cam seals along with a timing belt job this weekend. Pretty sure they were the originals with 219K on them, and they were not leaking but I figured their days were numbered at this point.

 

The belt wrap & vise grips method worked fine to hold the sprockets while working on the bolts. I did have a proper 1/2" drive 10mm hex bit (Gear Wrench brand) and no damage was done to any of the bolts. That bit is actually impact rated, but mounted to my IR231 it was about 1/3" too long to fit with the A/C condenser in place, so I just used it on a standard breaker bar & torque wrench.

 

On the tightening torque of 22 lb-ft plus 45* rotation...

The intake cam bolts on mine took right at 80 lb-ft to achieve 45*. Threads & bolt face oiled.

The exhaust cam bolts I had run up to well over 130 lb-ft. Same as crankshaft bolt torque, actually a bit higher since I was leaning on that beeyotch beyond the torque wrench clicking, and the bolt had rotated "only" 30-35*. Dry threads & bolt face. I called it good enough, and feared causing damage if I took things any further. I would be rather surprised to see a cam bolt work loose after being torqued that high, as in "wake up tomorrow with my head sewn to the carpet" surprised.

Did you reuse the crank and cam bolts? The reason the crank bolt requires a certain amount of rotation is due to the stock bolt stretching. When it stretches it will hit the inside of the crank and wont fully hold the crank pulley solidly in place.

 

I'm not sure if cam bolts are stretch to fits too, if they are, the same will apply to them too.

I did reuse all crank & cam bolts... this time.

Had no issue with the crank bolt getting the proper rotation at the specified torque and that one has been R&R'ed at least 4 times that I know of. It's a bit more stout than the cam bolts of course. No issues with intake cam bolts either. In other words, oiled threads = no problem hitting rotation spec.

 

I pondered it while I was in there and ultimately decided to accept a few degrees less than specified rotation on the exhaust cam bolts given the torque already applied. I was more worried I'd either snap the 10mm hex bit or damage bolt heads if I continued. I've never had to apply anywhere near that much torque through such a tiny bit on any other vehicle I've worked on. Ever find yourself cranking on something and an inner voice starts questioning your own common sense? It was like that.

 

I also half-pondered a dab of oil on those threads, but then the torque/rotation spec would be different/unknown so I left them dry (exh cams only).

 

I would probably go with new bolts next time, but I have no concerns about them being A-OK from now until whenever I change cam seals again.

I had brand new bolts and I still had that same inner voice. Who knows if I even got to the 45*, as you can see my method was very much so eyeball based :-D...

 

It's been 50k miles and almost 8 years, so I'm almost due for another timing belt, I don't think I'll be touching the cams seals this time heh.