How long should a decent shop take to do a stage 2 tune?

Greetings all. I tried searching but unfortunately the terms are pretty generic and came up with nothing, so sorry if this is a common question.

 

I am going stage 2 with all of the typical components. I am debating on if I should pay for an e-tune from somebody like Infamous, or spend $150/hr on a dyno tune locally. I would be okay with paying for 2 hours of tuning, $300 seems worth it to me to have them do everything and have a piece of paper with exactly how much power I am making.

 

Question is, how long should a decent shop take to tune my car? I don't want to get bent over on the price either because they want to cheat me or take so long because they don't know what they are doing.

 

Thanks

It really depends on the shop.

 

Most shops that have tuned a similar car as yours before should have a good base map to work from. This really cuts down on the time. Figure maybe 1-1.5 hours.

 

If they have never tuned an LGT before, it will take some time to build the map. I would steer clear of them in that case.

 

One thing to make sure is that you do a good pre-dyno inspection. Make sure you have no intake leaks and your car is ready. Diagnostic time on the dyno is still typically $150 per hour since you are still tying up their dyno.

I just scheduled an appointment for a dyno tune here locally and it's $500 with pre-dyno inspection included. I plan to have the car looked over again before I go, and it will get a final look with the tuner. I was told it's 2 hours for the tune, and that's a stage 3 with upgraded fueling. A dyno tune from a good tuner should be the best way to go. Infamous has been having issues with tunes lately, I'm 5 months into my e-tune and still not completed. I decided last week to just forget about it and finally move on. I'm one of several here that have been waiting months for my etune to finish with Shamar (Infamous), with no responses for revisions for up to 6 weeks at a time. There are many frustrated people with it, you can read up on the 'who's happy with their infamous tune' thread in the tuning section here and judge for yourself.

IME good shops charge flat rate, not per hour. That's how I charge for tunes. Its best for everyone.

Dyno tuning at stage 2 is pretty pointless IMO. The set-ups are so similar between cars that what was learned in the past applies very well to the next car. There is so little gain to be had because getting 1 or 2% more out of a set-up that only makes say 260whp is a mere 3 to 5whp... something you'd barely notice in the seat of your pants.

Save the money for dyno time until you swap the turbo.

 

Pro-tune OTOH is very worthwhile. If I were to offer an OTS tune for a car like the LGT (which I don't) it would have to be dumbed down to a certain extent to allow for various factors out of my control and probably beyond the owner's ability or interest level to monitor. Having seat time in the car allows me to tailor the tune to the customer's requirements such as pushing for all-out power, going for the flattest torque curve or highest reliability.

In answer to the time question, it depends on the car. Those in top shape that behave predictably can be finished and out the door in an hour. Those with mechanical issues or other quirks can take a whole day and in some cases several weeks if faults get harder to diagnose.

If you want a before and after comparison beyond what your butt-dyno tells you ask for a Virtual Dyno plot. Torque and power can be calculated from the rate at which the car accelerates and when two pulls are compared, two that were done on the same day, at the same test track, with the same weight in the car, it is a very useful tool to see what the changes were.

IME good shops charge flat rate, not per hour. That's how I charge for tunes. Its best for everyone.

Charging per hour is not a sign a shop is not good. IMHO it's smart because it takes into consideration some cars are easier to tune than others. Cobb also charges per hour.

every stage two i have seen tuned took at least an hr either on the dyno or street tune. It is also how long my stg 2 street tune took.

Tune should take less than 2 hours. Most shops charge a flat rate for tunes taking less than 2 hours and per hour after the first 2 hours (like we do and so does Cobb).

Charging per hour is not a sign a shop is not good. IMHO it's smart because it takes into consideration some cars are easier to tune than others. Cobb also charges per hour.

I'm not a fan of this, as how long it takes is up to the tuner's discretion, not standardized.

I'm not a fan of this, as how long it takes is up to the tuner's discretion, not standardized.

 

Which is why for a stage1 or 2 tune, a tuner familiar with the cars should be done in 2 hours or less. Hence the "standard" price of $450. Tuners dont want to take extra time on a tune to run up a bill. Dynos are not cheap to operate and many shops with a dyno do not have the time to be wasting. Some have a back log of cars waiting to get dyno time. If the tuner is renting the dyno time from the shop, they are paying by the hour as well.

 

There is no such thing as a standardized tune. That is called Off The Shelf.

Which is why for a stage1 or 2 tune, a tuner familiar with the cars should be done in 2 hours or less. Hence the "standard" price of $450. Tuners dont want to take extra time on a tune to run up a bill. Dynos are not cheap to operate and many shops with a dyno do not have the time to be wasting. Some have a back log of cars waiting to get dyno time. If the tuner is renting the dyno time from the shop, they are paying by the hour as well.

 

There is no such thing as a standardized tune. That is called Off The Shelf.

Right, but there are many times where I will take my time tweaking things. Sure, a standard 'stage 2' car takes about an hour or so to do. But I would stay away from shops with 'a back log of cars', as this is when rush hackjobs happen. I'm just getting at the fact that there is no standardization.

 

Do regular mechanical shops charge by how long a job takes them to do? No! It's all flat rate. Even though every job takes a slightly different time, and sometimes things happen like bolts break, but that doesn't change the price.

 

There are ways to minimize dyno time anyways thru different mapping methods (which I see some tuners leave as the 'final tune', which I don't agree with, but that's up to them, and I'm not going to trash talk). I use it as tool, not to finalize the tune.

Right, but there are many times where I will take my time tweaking things. Sure, a standard 'stage 2' car takes about an hour or so to do. But I would stay away from shops with 'a back log of cars', as this is when rush hackjobs happen. I'm just getting at the fact that there is no standardization.

 

Do regular mechanical shops charge by how long a job takes them to do? No! It's all flat rate. Even though every job takes a slightly different time, and sometimes things happen like bolts break, but that doesn't change the price.

 

There are ways to minimize dyno time anyways thru different mapping methods (which I see some tuners leave as the 'final tune', which I don't agree with, but that's up to them, and I'm not going to trash talk). I use it as tool, not to finalize the tune.

 

your comparisons are not "correct".

 

First, the most reputable tuning shops in the nation have back logs. They all charge an appointment down payment. Dont arrive, arrive late or have mechanical issues on the dyno that do not allow completion of your tune/pulls and your down payment is not refunded. They are that busy. The dynos are booked 8-10 hours per day 5-6 days per week. They are not rushing. They are not hacks.

 

Second, many mechanical shops (including my own) do charge by how long a job takes. We do not use the Mitchell standard rates. Dealerships do that. On many service items our rates are 50% below dealership rates. We also charge more for broken/rusted bolts. It says in writing on our listed standard rates that all rates quoted are for cars with no rusted/broken hardware.

 

Most tuners do minimize dyno time. They dont want to be on the dyno all day with the same car. Your generalizations make it sound as if there is an industry of wolfs waiting to bleed you dry.

Right, but there are many times where I will take my time tweaking things. Sure, a standard 'stage 2' car takes about an hour or so to do. But I would stay away from shops with 'a back log of cars', as this is when rush hackjobs happen. I'm just getting at the fact that there is no standardization.

 

Do regular mechanical shops charge by how long a job takes them to do? No! It's all flat rate. Even though every job takes a slightly different time, and sometimes things happen like bolts break, but that doesn't change the price.

 

There are ways to minimize dyno time anyways thru different mapping methods (which I see some tuners leave as the 'final tune', which I don't agree with, but that's up to them, and I'm not going to trash talk). I use it as tool, not to finalize the tune.

 

This almost sounds like a catch 22 here. If a shop has a back log of dyno tunes then stay away. But then if you go to a shop that does dyno tunes but nobody goes there, is that necessarily good? If a shop has a backlog and is organized about it, I would guess it means they're good at what they do. Why else would people go there? They should have a pretty good idea of what needs to be done and be pretty quick and thorough. Plus, you can usually find out people's satisfaction from online forums. I've eaten at restaurants where there is a backlog of people at lunch time. They didn't cut corners on the food.

 

Just to play devil's advocate though. Shops that charge by the hour may stretch the tune out to get more money. Shops that are back logged may cut corners. How about a shop that charges a flat rate then? What's in it for them to take their time? They have your money, why not just cut corners to get it out asap and move on to the next car? Half hour, one hour, or two hours, it's a flat rate so what do they have to gain? Msprank seems to have said it best. You leave a deposit, get your time slot (2 hours), and if you don't show up you lose your money. Shops get back logged and that's how you deal with it. Appointments, deposits, show up. That's organized.