'07 or '08? MT or AT?

I am parting with my '04 STI and looking at the LGT. I generally love the STI, but am tired of a few things: (1) getting beat up on bad Oregon roads (and passengers complaining about the ride...read: wife), (2) no rear-seat pass-through/fold-down (seems petty, but come on, would it have been that hard?), (3) Five-0 just assuming that I am speeding at all times, and the big one (4) every teenage boy going out of his way to tell me how cool my car is and asking me to "light 'em up." I know I will miss the handling on mountain roads and the superior braking, but I hardly ever use all 300 ponies. Now that you know where I am coming from, here are my questions:

 

1. Is there a big difference between the '07 and '08? I think I can get a better deal on the '07, plus there are more of them available right now, especially with the MT (see Question 2).

 

2. 5MT or AT? I love the 6MT in my STI (and, yes, I do know about the Spec B, but I can't seem to justify the extra $$$ for the 6MT and Bilsteens only; let me know if you think this is a mistake). The problem is that I have heard the 5MT is really "unrefined." I am not opposed to an AT, in fact, I do sit in stop-and-go traffic a lot, where this would be nice. Is the 5MT really that crappy? Is the AT a power suck?

 

Thanks,

Rob

The Subaru 5MT is very easy to drive IMO, I am happy with it. It would be nice if it was a little more precise, but I don't think you will mind driving it in city stop/go.

 

Does the mrs. not drive MT? All the more reason to get the 5MT.

Hey man, just bought an '08 myself, and I pondered the same questions as you! Hopefully I can be of some help to you and others. FYI, for pictures of my '08, check out my VBGarage coming soon!

 

Quick FYI before I start: My dealer told me he could get me into an '08 for a little (+-1000) more than an '07, he said I might get a half point higher as an interest rate (I have near perfect credit). I know how to drive a manual very well from driving other peoples cars (mustang GT, Corvette), but never owned one personally. I only test drove a MT '08 when I looked, and I bought a AT '08, so I can give you my experience with that.

 

At the time I bought mine (2wk ago) with the '07 you get a $1000 rebate (in New England), little better deal cause '08s are coming out, and a few less features for your sacrifice.

 

With the '08 you miss out on the rebates and pricing, but you get some other amenities in terms of gadgetry, and some slightly different styling details. I was also told that an '08 with the same miles as an '07 4 years down the road, persay, would be worth more in terms of resale. Let me elaborate on the gadgetry:

 

Gadgetry: Most noted are the steering wheel controls. Full control for the radio on the left, cruise control on the right, paddle shifters flank the back of the wheel (AT Only), bottom left has controls to cycle through the on-screen display on the dash, and bottom right has a button that shifts the SI-Drive modes. You literally never have to take your hands off the wheel. In an AT, if you hit the paddle shifters in Drive (not auto-stick) it will still enter manual mode until you stop shifting for over a few seconds and it goes back into Drive. Great for passing on the highway, slowing down, or 'spirited driving'. Next amenitiy (which I told wasn't on the '07 but someone can correct me if I'm wrong) is the '08 has the folding rear seat you were looking for. It also has a pass through in the rear armrest to get to the trunk without folding the seat. Next (I was also told is new for '08) is Subaru took some European styling cues and hid the trunk arms outside of the trunk compartment. This means you can load your trunk with as much luggage as will fit and not have to worry about the trunk arms hitting it when you close the trunk. Nifty. Not sure if this was on '07, but you can lock your trunk from the driver floor, next to the gas/trunk open latches. Also nifty Off the top of my head that's it for gadgetry.

 

As for styling cues, there is a new front bumper, while similar to '07, the bottom sticks out further forward for a more aggressive look IMO. Looks similar to the bumper alot of people trade out for on their '07. Grill is slightly different, with the chrome wings being attached to, I believe, a slightly larger centerpiece (same size emblem). The headlights are also a little different shape (more of a point on the outside top corner), so '07 eyelids won't fit. The rear bumper follows suit of the front, with a slightly wider, more aggressive shape IMO. It has 2 red reflectors flanking each side, which do not light up as brake lights. Some people like them, some don't, I think they look great. The brake lights are slightly slimmer (1"+- maybe) than an '07 (top to bottom), and have a chrome strip of trim on the bottoms. Lastly the blinkers on the side view mirrors are smaller top to bottom, as opposed to filling the bottom half of the mirror for '07.

 

In regards to the AT v MT question, I contemplated that for a while before making my purchase. When I looked at my local dealer all they had was a first '08 in a MT. I test drove that and I was truly exhilerated! But I TEST DROVE it. I wailed through 1st, 3d, then as much of 5th as I could (I think I worried the salesman). It was FUN!! But like you, I drive an hour both ways to work, and the AT sounded nice too. I had driven auto-shift cars before, from an 05 Infiniti FX45 to a 07 Hyundai Sonata to a 98' Jetta turbo, and they weren't bad especially the newer ones. So I started to think, a friggen '08 "sport/luxury" sedan has to have a refined sportshift. Unforunately my dealer didn't have one to test drive. Ultimately I went with my gut, and figured the AT would be nice and refined, and more suited to my driving situations.

 

I DO NOT regret my decision to get an AT. ( I can here the 5EAT haters typing now!!! LMAO ) I have only 1200 miles on the car, so I haven't completely "opened her up", but I've gotten fairly close over the past hundred miles or so, and this thing does not disappoint. It is still fast as he77, from a standstill, or on the highway passing someone (I hit 105 without even knowing it!) And like I said, I still haven't given her everything she's got, but it's already exhilerating now, just like when i drove the MT. And I know that there's more power when I decide she's broke in enough to mash that pedal to the floor.

 

The AT in Drive shifts smoothly between gears, and the shift points change when you change the SI Drive. In INTELLIGENT my shift points are about 3000RPM, SUPER SPORT about 4500RPM, SPORT# about 5500+RPM (ballpark, to give you an idea). The sportshift is good too once you get the hang of the timing of the shift. By that I mean the car fully shifts into the next gear (going up anyhow) a second or so after you tap it up. About the same time it would take for a gear shift in an MT. Once you get the timing down, you can get this thing to rip very, very well with the sportshift. Plus you get the paddle shifters (very cool) so you can shift without taking your hands off the wheel. Like I mentioned before you can hit them while in drive and it will kick into sportshift and automatically change back into drive when you stop shifting for a few seconds. Great for that 'burst of spirits' when wanted. Like I mentioned, this car is still exhilerating to drive!

 

BTW: an '08 MT & AT get the same mileage 18/24. Look at Subaru.com. I get 22.5 per the dash info.

 

Do I regret buying an AT? He77 no!! Is it still scary fast? He77 yes!! But I didn't buy the car for a racecar, and neither would you I would think if your trading in an STi so I wasn't worried if I lost 'a little' with an AT, but I don't even notice it! Loving myself while I'm sitting in traffic (city/highway) 40% of the time! Other 60%, I sportshift! IMO an AT does not suffer noticably, and was the best decision ever for me.

 

Bottom Line: MT v AT is a decision to make based on personal preference, and your expected driving situations. I trusted my gut, and I couldn't be happier! Good luck with whichever you choose, you won't be disappointed either way! And welcome to the club!

Rob,

 

Well I cant say for sure about '07 GT's but when I went looking for a MT '07 SE in April the dealer said there was nothing in WA or OR (this was at a dealer near Bellevue, WA) Granted MT GT's are higher production vehicles than MT SE's, they are still going to be hard to find considering that they probably havent been producing them since Jan or Feb. But good luck to you.

 

I'm not 100% sure, but one of the main differences between 07 and 08 are that I believe SI drive is now standard on the GT. A magazine article I read reports that there more midrange torque now exists as did in the 07's, but not sure if that only applies to the 2.5 non turbo motor.

 

Aside from that, there are cosmetic differences in the front fascia and rear end treatments as well as a slightly revised look on the inside with fake wood/metal going across the lower dashboard whereas it used to only be on the center console.

 

Per your question about the MT or the AT, I dont know what the STi's clutch was like but the 07 and 08 legacys have a very close to the floor catch point, in my opinion anyways. That could be a good or bad thing. If you choose to buy an 08 I believe if you wait till July or so you will get VDC standard if you purchase the AT. I test drove an auto LGT and in sportshift mode its one of the quickest of its competitors at shifting. Hopefully some of that helps. Im sure people with LGT's will add more, im just waiting for my lowly SE in a few weeks.

One more thing... the salesman called this "The Gentlemen's WRX"! I thought that was a good one!

 

Instead of pimpled teenagers screaming at your car it will be gorgeous women!

 

(Don't show the Mrs. that, she won't let you buy one!) LMAO.

In addition to what BigInALegacy wrote, here are some other features on the 2008 models which aren't available on the 2007 models you're considering. The 2008s have a telescoping steering wheel column and a tire pressure monitoring system. The 2008 5EAT has VDC and a revised shifting strategy which, among other things, blips the throttle on downshifts in order to match revs.

Runner, I had the same issue. In a '07 Brilliant Silver there was something like 6-8 in all of New England, and 2 or 3 as AT. '08 was about the same, with more to come obviously, but because I jumped on the '08 so early, the availability was still limited there. They got mine from a dealership in Vermont, 50 or so miles away, and I waited almost 2 weeks

The differences between the '07 vs '08 are mainly cosmetic. You do get a telescopic steering wheel and steering wheel controls. I also think you can choose which satellite radio service you want on the '08's vs being stuck with only one on the '07.

 

'07's have the mp3 stereo + aux in, fold down rear seats, SI Drive, locking trunk, etc. that the '08's have.

 

The '05-'06's are different in more ways. They have a different turbo, no fold down seats, a cat in the uppipe, no mp3 or aux-in, different headlights/foglights.

 

I guess what I am saying is that if you are stuck between and '07 and '08, your main concern should be what style you like the best. The other stuff is trivial as far as I'm concerned but you may have that one thing that you can't live without, like a telescopic steering wheel for instance. Also consider resale like the salesman said but I don't think it'll make THAT much of a difference.

 

The MT vs AT is preference. A HUGE change on the '08 AT is the VDC. I don't think you can get that on an '07...

Correct about VDC guys, standard on an '08 AT, not so on the MT (may not even be available, but don't quote me there). I forgot to mention too, on the '08 the fog lights are a bit larger than the '07.

Thanks for all the responses so far.

 

Per your question about the MT or the AT, I dont know what the STi's clutch was like but the 07 and 08 legacys have a very close to the floor catch point, in my opinion anyways. That could be a good or bad thing.

 

The 2002 WRX that I had was the same with the clutch release point (PITA, IMHO). In fact, I had 2 clutches replaced under warranty because of the famous WRX clutch chatter. Not as bad with the STI.

 

One more thing... the salesman called this "The Gentlemen's WRX"! I thought that was a good one!

 

Instead of pimpled teenagers screaming at your car it will be gorgeous women!

 

(Don't show the Mrs. that, she won't let you buy one!) LMAO.

 

Oh, yeah. My wife loves driving the STI (hates riding in it though). I thought it was because she fashions herself as a street racer (She can't seem to keep it under 85). But, maybe it's because she gets all the attention from the college-aged boys...

Correct about VDC guys, standard on an '08 AT, not so on the MT (may not even be available, but don't quote me there).

 

From the Subaru Build Your Own section of the website: "Manual 6-speed with VDC (Standard Equipment for this Model)"

 

Unless their online configurator is wrong, you can get a manual with VDC, but only in the SpecB trim...

There you go... VDC standard on a Spec-B, wonder if optional on a 5MT though?

 

Would VDC be something to be desired? The salesman kind of pitched it to me as a 'not so important' option, almost as if he was impartial to having it, but it was standard so I didn't really care.

 

BTW: From this post I learned my steering wheel is telescoping!!! That's the ba77s!! I moved it up/down, but didn't realize it came out and in. Now I can sit back comfortably, rest that puppy in my lap, and bomb down I190!! Learn something new every day!

There you go... VDC standard on a Spec-B, wonder if optional on a 5MT though?

 

Would VDC be something to be desired? The salesman kind of pitched it to me as a 'not so important' option, almost as if he was impartial to having it, but it was standard so I didn't really care.

 

From what I understand it really helps people that can't drive in adverse conditions. I don't know the mechanics behind it though. There was much discussion on if it detracted from the "driving experience" but I think you can turn it off via a button so I guess you might as well have it. Don't quote me but I think it's been mandated to be on all cars starting in 2010 or something.

Correct.. you can disable it via a button below left of the stering wheel. it defaults to ON. The salesman did tell me for 'spirited driving' on dry days im better off turning it off.

 

He gave me the scenario of sitting ona snowy hill and pressing the gas. Rather than slide, the vdc would sense things like steering wheel direction and individual wheel traction and try to make the car go where the steering wheel points by giving more power to tires with grip. Thats my understanding of VDC, someone can correct me if i was misled.

Oh... and he also implied that VDC was a substantial portion of the cost of the AT vs MT ($1500 for the AT i think), so that will suck if it does become mandated, all cars get a little more expensive i would think.

One more difference with the '08 v '07, dunno if you have kids, but the '08 has a 'new improved' child safety seat restraint system. What is 'new and improved'? I dunno, I don't have kids or a car seat, but the salesman told me that. I think it's just the placement/design of the seat anchors.

Also the 08's get a nonblue interior right?

Also the 08's get a nonblue interior right?

 

 

...correct, the '08 Spec B's have a black alcantara interior. Imo the blue of the '07 looked better, but both are nice.

some more info, the 07's seats look nicer with the 2 tone, the 08's are plain, the 08s look nicer outside but i hear the ride in the 07's are smoother, and you loose a couple mpg's on the 08 from the 07

some more info, the 07's seats look nicer with the 2 tone, the 08's are plain, the 08s look nicer outside but i hear the ride in the 07's are smoother, and you loose a couple mpg's on the 08 from the 07

 

I saw an '08 today and it was NICE from the back...when I got around to the front I wasn't so pleased. I don't like what they did to the nose. They took the pissed off frown of the '05-'07 and turned it into a smile.

 

I think the mpg rating is because of a different rating system in '08. They will all get the same mileage. If you refactor the '05-'07 on the new system you should get the same mpg rating as the '08's.

Just reading a review for the '08... here's something else:

 

For ’08, Subaru fitted A-pillar braces and stiffer bushings. The more rigid body and tighter suspension endow the LGT with almost STi-quality handling– though the LGT’s long body occasionally gives corner carvers the unsettling feeling that the rear end is about to beat them to the finish line.

If I was a Legacy GT I'd be smiling too!! I smile every time I get in mine!

 

I personally think the front looks nice, still mean looking. Gotten TONS of compliments in the 4 weeks I've had it.

If I was a Legacy GT I'd be smiling too!! I smile every time I get in mine!

 

I personally think the front looks nice, still mean looking. Gotten TONS of compliments in the 4 weeks I've had it.

 

To each their own I guess. I think the front is more luxury car than mean looking. It still looks nice, I just prefer the old style.

 

That is cool that they stiffened up the A piller and used different bushings. It'd be nice to have near STi quality handling!

Yeah, definitely personal preference. Either way the OP will still be getting a nice vehicle!

 

Let us know what you decide!!

Yeah, definitely personal preference. Either way the OP will still be getting a nice vehicle!

 

Let us know what you decide!!

 

TRUE DAT! If the OP goes with an automatic, my recommendation would be to go '08 and get the VDC. If he decides to go with an manual, exterior styling should be the deciding factor.