Anyone else done the dreaded 3rd to 2nd downshift with their manual?

Yup I biffed the shift hardcore. I was messing with a pile of junk Lincoln Mark8 and was winding out 3rd gear. Rung up up near the 6K mark and wammo instead of 4th I grab 2nd. AACCk! Wound the little sucker up in a hurry when I let the clutch out. I have no idea how far I brought the rpm's up to when I did it. I hope I read right when someone posted the motor is a non-interference setup. Thank god there are no pushrods. Car sounds normal at idle with the ticking noise on each side that was there before. Motor still seems to run strong of course I whipped on it a couple times for reassurance.

Not yet. I did hit 2nd intentionally today to play with an Audi TT.

Hopefully the consumers' favoring of automatics over manuals will push the industry to phase them out and replace them with the likes of BMW's SMG, and Audi's DSG. Research and development has shifted away from truly manual transmissions and is leading to lower reliability, especially with increasing engine power output. Auto-manu-matic transmission technology has come a long way and will eventually match manual transmission technology.

I was waiting for the "I never did that in my auto" comment:lol: . Does anyone know for shure if the 2.5 turbo motor we have is indeed a non interference design? Figure if I did anything to the motor it would not run right but the idea of possibly hurting something is laying back there. $hit like this will fester in my head:mad:

KTM525,

 

We have it the other way around, I've gone through hell and back a couple times, when I accidentally hit the rev-limiter because either I forgot I was in Manumatic-shift mode and assumed it would automatically shift-up or I was in sport-shift mode and I accidentally hit the gear shifter, which triggered Manumatic-shift mode. They should replace the rev-limiter with the emergency-shift point, 300RPMs before redline, which is available on some American brands like Chrysler.

Bah street Semi Automatics are still a long ways off. They are still too slow and to make it streetable and soft shifting so that peeps wont complain.

 

Give us a WRC sequential transmission that shifts so hard it hurts your teeth now thats performance!!!!

Melayout, In my situation the rev limter becomes useless. The motor is forced beyond the limiter by means of inertia when the clutch is let out and the car is moving too fast. Clipping the limiter is nowhere near as bad.

Bah street Semi Automatics are still a long ways off. They are still too slow and to make it streetable and soft shifting so that peeps wont complain.

 

Give us a WRC sequential transmission that shifts so hard it hurts your teeth now thats performance!!!!

 

Actually, I want it both ways. Streetable for normal driving + hard shifts for agressive backroads. An ECU controlled system could do that.

yeah but in automatics the valve wont shift until you are below redline...

 

You can slap that stick around all you want the Sportshift wont shift until its safe.

 

I have driven an M3 with SMG before its quite unimpressive. Its more of a quicker shifting automatic with steering wheel paddles than a true sequential gearbox. It dosent even have a clutch for those times you wanna have a little bit of fun.

 

True sequentials like ones used in racing wont make it onto the market until they find a way to dampen the shift without sacrificing shift responsiveness and speed. They shift HARD and FAST. It almost seems as if you are breaking somthing evertime you hit the paddle.

Melayout, In my situation the rev limter becomes useless. The motor is forced beyond the limiter by means of inertia when the clutch is let out and the car is moving too fast. Clipping the limiter is nowhere near as bad.

 

Yeah I know, I've experienced hard engine braking on manual cars nefore, which can damage the engine compared to the rev-limiter cutting fuel.

 

RobY, 555 posts.

Hopefully the consumers' favoring of automatics over manuals will push the industry to phase them out and replace them with the likes of BMW's SMG, and Audi's DSG.

 

I really hope this never happens. There are still those of us who love to shift and get a great feeling of excitement on a perfect heel toe. There are already too many electronics in cars, what happened to the pure joy of driving?

 

On the topic of shifting, when going from 3-->4, it's best to use a backhand grip. This way, you are pushing the shifter away from you which makes it very difficult to pop it into second by mistake.

I'm pretty sure the EJ25 is an interference motor. The only non-interference EJ motors I can think of are the EJ22 N/A and possibly the EJ20 N/A (the turbo is definitely an interference motor). I think even the EJ18 is an interference motor.

I really hope this never happens. There are still those of us who love to shift and get a great feeling of excitement on a perfect heel toe. There are already too many electronics in cars, what happened to the pure joy of driving?

 

On the topic of shifting, when going from 3-->4, it's best to use a backhand grip. This way, you are pushing the shifter away from you which makes it very difficult to pop it into second by mistake.

 

 

^ +1

 

I'm with kster, I really like shifting the car manually and if the Legacy only offered an automatic (even if it had a semi-manual mode) I would have chosen another car. At one point I was toying with the idea of getting a hybrid car as an around town vehicle but I was scared off by their use of automatic transmissions. Long live the manual transmission (power to the people).

 

Also, I agree with the kster on the backhand grip, I've used that for rapid 3->4 shifts and it works like a charm.

backhand = palm faces passenger seat?

backhand = palm faces passenger seat?

 

That is the way I shift from third to forth also

 

I have done the WOT 3rd to 2nd shift in my previous LT1 Camaro. Skidded the back tires, got the car sideways a bit merging on the interstate.

 

With AWD I'm sure you pegged the tach at 8500 or so. Hope you didnt hurt anything.

I never had a problem with shifting.. unless I am just being stupid and forgot that I left it in 3rd when really I wanted 1st gear.

 

Try doing a 3-2 O'Neil shift (it's downshifting with left foot braking and rev-matching without pushing in the clutch to get it out-and-back-in gear). Currently I am trying to do on a regular basis to get my shifting to an all new level.

 

Keefe

well if you look at it this way...Chipping your car brings the redline from 6500 to about 7200. So if you caught it before or a little after redline, you're fine. I wouldn't worry about hurting it till around 8000. But i wouldn't go near that unless by accident.

20 + years driving a stick and have never done it. I was always taught to use the palm when shifting as well. That way the gate spring takes care of business for you.

I'm pretty sure the EJ25 is an interference motor. The only non-interference EJ motors I can think of are the EJ22 N/A and possibly the EJ20 N/A (the turbo is definitely an interference motor). I think even the EJ18 is an interference motor.

 

Unless I've missed something over the years, all of the DOHC engines are interference engines. It's inherent in the design.

 

None of the SOHCs are interference engines.

 

OT - I've never done the 3-2 when I really wanted 3-4. Don't know if it's the stability of the STI STS or just lots of practice with Subaru MT boxes.

 

The best thing that you can do in a case like that is to immediately slap the clutch in so you de-load the engine. Then, when engine rpms have dropped, you can shift up through the rev range without putting the engine under stress.

 

Sounds like everything is okay though.

 

SBT

I'm pretty sure the EJ25 is an interference motor. The only non-interference EJ motors I can think of are the EJ22 N/A and possibly the EJ20 N/A (the turbo is definitely an interference motor). I think even the EJ18 is an interference motor.

 

I thought we are a non-interference per the thread below:

 

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2268&highlight=interference

Yeah as soon as I realized what I did the left foot went back on the floorboards. I took it out and whooped it's arse tonight at a local"rice" zone. Seems to be running fine and pulls strong right to 6200. I tore up some Neon RT with a LOUD exhuast haha. I used the backhand technique for the 3-4 shift seems to work great. This will be my new method as I was hitting shifts near redline just fine. Even if the 2.5 is indeed an interference motor if the timing belt did not break or jump out a position then the timing should be on. I cant see any internal parts coming in contact if this is the case.

I think you mean the DREADED 5th to 2nd SHIFT ! HAppened to me 3 times already...most recent yesterday...So I decided to shift to 3rd then 4th if I have to downshift...

Damn thats no joke either. Depends on the situation though. Normal driving going from 5th to 2nd would not be as big a deal. I was topping out in 3rd probably close to 85/90mph i'd guess. If you were doing near those speeds when you did it you heard what I did.

Yeah at those rpms can anyone say valve float? I guess the thing to keep in mind with our engines is that even though they are race-inspired, they're not race-prepped. I'm sure the 5th to 2nd at above average speeds would really stand the car on its nose.

 

SBT

I've never had a problem and I'm a fairly new manual tranny driver. All I do is move it into neutral first and allow the shifter to center itself, then down to 4th. I do it real quick but it's a lot more accurate that way.