Ksport BBK 8 piston kit

Any have any experience with these on a Legacy, after a quick search they don't seem very popular from Stateside. I can get a set brand new locally for a great price, a lot of the Impreza guys in UK use this kit and only complaint i can see is that the supplied pads are rubbish but, not a major deal breaker there.

 

http://bbs.scoobynet.com/attachments/group-buys/3117d1255529744-ksport-brake-kit-gb-330mm-kit-699-356mm-kit-799-img_3919sm.jpg

 

http://bbs.scoobynet.com/attachments/group-buys/3119d1255529744-ksport-brake-kit-gb-330mm-kit-699-356mm-kit-799-img_3922sm.jpg

Those look like overkill, which i love.

 

The only thing is you better hope they are better made then the coil overs which tend to just pop and leak after 6 months of use.

whats a great price?

whats a great price?

 

well great price for Irish prices! 699 GBP for the kit, considering not much 2nd hand Brembo kits appear over here, it a good option for new kit and with the sterling rate at the moment that helps!

 

I heard there was lot of issues with their coilovers, i had a set of D2 coilovers(sister company of K-sport) on my Altezza and 3 of the seals went, but i know numerous people that have these brakes fitted for 2 years + on big bhp cars that see lots of track time and no issues, apart form the supplied pads not being great, i think they are worth a shot

You live near the UK? Get a set of AP Racing brakes and call it a day. I'll bet that the AP's would outperform these KSports and AP Racing has one of the best reputations when it comes to brakes.

-Franz

Hey Franz, yes i live in Ireland, would love to get a set of AP racing calipers but the cheapest ones are probably twice the price of the K-sports, dont think i am willing to spend that. Never track my car really just the occasional spirited drive across the mountains so i think the ksport will be enough for me. UK or Ireland or my only options really as the delivery and Customs for a set of brakes from US would be mental money

The decision should be easy.

 

Who makes pads for them? If they are the only ones who make pads, or you need custom pads, then don't get them.

 

Can you get replacement/rebuilding parts? If not, don't get them. If so, will you be able to get replacement parts 5 years from now? If not, buy several rebuild kits now.

 

Who makes rotors for them? What replacement rotors can you use? Only K-Sport rotors? Do they JUST sell the rings, or do you have to buy the whole rotor? How much are they? Will they be available in 5 years?

hopefully i have an s402 in 5 years from now!

Looks like a pretty standard AP pad shape - so that's not too big a deal

 

Mega piston calipers and super slotted rotors - meh.....

Looks like a pretty standard AP pad shape - so that's not too big a deal

 

Mega piston calipers and super slotted rotors - meh.....

 

Heh! i know they look a bit rice! trying to price up a set of 4 pot AP racing kit and there isnt too much in the difference. approx 1500 USD for 330mm AP racing kit compared to 1200 USD for the Ksports.

 

which would have better stopping power? even though the ksports are 8 pot the pistons look half the size of the ap racing ones!

Piston area and rotor effective diameter determine brake torque. More pistons are for spreading the force out to use a bigger pad and reduce taper and other such things under heavy braking conditions like track use.

the decision should be easy.

 

Who makes pads for them? If they are the only ones who make pads, or you need custom pads, then don't get them.

 

Can you get replacement/rebuilding parts? If not, don't get them. If so, will you be able to get replacement parts 5 years from now? If not, buy several rebuild kits now.

 

Who makes rotors for them? What replacement rotors can you use? Only k-sport rotors? Do they just sell the rings, or do you have to buy the whole rotor? How much are they? Will they be available in 5 years?

 

+100

The decision should be easy.

 

Who makes pads for them? If they are the only ones who make pads, or you need custom pads, then don't get them.

 

Can you get replacement/rebuilding parts? If not, don't get them. If so, will you be able to get replacement parts 5 years from now? If not, buy several rebuild kits now.

 

Who makes rotors for them? What replacement rotors can you use? Only K-Sport rotors? Do they JUST sell the rings, or do you have to buy the whole rotor? How much are they? Will they be available in 5 years?

 

+10000.

 

Alternatively, start budgeting for your next BBK upgrade as soon as you've purchased the not-so-easily-sourced "current" set.

 

The economies of this becomes rather heavily related to your personal ability to front cash/credit at any one particular time - buying an off-brand for cheap lets you get away with minimal up-front money, comparatively speaking, but your down-the-road spendings can add-up very quickly if the replacement components are proprietary, not to even mention if unavailable, period.

Heh! i know they look a bit rice! trying to price up a set of 4 pot AP racing kit and there isnt too much in the difference. approx 1500 USD for 330mm AP racing kit compared to 1200 USD for the Ksports.

 

For a $300 price difference, it's a no-brainer. I'd get the AP kit.

Hey Franz, yes i live in Ireland, would love to get a set of AP racing calipers but the cheapest ones are probably twice the price of the K-sports, dont think i am willing to spend that. Never track my car really just the occasional spirited drive across the mountains so i think the ksport will be enough for me. UK or Ireland or my only options really as the delivery and Customs for a set of brakes from US would be mental money

 

Nice. If you don't track your car, the stock calipers and rotors will get the job done but if you are dead set on a BBK, the small price difference between the AP's and KSports should settle it. hehe. My car sees 130+ MPH on the track and I run stock calipers with DBA rotors and Carbotech track pads with DOT4 fluid.

-Franz

^ +1.

 

And LegacyDan, if you're doing this for bling (as many old-timers here know, that's the reason why I went with a BBK for my Legacy, which neither sees track nor AutoX, I'm not ashamed to admit this! ), the APs will definitely earn much more admiration!

Not only is AP more admirable, K-Sport also doesnt have a great reputation. You definitely DO NOT want to cheap out on brakes, your life depends on them.

you make a lot of good points guys, from a few hours searching amongst various forums today it seems like AP racing have the best reputation with everyone saying go for the AP racing. A lot of impreza guys in UK running time attack cars swear by the ksports 8 pots though!

 

It's the 330mm kit with the AP CP6600 4 pot calipers with Ferodo DS2500 pads for 1450 USD, i think thats a great price. and defintley worth the extra cash. i think the 6 pots are just crazy money, for my needs i think the 4 pots will do me for any situation i come across. Is there a huge difference in the 4 and 6 pots? they probably wouldnt fit behind my Rota's anyway!

 

Can anyone let me know if the rear calipers are 1 or 2 pot calipers? Want to get some Ferodo's to match

 

 

Thanks

You definitely do not need 6 piston calipers for street use. The 4 pot AP kit has plenty of piston area and they will be more brake than any street tire could handle Have the UK time attack guys used other brake setups? There is a local here who has a 400whp STI and runs at Road America a lot. He has tried different setups from Brembos, StopTech, AP Racing, you name it. He has stuck with the AP Racing set on his track car. He hits 150+ mph on the straights there. Also the more pistons you have, the more costly the rebuilds for the calipers.

-Franz

+1 more pistons means more parts to break. i was looking and they even have 12pot calipers!

 

http://www.skylineowners.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=34060&stc=1&d=1200068213

Holy crap, that is a whole new level of rice. Those piston sizes are dinky too.

Dinky piston sizes are the point...

 

If you have 2 pistons, each 1" in diameter you have an effective piston surface area of 1.57 square inches.

 

If you have 4 pistons, each with a .5" diameter, you have an effective piston surface area of .785 square inches.

 

The idea behind variable diameter pistons is to alter engagement profile. If you think of the brakes as a combination of similar systems (which it is), you can see that your foot-force and master-cylinder area determine line pressure. That line pressure divided by piston surface area gives the resulting force going to the brake pad. A larger area means less force on the pad, and will thus be the first piston to move. So as you lean on the pedal, the large pistons move first and engage the pad. As you get more on the brakes, you move the small pistons and further engage the brakes. That allows you to retain some level of low-pressure brake feel, and prevents you from having to stand on the pedal to get some effective stopping power.

 

Larger calipers with more pistons also let you run more pads. That K-sport one looks like it uses a single pad, but calipers with 6 and 8 pistons from Brembo allow you to use multiple pads per side, which improves pad wear by allowing uniform pad application.

Pressure = Force divided by area (such as PSI = pounds per square inch)

 

P = F/A

or

F = PxA

 

For the same pressure, an increase in area produces an increase in force. The bigger piston area wins. Multiple pistons make sense if you can increase the overall area within the same geometric region (this is why performance engines have four valves per cylinder, instead of two).

 

As far as real world performance, unless someone has the resources to obtain and test all the configurations in a comparable manner, its dealer's choice as to whatever you use and why. Just comparing numbers, I would suggest reviewing the braking stickies, especially Praedet's.

 

And to plug another thread I have posted in, for those seeking more information, and even enlightment, Google "The Bosch Automotive Handbook" which has valuable information on all aspects of motor vehicles, including brakes, that most on this forum could probably comprehend.

 

My two cents.

^^ Both BAC5.2 & GTurabus Nailed it..!

 

I joined this site just to add my 2 cents. As a previous owner of a set of AP Racing 4F/2R piston calipers, and 2 sets of KSport calipers sets on each of my GC's. I have to say get the KSPORT, I have never had issues on either sets of AP or Ksports, however... my ksports allow me to brake later and provide better feedback on my pedal. This was immediate notice notice, both on the street and tracks. Just because calipers are huge and carry more pistons, does not mean they are overkill on the streets.., they just look more aggressive, and respond more aggressive when need be. Just like anything else, its not like youll fly out the window every time you stop at a red light w/ those 8 piston calipers! You will have better contact of pad to rotor w/ more pistons, hence pedal feedback response and fade. Just the same as the turbo you upgraded, wont make you any faster until you want it too.

 

Several top companies make replacement pads and the calipers are 100% serviceable and sealed just like most other multi-piston designs. Would you say the same about Wilwood..? They too have cost effective braking that are just as reliable as the next. Their quality of life however, needs constant TLC for street use.

 

The Euro's use the Ksports for a reason, and push come to shove, there are more weekend track guys in some areas of Europe, then there is in all of the U.S. They also have more tracks, nice tracks. Japan also has nothing on Europe when it comes to Subaru obsession and this includes the Aussie's. This is their local company and choose to support them for that same matter.

Ksport has a corporate facility here in the USA and their online support is bit tough, due to volume of entries they receive. However, I find their phone support and etiquette to be top notch. Please, with tracking, remember that Brake kits like these will cost money down the road, due rotor face changes. Generally after 3 sets of pads, your done w/ a rotor and a new one should be fitted. Just for DD's and some AutoX here and there and they will last a lot longer. You may also use another racing companies rotor face, as long as it has a 12 bolt End Bell to Rotor. I for instance have AP rotors on one of my Ksport sets, as to compare the slotting differences.

 

My AP kit only compares to when I had my stock STi Brembo setups on my GC8's...which was great! I just wanted to sneak into the turns a little more and the KSPORTS helped me to do just that... Why would I buy 2 sets? The pads the KSPORTS are purchased w/ are not crap at all and provide excellent stopping power for events, not the street. I found that both the compounds they offer, provide good stopping after they are properly warmed up and their fade is minimal. This all considering weight/power/brake time. The pads on both 8/12 piston calipers are MM's bigger to compenesate w/ pistons.

 

For those bickering about number of pistons... and their size.. Why would you got from 1 pot to 2 pot to 4 pot and so on. Why did you buy the 2 or the 4 pot..?? Same reason why one would purchase the 8 pots and/or 12 pots. The pistons size..? These things are hydraulic, and would crush your hand w / just a little force applied to the pedal if you want to try and stop em from coming out, no matter the size. AP Racing and many other racing companies have a 8pot kits, they are just ridiculously priced at over $4,500. Overall they are new (ksport) and will make a reputation for themselves here in the States soon enough, just as they did overseas. Just like all the other new companies that started here in the states some years ago and established a name and are no longer the RICEY company.

What temperatures were you seeing with the KSPORT BBK? Are there any brand name pads that fit the KSPORT BBK? Such as Pagid, Performance Friction, Ferodo? I'm still skeptical on the difference in brake torque between the AP Racing 4 pot and KSPORT 8 pot. Pedal feedback I can understand

-Franz