10" or 12" sub?

I'm going to be putting my Kenwood amp in the Legacy sometime soon, but I want to retire my circa 1992 Punch 15 sub (Indestructible!), I can't deal with a box that huge anymore. So I was considering a 10" sub, but I keep having thoughts that it won't be enough for me, as I have many years of 15" sub conditioning .

But seriously, I'm not interested in slamming bass anymore, but I want something that adds a good solid bottom end to things. Can I get there with a 10", or should I go with a 12"? I'll be building a sealed box, BTW. I'm done with sloppy ported stuff.

 

Anyone want to buy a 16 year old Punch 15?

Get a high end 10" sub and it'll be as loud as that 15 year old 15" bad boy you had. Simple sealed enclosure, and 'Bam'. Done.

If you go with a high end 10" sub and amp you can get some serious noise out of it. I can't stand giant box's in the trunk so I would say go with the smaller sub

Well, High end stuff is out of my budget, I just want it to sound decent. I'm just going to run the amp off of a LOC. If the sub I had was a 12", I'd just use it for free, but 15" is just too much anymore.

 

I've been looking at these two and will probably decide between them when I buy one.

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-Rockford-Fosgate-P210S4-Punch-10-4-Ohm-Sub-NIB_W0QQitemZ180121338870QQihZ008QQcategoryZ3291QQtcZphotoQQcmdZViewItemQQ_trksidZp1742.m153.l1262

 

 

 

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=160214888873&_trksid=p3984.cWAT.m240.lVI

 

 

 

 

 

 

I haven't kept up with car audio in ages (obviously!), but in the 90's, the RF Punch series was the sh*t and there was a distinct difference in quality between the Punches and the Series 1 woofers. I blew up several series 1's, but the Punch is still going. It's truly impressive

 

Are there different versions of Punch subs these days? I know back in the day, $40 wouldn't have gotten you a Punch anything

 

I know it's asking alot to recommend a sub that'd come in at $65 or so total, but do you guys have any suggestions other than what I've shown?

 

Thanks

A 10" sub is plenty. I have a Cheap Infinity sub driven by an E-bay Class D 300 watt amp and less than 1/4 gain is enough to shake the whole car.

I've had both in my legacy, though its not really a fair comparison. I had a 10" alpine type r sub in a crappy sealed box. It was decent but not quite enough, I was going to build a 9th order band pass box for it but went to car toys over the weekend and didn't end up making a box... they had 12" jbl sub in a jbl 5th order band pass box. I have always hated sealed boxes, never liked they way they sound, they just don't have good rolling bass IMO. The box obviously is more important that the sub. If you're a car audio enthusiast, get the 12" it plays low notes much better than the 10" and you won't want more. Whatever you do I would highly recommend a ported box.

I have had 10" subs in 2 of my cars. My thought process was that I didn't want to be "that guy" that would drive by and you could hear his trunk rattling from all the excessive bass. When I had my Legacy I opted for a 12" sub. When I listen to an audio system I prefer sound quality over loudness. If you want a clean sounding system on a budget get a 12" Infinity Kappa Perfect (you can get them fairly cheap on ebay), have a custom built ported box and then dyna-mat your trunk. The dyna-mat helps to provide a solid surface for the sound waves to bounce off of, helps to stop the annoying trunk rattle and it actually makes the reflected waves crisper due to the flat/dense surface that they are bouncing off of.

I know that people are going to say that Infinity speakers/subs are expensive, but if you do a little research you can find some really good deals. The reason I prefer them is because they have an aluminum cone that doesn't bend (which causes uneven sound waves) and gives a very clean sound.

Just my $.02

I'm gonna say stick with a 10"... Make a custom box that fits behind the wheel well, in front of the tail light (walkthrough here: http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=23343 ).

I had this setup, and I'm gonna make it again really soon... It was excellent. It combined the perfect amount of bass with the practicality of still having use of my trunk without loosing any real space. And your still able to use the spare tire well/open the cover.

I cant recommend a sub for the price your looking for... MAYBE if you'd go buy a JL Audio 10w0 or 10w1... I think brand new from a dealer they are like $80... But you can prob buy em cheaper elsewhere (internet/ebay). Then... Im not sure if you have an amp already, but I have a 250/1 I'm trying to sell... But its prob a little too much price wise for what your looking for.

If you can... Find someone thats selling a 10w3 though... That is a killer sub for the money... But I'm a JL Audio fanatic... lol

Def go with the custom boxes though I think... You cant go wrong with em. Even if you make it and dont like it, you can sell it on here for about $150-200ish depending on how well you made it.

I have installed recently a 10" Sub in Custom enclosure from Wacked CAS.

 

10" Speaker FI Car Audio (Custom Made in Vegas) SSD10 Rms: 800W Re: 0.75 Ohms/coil = $ 179.00

Hifonics BXi1206D 1200W RMS Mono Block Class D 1 Ohm Stable Amp (BXi1206D) (It is really cool amp, doesn't get hot at all) = $174.95

Custom Enclosure from Wicked CAS = $ 299.95

 

The speaker is in enclosure on the driver side and the AMP is perfectly fitted into the foam under the trunk cover.

Boost Nob is next to hood hook.

 

Sounds extremely well!

I have had the following 2 configs in my car (still have the 2nd)

 

1st Two 12" JL 12W1V2's in a sealed box (custom made to JL Specs) wired to a 2ohm load. Running a 500.1 Polk audio amp.

 

Results - Deep back massaging car shaking bass, literally everything in the car rattled on particular noes in some songs. However it was very rich and enveloping when not pushed over the edge. The only downside is that "punchy" bass like kick drums etc tended to get a little muddy.

 

2nd single 10" 10w6v2 in a sealed box.

 

Results - Bass response is not as mind numbing on the high end as the 12"s were, it doesn't quite shake your world apart. It does however hit hard and deep and really sounds very nice on well mixed music, for example the Red Hot Chili Peppers album Blood Sugar Sex Magik (or is it magic i forget) has some really nice bass notes the 12"s would tend to overdo them and it would just end up rattling the rear deck more then making a good bass note, whereas the 10 makes a good thump that is more musical and "correct" to the source by a critical ear.

 

However on my ghetto bass acid test, Get Low by Lil John, it doesnt quite give the all enveloping holy shit how many speakers do you have effect the 12"s did but on a day to day basis where im not listening to the system at 9/10ths all the time and more like 4/10ths or so its much cleaner.

 

So basically I'm working on making the Legacy more audiophile quality and going for a more pure sound and I threw my old box into my Cadillac Fleetwood so now when i wanna roll gangster style i can lean back, drive with my pinky and blow my brains out heh.

 

That being said, if you listen to "music" more and tight transient response with good recovery time is for you, then go with a nice 10" JL. I picked up my w6v2 on ebay 2nd hand and although I dont have a warranty that speaker is pretty much bulletproof.

Welby, what is your budget? From your posts it seems like you are more geared to SQ rather than SPL. Also, you said you have a Kenwood amp but you didn't say which one and how much power it produces. The type of sub that I suggest will also depend on the power of your amp and what impedance the power is made at.

 

Tell me what you want to spend and give me your amp specs I can suggest many options that will fit your application.

 

PS: I'm the master of great SQ and full sound in small spaces

 

http://i17.photobucket.com/albums/b75/ItalynStylion/SubStuff/Sexy001.jpg

^That white thing is something I use to stretch for running. It's not for support; I just keep it under there so it doesn't roll around in the trunk.

^That white thing is something I use to stretch for running. It's not for support; I just keep it under there so it doesn't roll around in the trunk.

 

Im glad you pointed that out i was like wtf?

My 10" sounds great, but it depends on what kind of music you listen to.

People in this thread seem to think that the diameter of the sub determines the sound like all 10's sound the same and all 12's sound better. The diameter of the sub is just the effective cone area. There are tons of things that go into the final sound you hear.

 

People that hear my four 6.5's setup without knowing what was in the trunk thought I had "two good 12's"

People in this thread seem to think that the diameter of the sub determines the sound like all 10's sound the same and all 12's sound better. The diameter of the sub is just the effective cone area. There are tons of things that go into the final sound you hear.

 

People that hear my four 6.5's setup without knowing what was in the trunk thought I had "two good 12's"

 

People be dumb.

People be dumb.

Had people thinking my 2 JL 10w3d4's were 12's... And they were only getting pushed by a 250/1... Wonder what they'd think of my 500/1 pushin em... lol

Having an aftermarket head unit is key. With my pioneer 940 I can adjust my bass level, I turn the bass down when I'm listening to rock, and crank it up for rap and instrumentals. My ten sounded alright, it would have sounded good with a good box, but it won't hit the lows like a 12 will. Its all about preference and figuring out how much is enough.

^yeah, having a headunit with a non-fade level control is a big plus. Some amps also come with a remote gain knob that can do pretty much the same thing.

youd be supprised what you can find on ebay. I got my kicker 15" solobaric L7 for 213 bucks plus shipping. I consider kicker to be a high quality subwoofer, granted i love my 15. If you go with the high end 10 just make sure you have enough amp power to make it thump but a good 10 can make a nice sound as well...

 

those JL W7s are nice 10s also and they hit pretty low for 10s

 

what kind of music do you listen to? If you bang gansta rap a 12 will hit the lows a lil better but if you listen to all kinds or if you dont need to feel like your internal organs are crying inside your body cavity (one of my favorite feelings) then the 10 will be AOK.

 

My buddy had two of those RF Punch 15s in his jetta in a custom box with 1000 watts would make your eyes shake in your head if it was turned up stop signs would be blurry... they are a workhorse of an old sub. My Kicker has proven to also be a workhorse I really swear by the Solobarics. And face it square subs are cool.... I think its 18% more surface area so a square 10 has almost the same surface area of a round 12 and so on. Go with the Square Solobaric (MAKE SURE IF YOU DO YOU GO WITH AN L7 NOT AN L5)

 

mine is a few years old when they were silver inside not all chrome but either way they hit the same....heres a pic of same sub, not my specific one.

 

http://www.audiooutfitter.com/images/items/336/70336-02s15l72.jpg

http://www.shopbot.com.au/i/2007/10/1463434217_small.jpg

^yeah, having a headunit with a non-fade level control is a big plus. Some amps also come with a remote gain knob that can do pretty much the same thing.

 

 

Lol thanks for reminding me about that gain knob, I've had one from my amp for over a year I forgot about. So I had a couple beers last night and mounted it to the little dash door under the mirror controls and ran the wire to the amp. Came out looking good, plus know I don't have to push a couple buttons on the menu to get to the sub volume on the deck.

youd be supprised what you can find on ebay. I got my kicker 15" solobaric L7 for 213 bucks plus shipping. I consider kicker to be a high quality subwoofer, granted i love my 15. If you go with the high end 10 just make sure you have enough amp power to make it thump but a good 10 can make a nice sound as well...

 

those JL W7s are nice 10s also and they hit pretty low for 10s

 

what kind of music do you listen to? If you bang gansta rap a 12 will hit the lows a lil better but if you listen to all kinds or if you dont need to feel like your internal organs are crying inside your body cavity (one of my favorite feelings) then the 10 will be AOK.

 

My buddy had two of those RF Punch 15s in his jetta in a custom box with 1000 watts would make your eyes shake in your head if it was turned up stop signs would be blurry... they are a workhorse of an old sub. My Kicker has proven to also be a workhorse I really swear by the Solobarics. And face it square subs are cool.... I think its 18% more surface area so a square 10 has almost the same surface area of a round 12 and so on. Go with the Square Solobaric (MAKE SURE IF YOU DO YOU GO WITH AN L7 NOT AN L5)

 

mine is a few years old when they were silver inside not all chrome but either way they hit the same....heres a pic of same sub, not my specific one.

 

http://www.audiooutfitter.com/images/items/336/70336-02s15l72.jpg

http://www.shopbot.com.au/i/2007/10/1463434217_small.jpg

 

 

Solobaric's are bomb, the put out sound in small boxes, I like them a lot. My buddy just put two of these 15" in his dodge charger over the weekend in a ported box, it was pounding really hard, great sound with the band pass box. Ebay is where I got my hiphonics amp brand new for 199.99, best amp IMO for the money, 800watts x 5 channel, powers my focals, polks and my jbl sub, never makes my dash lights pulsate, ever, and I can play music for a long period of time with the car turned off (45min-1hr) without killing the battery.

Once again....cone size does not determine if a sub can "hit the lows"

The frequency that a sub plays is determined by the speed at which the cone moves in and out. Some subs are not stable down at a 20hz threshold just because they are not built solid enough.

 

Here is a few things to think about

Double the cone area=twice as loud

Double the power=twice as loud

Ported vs. Sealed box=ported is twice as loud

 

In the audio world if you do any of these three things you will gain 3db. So let's say you are planning to run two sealed 12" subs and each sub costs $100...you could run two sealed subs and use up a ton of space and buy an amp that is powerful enough to run them both. But that's expensive. Or, you could do the smart thing and throw a single 12" in a ported box and get the SAME output. Only in this case you save $100 and you don't have to buy as big/expensive an amp.

 

 

PS: 8's can "hit the lows" too...don't believe me? Have a look at this....

 

http://www.soundsplinter.com/images/rli8-backangle.jpg

Lol thanks for reminding me about that gain knob, I've had one from my amp for over a year I forgot about. So I had a couple beers last night and mounted it to the little dash door under the mirror controls and ran the wire to the amp. Came out looking good, plus know I don't have to push a couple buttons on the menu to get to the sub volume on the deck.

 

No problem man, glad it worked out for you

I'm lazy when I'm driving too. I hate having to punch all these buttons just to do something simple. I have an Elemental Designs 5 channel amp that has a remote gain on it but I doubt I'll ever use it. Maybe when I get a LGT I'll find a good place for it.

Once again....cone size does not determine if a sub can "hit the lows"

The frequency that a sub plays is determined by the speed at which the cone moves in and out. Some subs are not stable down at a 20hz threshold just because they are not built solid enough.

 

Here is a few things to think about

Double the cone area=twice as loud

Double the power=twice as loud

Ported vs. Sealed box=ported is twice as loud

 

In the audio world if you do any of these three things you will gain 3db. So let's say you are planning to run two sealed 12" subs and each sub costs $100...you could run two sealed subs and use up a ton of space and buy an amp that is powerful enough to run them both. But that's expensive. Or, you could do the smart thing and throw a single 12" in a ported box and get the SAME output. Only in this case you save $100 and you don't have to buy as big/expensive an amp.

 

 

PS: 8's can "hit the lows" too...don't believe me? Have a look at this....

 

http://www.soundsplinter.com/images/rli8-backangle.jpg

 

i agree with you, if you go middle of the road quality though a medium quality 12 will usually hit lower than a medium quality 8. If you go high end its all about surface area and convenience of mounting locations.

 

that is also why im a fan of the solobarics. increased surface area to same sized round sub. i have mine in a 1 cu ft sealed enclosure and it sounds great