The fog lights....they do NOTHING!

I've got a 2009 LGT, and the factory fog lights are well, totally useless.

 

I've tried driving with them in rain, snow and fog. And if it weren't for the light on my dashboard I wouldn't even know they were on.

 

So does anyone have suggestions for what I can do to improve them?

 

New bulbs (which ones?)

Adjust the aim?

 

Ideally, I'm looking for more light in the close range road for seeing lane markings in the rain/snow.

They aim right down into the road and are only going to be good for 10-15 feet out, plus whatever bounce you get. A brighter bulb is only going to make anything in this range brighter. If you really want better output then convert them over to 35W HID's for $30. I just did this last weekend and everything directly in front of the car is extremely bright and it really throws a wide pattern so the side of the road is well lit.

They aim right down into the road and are only going to be good for 10-15 feet out, plus whatever bounce you get. A brighter bulb is only going to make anything in this range brighter. If you really want better output then convert them over to 35W HID's for $30. I just did this last weekend and everything directly in front of the car is extremely bright and it really throws a wide pattern so the side of the road is well lit.

Do you happen to have a link from where you bought the HID kit. I have the same problem with my fog lights and I would like something that would be better than stock.

ddmtuning.com

 

Check the big thread on HID's that is always at the top of this forum. Honestly, anyone even thinking of upgrading fog or low beam bulbs should be going with these HID's. The cost is no more than a "good" set of halogens and they now have a lifetime warranty.

I've got a 2009 LGT, and the factory fog lights are well, totally useless.

 

I've tried driving with them in rain, snow and fog. And if it weren't for the light on my dashboard I wouldn't even know they were on.

 

So does anyone have suggestions for what I can do to improve them?

 

New bulbs (which ones?)

Adjust the aim?

 

Ideally, I'm looking for more light in the close range road for seeing lane markings in the rain/snow.

 

...and.....

 

They aim right down into the road and are only going to be good for 10-15 feet out, plus whatever bounce you get.

 

In sufficiently dense fog, your driving speed *should be* at a crawl, and that's what these fogs are made for - they shine low, close, and flat, to reduce backscatter while yet offering "just enough" illumination to allow you to crawl out of harm's way.

 

Fogs aren't driving lamps or auxiliary lows.

 

However, given that such weather conditions are truly rare, most of us use their factory fogs for other reasons - re-wired as DRLs, accent/style lighting, or use aftermarket/brighter bulbs and re-aim for other illumination purposes (curbs/lane markings in foul weather, etc.).

 

And basically, Wombat, that's what you want to do - go with brighter lighting, plus a re-aim, to better suit your unique end-purpose.

 

You've got a few options.

 

The 2008/2009, IIRC, utilize 9006 bulbs - so you can go with a 65W HIR1 bulb with "hi/lo mod" in order to gain the maximum light output as well as generate good heat for lens self-clearing under foul-weather conditions. If you prefer yellower light for such conditions, you can use a film overlay; you'll lose a little light-on-road, but the HIRs will give you more than enough light to spare.

 

A 35W HID isn't a bad solution, particularly as it'll also - with the exception of initial draw - take a little load off your charging system, but it may not burn hot enough for self-clearance, which can be a concern for snowy/slushy weather use (i.e. lane/curb delineation under such conditions). With the '05-'07 setup, we're lucky, we've got metal parts down there with our H3 bulbs, and we've been able to use high-overwattage standard incandescents (I use an 85W solution, working in outahere's re-wire) or 55W HIDs, which self-clears nicely with the heat it generates, but I've never been below an '08/'09, and do not know what kind of components your lights use, and if they are able to take *that* kind of extra heat. Nevertheless, my wife's '09 FXT utilizes the 9006 fog fitment, and the HIR1 cross-fit and slight-overwattage has not presented an issue. A 35W 3000-5000K color-temperature HID solution should put out as much light as either an 85W "amber" or the HIR1, once the HIDs have come up to full operating status.

 

But in all honesty, don't expect to get too, too much out of any changes down there.

 

Why?

 

It's the optics - they were designed for fog use, and simply will not throw far. This is most easily demonstrated in posts where our fellow LGTers have updated to higher-output low-beams (be it traditional incandescent or HID, and the latter, be it a simple plug-and-play bulb or a full-optics retrofit), and have lamented that their previously modified and satisfactory factory fog setup simply again gets drowned out.

 

If your needs are more specific, it's simply time to look at more specific auxiliary lighting needs - or changing the optics.

I have an 08 and my biggest improvement was re-aiming the fogs and installing 3000k bulbs. I also did the independent fog light mod as well so I can now use the fogs as they are intended: headlights off, fog lights on. It's an incredible difference in low visibility conditions. With my 4300k HIDs in what seemed like whiteout snow storm, I turned on my fogs and turned off the headlights and was able to see about 20' further down the road.

If you want to stay with as much usuable light as possible, go with 4300k H7 HIDs for your headlights and either 9011 HIRs modded to fit 9006 socket (I've used those as well, but like the 3000k bulbs better) or 3000k 9006 bulbs.

Overall though, the most benefit came from re-aiming the foglights.

Thanks very much for the suggestions.

I think my first plan will be to check the aiming, since it seems like mine are more like 2-3' in front of the car rather than 10-15'.

 

Beyond that, I think I'll be ordering the 65W HIR1 bulb and see how that goes. I'm not sure I really want to do that much mucking around in the electrical system on my new car. No need to introduce gremlins, yet.

Thanks very much for the suggestions.

I think my first plan will be to check the aiming, since it seems like mine are more like 2-3' in front of the car rather than 10-15'.

 

You'll likely have to try this a few times, before getting it to your liking. Patience to do the trial-and-error over and over again is a must. Take your time, you'll find it!

 

Beyond that, I think I'll be ordering the 65W HIR1 bulb and see how that goes. I'm not sure I really want to do that much mucking around in the electrical system on my new car. No need to introduce gremlins, yet.

 

The slight overwattage should not cause much, if any, strain on your electrical system. I don't know of anyone who's looked into the '08/'09 wiring, but for the '05-'07, outahere said that the draw from an 85W H3 bulb on that setup was still within margins for safety - just that there isn't much of a margin, and that the loss through the line would also dim output somewhat.

 

 

---

 

 

I have an 08 and my biggest improvement was re-aiming the fogs and installing 3000k bulbs. I also did the independent fog light mod as well so I can now use the fogs as they are intended: headlights off, fog lights on. It's an incredible difference in low visibility conditions. With my 4300k HIDs in what seemed like whiteout snow storm, I turned on my fogs and turned off the headlights and was able to see about 20' further down the road.

If you want to stay with as much usuable light as possible, go with 4300k H7 HIDs for your headlights and either 9011 HIRs modded to fit 9006 socket (I've used those as well, but like the 3000k bulbs better) or 3000k 9006 bulbs.

Overall though, the most benefit came from re-aiming the foglights.

 

I, too, prefer a yellower light, particularly under adverse conditions.

 

However, remember: the improvement in "what you see," the difference between what you see with white light and what you see with yellow is subjective only - it's more a driver-comfort increase than anything else (aka: you think you're seeing better, but in reality, there's no quantifiable performance improvement between white and yellow).

 

Certainly, by re-aiming your fogs, you're getting more usable light where you want it, and that's helping you truly "see better/more," but in terms of the advantages of "selective yellow," don't bank on it, and what's more, remember to still slow down to reasonable, given conditions, and not let your increased driving confidence, stemming from increased sight comfort, get the better of you.

 

This is something that I remind myself of, every time I turn on my yellow fogs.

I've got a 2009 LGT, and the factory fog lights are well, totally useless.

 

I've tried driving with them in rain, snow and fog. And if it weren't for the light on my dashboard I wouldn't even know they were on.

 

So does anyone have suggestions for what I can do to improve them?

 

New bulbs (which ones?)

Adjust the aim?

 

Ideally, I'm looking for more light in the close range road for seeing lane markings in the rain/snow.

 

they'r not

Adjust the aim?

 

That fixed mine.

I also did the independent fog light mod as well so I can now use the fogs as they are intended: headlights off, fog lights on.

 

+1

 

There's some stupid law in the US that says the headlights must be on with the fogs?! You can change bulbs, buy HIDs, re-aim...none of that is going to do squat if the headlights are still reflecting back in your face.

+1

 

There's some stupid law in the US that says the headlights must be on with the fogs?! You can change bulbs, buy HIDs, re-aim...none of that is going to do squat if the headlights are still reflecting back in your face.

 

Maybe I don't get enough fog in South Jersey, but I like the idea that the foglamps won't turn on unless the low beams are on. Instead of fog, we have a lot of numnuts who drive around with parking lights because they like the look. And we even have idiots who drive with no lights.

I never got much reflection from low beams, but my reference is snow.

^ You'll need a really good "white-out" fog to really appreciate what a properly set up set of fogs can do for you.

 

The light shines low and wide/flat for a reason - to reduce backscatter. It's designed so that you can still make forward progress under such conditions, albeit at much slower than typical speeds, and it's that latter consideration that most who do not live or frequent heavy-fog areas would not realize.

So I was up in Tahoe with the wife's 08 Impreza. Her fog lights actually work! They filled in the road near the car nicely. I'll try re-aiming mine this weekend.

good stuff in this thread....

 

Right now my fogs just look good, but don't do much. Kinda reminds me of someone I know.... oh snap

So I was up in Tahoe with the wife's 08 Impreza. Her fog lights actually work! They filled in the road near the car nicely. I'll try re-aiming mine this weekend.

 

Try driving up to a wall, in a parking garage for example.

Look for the cutoff line for the fog lights as you get closer.

 

When I received my car, I couldn't see that cutoff line unless I leaned forward and peered over the steering wheel. I would just get a glimpse of it at the base of the wall before I lost sight of it. So basically the fog lights were illuminating the road only in the area that I couldn't see when I was sitting comfortably in the driver's seat. Totally useless.

 

My car was still under 3/36 so I had the dealership fix it. I've attached the illustration that I made to explain the problem to them.

 

They ended up replacing one of the fog light housings while they were at it.

Nice Art work!...

Oh yes it certainly is. I'm quite proud of that one.

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_tILHr4WWwY4/S5sjItKhv6I/AAAAAAAAAHE/vLDZbwc-HiI/s720/ground.JPG

 

like this

Wow! That picture totally shows why I can't see the darned fog lights. I tend to sit with my seat relatively far back, so there's no way I could see the spot where your fogs are currently aimed. .

Alright, this is a good thread so I'll post here. I took a look today and sure enough my 08 has 9006's for fogs. The driver's side is easy to get but passenger looks to be a PITA. The question is this. Do I a, get overlays and leave the OEM bulbs? B, get some cheapo Nokya yellows and maybe overlays? Or c, go full HID with 3K bulbs? I already have the 65W lows which kick some ass. My gripe is with B and C, the one bulb looks like a royal pain to get to and there's not much room to work in there. TSI, what's your take? You're the light guru in here.

Thanks for thinking so much of me, but I'm far, far from a guru.

 

I can only offer my two cents, that's all. Nothing more.

 

My first thought would be to utilize HIR for the fog - it'll provide much more light, and even if you used an overlay on it, you'll still get at least the factory white-light output. Re-aim for your end-use/preferences, and you should be all-set.

 

Heat would be a concern. It's been proven that the '05-'07 can utilize even 100W incandescents or 55W HIDs down there, with no problems, in terms of heat damaging the components down there, at least (wiring updates per outahere's instructions are still recommended, though), but I don't know much about the '08+'s physical setup. On the plus side, if it turns out that what's down there is stout enough to handle the temperatures, having a hotter-burning setup could well prove to be a bonus, if you live where there is significant snowfall, as the lenses will, in a way, self-clear.

 

I experimented with a 3000K 35W HID setup on my fogs, and decided to go back to a yellow 85W incandescent - I couldn't melt enough snow...and there was a significant delay in burn-in, which was incompatible with how I tend to use fogs. In the end, it was this personal preference that drove me back.

Follow up question? How the heck do I adjust the fog lights on a 2009?

 

I removed the trim piece but didn't see an easy adjustment screw. Getting at the fog lights from the underside, looked like it required removing a good chunk of the skid plate.

 

Is it realistic to get at the fog lights without access to ramps?

If the assembly is like that of my wife's '09 FXT (which also uses the 9006 bulb, stock), you'll need to access from the "rear" of the housing - i.e. from the engine compartment.

 

On both my '05 LGT as well as her FXT, there's a separate portion of the front aero/splash shield assembly - pieces off to each side of that center aero/splash/"skid plate" that can be tucked out of the way, by removing a couple of Pop-Its, to gain access.

 

I'm pretty familiar with the underside of my vehicles, so I can do things down there without jacking (my LGT is also about an inch lower to the ground up front, due to springs), but for the first-timer, I think it'll be a lot easier if you jackstand or ramp, or park the car over an "overhang" of some sort.

Obviously, you guys need foglights like on my Ouback, lol, saucer-sized.