Th3crack3r Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Hi, just taught i'd share what just happened to me. Just bought a 05 legacy GT LTD wagon, mint condition from a honda dealer. 5300$ 170000km. The car runs smooth, not overheating, great turbo boost. I ask for a copy of the dealer's inspection results. Fluid checked, oil an oil filter changed. few electric problems in the tail gate fixed. Seems real good. I've got a 30 days/1700km warranty from the dealer on it and I refuse the 1500$ 12month warranty they offer me. 1500km later, I open the hood to check if all the fluids are fine (never checked them before). Surprise, the coolant overflow is empty, not a drop in it and is really dirty. So I open the radiator cap and the level of coolant is really low on the upper cap and there is a brown black gew on the caps. I added around 2.5L of coolant to the system and overflow tank. The motor never overheated but I'm pretty sure it was a close call. Anyway I get home with the car running at the same temp it usually does, right in the middle of the temp gauge. The next morning, I check the coolant level again and notice tiny bubbles coming out of the overflow tank. I get closer to see them and surprise, the coolant smells like exhaust. This is my first car but I know its not right. I'm still in the 1700km warranty (200km left), so Honda agreed that i bring the car to a local subaru dealer for inspection and then approve the repair. I feel lucky I found out that problem before the end of my warranty. Also, since I refilled the cooling, I'm making big spots on the street. I'm bringing the car tomorrow morning to my local subaru dealer. I hope they swap both head gasket so I don't have to pay for this in a near future... I also feel like honda tried to avoid the repairs... Anyway, found that article to be real nice for explanations about this problem: http://www.rs25.com/forums/f190/t40373-everything-you-ever-needed-know-about-cooling-systems.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bluesuby Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 The article was written several years ago and doesn't mention that the newer Subarus use a blue OEM coolant. Make sure you get the proper jug because the two don't mix. I've heard that head gasket problems were solved before 2005 but I still put that bottle of secret sauce in the radiator when I change coolant. And don't get upset if the overflow bottle goes down a couple times after replacing the coolant. I found that "burping" the system takes some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3crack3r Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 Brought 3 legacy GT for inspections before and all of them had the boost returning into the rad. The headgasket for the 05-09 legacy is still a major issue. I guess subaru will flush the contaminated coolant and put the right one in. The conditionner is still needed but its only retarding the problem, not fixing it. Thanks for the info, i used "universal" prestone to refill the coolant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stanjk3 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 http://mobile.dudamobile.com/site/allwheeldriveauto1?url=http%3A%2F%2Fallwheeldriveauto.com%2Fwhich-coolant-is-right-for-my-subaru%2F&dm_redirected=true#2650 Subaru blue long life coolant wasn't standard fill until 2009 MY, though according to this some 2008s also used it. Friends don't let friends drink cheap beer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gex Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 These cars use standard green coolant (I like a good ol 50/50 prestone myself) and a dealer will add subaru conditioner. My guess is you bled the system incorrectly. The car is to be bled from the turbo reserve tank. The 4th gen legacy can get head gasket failure but it is not near (not even close) the rate of the 04 and older models. These cars are more prone to turbo failure. Plus $5300 for a manual wagon with warranty and only 105k miles. That's a ******* steal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brian3676 Posted July 27, 2014 Share Posted July 27, 2014 Most likely honda tech dident even know they were bad. Person who traded it in proble topped it off and drove to dealer for trade in. Sounds like Honda is taking care of it. Subaru will more than likely do both. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3crack3r Posted July 27, 2014 Author Share Posted July 27, 2014 Yeah I got a real good price, and the warranty is because the law in quebec protects the buyers against any hidden defects for 30 days when buying from a automotive professionnal. Found a few details about the car calling a few subaru dealer with the NIV number. At 75000km, new turbo, new injector in cylinder 4. It has been a week only since I bought the car from the honda dealer, so I didn't bled the coolant at all, only added 2.5L of coolant in the turbo tank making sure to remove as much air as possible and starting the heater inside the car to remove air... The bubbles in the overflow tank are regular when the engine is hot and the coolant in it has a really strong gasoline smell. I'll know for sure tomorrow morning when the subaru dealer will check the car. Thanks for your inputs guys. Keep ya posted. J-F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eljefe1981 Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 I swapped the readiator and did not bleed the air on 2005 LGT. is there a way and a must to do this? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Xplosivo1 Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 I swapped the readiator and did not bleed the air on 2005 LGT. is there a way and a must to do this? Yes, 1. jack up the front passenger side of the car. 2. remove cap from turbo coolant bottle. 3. turn on the motor and idle with heater on high until the radiator fans come on. 4. drop car, refill, repeat until it no longer drops in level. I'm sure Max will chime in if I missed anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Yep that's pretty much it. I top off the tank while it's jacked up too. I do carry some coolant with me for a couple day's...just in case. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lccl Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 The 4th gen legacy can get head gasket failure but it is not near (not even close) the rate of the 04 and older models. These cars are more prone to turbo failure. I was under the impression that HG's were only a problem on older models. Don't 05 LGT's basically have the same set up as STi's just with smaller turbo, IC, & different ECU? My mechanic said HG's basically never really fail on these car's (along with the STi's) and that there is almost always another problem. He said he's had countless guys come in (with legacy's and STi's) for HG issues and has only had to do HG's on them once or twice. They are finicky though. My car has new rad caps, no leaks, no oil in coolant, no coolant in oil, no HC's in coolant, but something is still causing vac issues and coolant doesn't always circulate back into the engine during cool down. Other times, it recirculates just like it should:spin: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gex Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 When I first joined the board Headgasket issues were non existent. Now after a few years I have seen a few pop up. More so recently. Your issue sounds like a thermostat. Is it not opening completely? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 Yes, 1. jack up the front passenger side of the car. 2. remove cap from turbo coolant bottle. 3. turn on the motor and idle with heater on high until the radiator fans come on. 4. drop car, refill, repeat until it no longer drops in level. I'm sure Max will chime in if I missed anything. Should I ever hear water trickling (sounds like behind the dash) shortly after start-up or is that a sign of air in the cooling system? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 That's a sign of air in the sytem. Burp the system. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 The FSM procedure seems to be much more involved than what is posted here: 2. FILLING OF ENGINE COOLANT 1) Remove the collector cover. 2) Pour cooling system conditioner through the filler neck. Cooling system protective agent: COOLING SYSTEM CONDITIONER (Part No. SOA635071) 3) Fill engine coolant into coolant filler tank up to the filler neck position. Coolant capacity (fill up to “FULL” level): AT model Approx. 7.22(7.6 US qt, 6.3 Imp qt) MT model Approx. 7.32(7.7 US qt, 6.4 Imp qt) CAUTION: Do not confuse the cap of coolant filler tank with that of radiator. NOTE: • When pouring the engine coolant, the radiator side cap must not be removed. • The SUBARU Genuine Coolant containing antifreeze and anti-rust agents is especially made for SUBARU engine, which has an aluminum crankcase. Always use SUBARU Genuine Coolant, since other coolant may cause corrosion. 4) Fill engine coolant into the reservoir tank up to “FULL” level. 5) Close the coolant filler tank cap, start the engine and race 5 to 6 times at less than 3,000 rpm, then stop the engine. (Complete this operation within 40 seconds.) 6) Wait for one minute after the engine stops, open the coolant filler tank cap. If the engine coolant level drops, add engine coolant to the filler neck position of radiator. 7) Perform the procedures 5) and 6) again. 8) Attach the coolant filler tank cap and reservoir tank cap properly. 9) Start the engine and operate the heater at maximum hot position and the blower speed setting to “LO”. 10) Run the engine at 2,000 rpm or less until radiator fan starts and stops. NOTE: • Be careful with the engine coolant temperature gauge to prevent overheating. • If the radiator hose becomes harden by engine coolant pressure at this time, air purge seems to be mostly completed. 11) Stop the engine and wait until engine coolant temperature lowers to 30C (86F) or less. 12) Open the coolant filler tank cap. If the engine coolant level drops, add engine coolant into the coolant filler tank up to the filler neck position and the reservoir tank to “FULL” level. 13) Attach the coolant filler tank cap and reservoir tank cap properly. 14) Set the heater setting to maximum hot position and the blower speed setting to “LO” and start the engine. Perform racing at less than 3,000 rpm. If the flowing sound is heard from heater core, repeat the procedures from step 10). 15) Install the collector cover. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 And if I have to lug my floor jack downstairs, would you mind chiming in here if you have an idea? http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/lubing-poly-bushings-228455.html Thanks! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 When I replaced the timing belt, the trubo and the short block I burped the system the way we say. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scontivt Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 I used my buddy's vacuum system to fill my coolant system after a timing belt/componant swap. Slickest thing ever created. Alternatively we use a raised funnel secured to the filler neck and keep topping off until it is full and free of bubbles. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lccl Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 When I first joined the board Headgasket issues were non existent. Now after a few years I have seen a few pop up. More so recently. Your issue sounds like a thermostat. Is it not opening completely? Im not sure. Car hasnt actually overheated. It is rather new (t-stat), 20k old i think. I didnt know a tstat could cause coolant not to recirculate during cool down That's a sign of air in the sytem. Burp the system. I hear this too, sounds like liquid running down a rock face, not sure when it started Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ssbtech Posted July 28, 2014 Share Posted July 28, 2014 I never have overheating issues and I've had the trickling thing for ages. Do you add coolant to the overflow tank or the upper reservoir tank? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 A couple of times a year I add a little to the plastic over flow tank, making sure its up to the bottom line. Yea, I know its hard to see. 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3crack3r Posted July 29, 2014 Author Share Posted July 29, 2014 Partial update, subaru made a complete coolant flush using a special product because the coolant was full of oil and black gew. Then they can start investigating they told me... I'll have more info soon. J-F Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 I hope they save that coolant when they end up having to fix the problem. What did they charge for that coolant ? What was the special product, a cleaner ? or sealer ? 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Th3crack3r Posted July 29, 2014 Author Share Posted July 29, 2014 I don t know how much the coolant was but the seller, Honda is paying for all the repairs under warranty. It was a cleaner. Jf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
That Guy 2-1 Posted July 29, 2014 Share Posted July 29, 2014 would this still be an issue on a N/A 2008 Outback? I've had to top up the coolant a time or two ... that reminds me I've got to check it again Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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