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STI short throw shifter....worth it?


Driver72

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I went and had a look at the new 3.0R Spec B Liberty here in Australia on the weekend. The throw in the 6MT is very long I have to say and very noticable. Im sure that the short throw STi setup would certainly help and assist in making it a lot more pleasureable to drive. My sister has it in her MY02 WRX and loves it.
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The stock shifter is smooth, still precise, with slightly longer throws than the STi short shifter, which does have a stiffer, more mechanical feel that also requires slightly higher effort to shift. Now, people might mistake that more mechanical feeling for a greater precision, but that isn't so. It must also be said that the stock shifter fits the feel of the car better than the STi short shifter, IMHO. It's smooth, positive and fluid, like our Leggies. I've only felt just-installed short shifters. I'm not sure if the STi short shifter loosens up and becomes smoother or not. The one in my WRX didn't. It was smooth, but I much prefer the feel of the stock GT shifter to the setup I had in my WRX. And I much preferred that setup to a stock WRX. If you can, try before you buy. That is, row a car with the stocker, then row a car with the shorty. Kevin
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Thanks guys, I went ahead and ordered the car with the short throw shifter. I did drive the stock LGT shifter and the only thing I felt was the stick itself was a bit tall. I used to drive a VW so I'm familiar with the "rubbery" feel and the longish throws. I'm sure I'll like the STI short throw as well, I like the clunk-clunk mechanical feel as well. And with the shorter stalk and the Momo shift knob I'm having installed at the port, it should be all good. I didn't order the STI pedals though. That wouldn't fit the car ONE BIT, and would probably just look silly in a near-luxury GT car. I figured the short throw shifter can only decrease acceleration time with the quicker, shorter throws as well. It would be interesting to see someone performance test the car with the stock shifter, than have the STI short throw shifter installed and then retest the car the same day and see if acceleration and track times improve because of quicker shifts. Probably wouldn't be much, but it would add up over a track race, and in the 1/4 it might shave a tenth off!
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It feels a little less notchy from my WRX with Perrin short shifter adapter.. I think it's a little bit harder to get the car to be able to do clutchless shifting.. (I was practicing 5th downfshift 4th, without a grind). Keefe
Keefe
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I had the shifter installed before I picked mine up on July 2nd. After a couple of weeks I called the dealer to make sure they had installed it. I kind of remember the test drives and the stock one feeling like my last 2 GT's, spongy. I have Skunk2 short throw shifters in both of my Honda Civic's. They have a much better feel then the STI. I will say the STI feels a bit better then stock. The spongy feel is gone. It's just not as short as I expected.

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I drove around with the stock shifter for about a week, then got the STS installed. I think its worth it and more. I love how much more precise it is, and also the quicker shifting. Makes the whole car feel more sporty in some way. It is a little notchier though, and reverse is a little harder to get into now, but its not as bad as the WRX's
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[quote name='agctr']So Euclid, did you get it install prior to delivery?[/quote] Yes.. It seems most of the LGT's in my area come to the dealership with the short shifter, momo shift knob, and sti pedals. Non of the dealerships even had any LGT's without the ss kit.
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[quote name='powbmps']The short shifter shortens the throws, but is it physically shorter than the stock shifter? A side by side comparison would probably have to me made to determine this. Thanks, Chris S.[/quote] I was purely going off of looks from the brouchere (sp) I'm guessing the picture with the Momo shift knob on it has the STI short throw, I could be wrong though. But based on geometry alone, one of the ways to shorten the throw of the shifter is for the shifter stalk to be shorter. I would think the STI short throw shifter stalk is also at least a 1/2 inch shorter than the stock shifter stalk.
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STi and stock shifter are the same height. I didn't measure, but when I rowed both, my hand was in the same spot relative to the steering wheel. The Momo knob sits lower than the stock knob, which probably explains the height difference. Shorties simply change the lever bend and fulcrum point to alter the throws. Lever height doesn't really change the throws, though for some odd reason it changes the perceived throw length. I remember putting that same Momo knob on my WRX's short shifter and thinking "Boy, these throws are shorter." Then I rowed a WRX with the same STi short shifter but with a stock knob and nope, same throw length. Kevin
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[quote name='gtguy'] Shorties simply change the lever bend and fulcrum point to alter the throws. Lever height doesn't really change the throws, though for some odd reason it changes the perceived throw length. Kevin[/quote] Kevin, lever height WILL change the distance your hand has to travel. Think about it this way, if the stalk coming out of the lower center console was only 2 inches long, the forward to rear shift would only move a few inches. Now if the shift stalk was a broom stick that shot up to nearly the roof, the distance your hand would travel if you were grabbing the top of the stalk shifting from first to second would practically punch the rear seat passenger in the face. That's precisely the reason people cut length off of their shifters, and another reason why people change out their tall shifter knobs to short stubby ones. The quicker your hand can get from point A to point B the quicker the shift will be.
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[quote name='Driver72'][quote name='gtguy'] Shorties simply change the lever bend and fulcrum point to alter the throws. Lever height doesn't really change the throws, though for some odd reason it changes the perceived throw length. Kevin[/quote] Kevin, lever height WILL change the distance your hand has to travel. Think about it this way, if the stalk coming out of the lower center console was only 2 inches long, the forward to rear shift would only move a few inches. Now if the shift stalk was a broom stick that shot up to nearly the roof, the distance your hand would travel if you were grabbing the top of the stalk shifting from first to second would practically punch the rear seat passenger in the face. That's precisely the reason people cut length off of their shifters, and another reason why people change out their tall shifter knobs to short stubby ones. The quicker your hand can get from point A to point B the quicker the shift will be.[/quote] Yeah, yeah, so I flunked geometry. Rub it in, alright? :lol: All I can add is that the shift won't be any quicker. The lever travel will be shorter, but the shift will be the same, because the transmission is the transmission. Kevin
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[quote name='gtguy'][quote name='Driver72'][quote name='gtguy'] Shorties simply change the lever bend and fulcrum point to alter the throws. Lever height doesn't really change the throws, though for some odd reason it changes the perceived throw length. Kevin[/quote] Kevin, lever height WILL change the distance your hand has to travel. Think about it this way, if the stalk coming out of the lower center console was only 2 inches long, the forward to rear shift would only move a few inches. Now if the shift stalk was a broom stick that shot up to nearly the roof, the distance your hand would travel if you were grabbing the top of the stalk shifting from first to second would practically punch the rear seat passenger in the face. That's precisely the reason people cut length off of their shifters, and another reason why people change out their tall shifter knobs to short stubby ones. The quicker your hand can get from point A to point B the quicker the shift will be.[/quote] Yeah, yeah, so I flunked geometry. Rub it in, alright? :lol: All I can add is that the shift won't be any quicker. The lever travel will be shorter, but the shift will be the same, because the transmission is the transmission. Kevin[/quote] Okay, sorry to rub it in again, but I think you are wrong here too. Like my example above about the shift stalk length. If the car is in first gear and someone who has the two inch shift stalk was to shift the car into 2nd as fast as they could would do it a WHOLE lot faster than the guy with the broom stick length shift stalk. Even though the transmission is the same. It's the simple reason that the distance your hand has to travel between gears is less. The distance between 1st and 2nd gear might only be a couple of inches for the guy with the 2 inch shifter stalk, but a couple feet for the guy with the broom stick length stalk. So even if the "STI short throw" shifter stalk is only an inch lower, the distance the drivers hand has to travel between gears will be less, therefore the quicker the gear change will take place, therefore the quicker you can engage each gear. I'm also guessing that the STI short throw shifter, makes that distance less as well. So combined with the less distance the shift is AND a shorter shifter stalk, you should be able to significantly cut down the time between shifts. Otherwise, what would be the point of having a "short throw shifter?" For a couple hundred bucks it seemed like a very cheap performance upgrade.
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That is absoultely not true - the internals of the transmission are not changed at all and that is what dictates how long (or short) a shift can take. A person could move the stock shifter faster than the transmission can complete the shift, so the short shifter will not allow faster shifts, it will allow a different shift feel. The short shifter is a modification that will make the shift feel different, that can be good, bad or indifferent, but it isn't faster.
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[quote name='rao']That is absoultely not true - the internals of the transmission are not changed at all and that is what dictates how long (or short) a shift can take. A person could move the stock shifter faster than the transmission can complete the shift, so the short shifter will not allow faster shifts, it will allow a different shift feel. The short shifter is a modification that will make the shift feel different, that can be good, bad or indifferent, but it isn't faster.[/quote] Thank you. Further, I would bet that much engineering went into deciding how short to make the lever throw to prevent precisely the sort of thing that rao is describing; that is, someone yanking the lever through the gates so quickly that it, in effect, "outruns" the transmission, and grinds. Kevin
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[quote name='rao']That is absoultely not true - the internals of the transmission are not changed at all and that is what dictates how long (or short) a shift can take. A person could move the stock shifter faster than the transmission can complete the shift, so the short shifter will not allow faster shifts, it will allow a different shift feel. The short shifter is a modification that will make the shift feel different, that can be good, bad or indifferent, but it isn't faster.[/quote] And I'd have to disagree with that. The transmission itself does not dictate how long a shift throw is. And a person could not move the shifter faster than the tranny can complete the shift. As soon as the shifter goes from point "A" to point "B" (1st to 2nd gear) the shift is complete, the clutch can be let out and the transmission will be engaged into that next gear. The tranny won't say, "hold on their turbo, you rowed that shifter too fast for me, you are going to have to wait a second so I can engage at a slower speed." It's pure geometry. Here's another example: Think of a light switch. A switch that has the usual little 1/2 inch "lever" on it, it can be flicked in a split second and the light comes on. Now think if that "lever" was 2 feet long! It would take you A LOT longer to "flick" the switch. Actually, it would require more of a tug. But when that lever goes from point "A" to point "B" the light will still come on at the same time. It's the THROW that take longer, not the engagement of the light (or transmission). I could give you a bunch of examples like this. The faster you get that shift stalk from 1st to 2nd gear, the faster you can release the clutch and engage the transmission. Shifts in the STI short throw shifter WILL take less time and therefore made faster. Hey, I just looked at the Subaru brouchere and this is what it states, "significantly reduces shift throw lengths for crisper shifts and sportier driving." The key words there is "significantly reduces shift throw lengths" This means you can get from one gear to the next quicker, which means faster acceleration, by way of being "out of gear" for less time. I'm glad I ordered it in my Legacy, again it's a cheap warrantied performance upgrade.
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