Possible 6-speed Legacy in 2006

Someone over at NASIOC got word of the 2006 Legacy and Forester getting a 6-speed tranny from a Subaru tech.

 

Click here for the thread.

 

Ken

3.0r?

Why the obession with 6 speed? Besides the gas savings in 6th gear, it doesn't give you much.

Why the obession with 6 speed? Besides the gas savings in 6th gear, it doesn't give you much.

 

Its stronger, I personally prefer how it feels to the 5 speed, it could come with a front LSD (and possibly DCCD or some kind of active center diff), and if it was like the difference between the WRX's 5 speed and the STi's 6 speed the gears would be more closely spaced. Although the gearing the in the Legacy is better than in the WRX so that wouldn't be as big a deal.

Why the obession with 6 speed? Besides the gas savings in 6th gear, it doesn't give you much.

 

Agreed!

 

The only reason I can see having a 6 speed in our cars is for a extra overdrive gear that would drop our rpms out of boost range (under 3K) at 80 mph. This would add a couple mpg's to our highway mileage.

But if it's just 6 evenly spaced gears (more like the WRX STI's) which would lower 2nd through 5th gear, it's pointless in our cars. That would just require us to shift more often, which isn't always a good thing, and can actually reselt in slower acceleration numbers.

 

What's next a 7 or 8 speed manual where we have to shift to a different gear every 15-20 mph??? No thanks.

Meh, I'd rather have a front LSD/ active center with a 5 speed. Less rowing, and if you tune correctly, you'll have enough powerband that you wouldn't need to shift on the track and such, as much.

(and possibly DCCD or some kind of active center diff),

 

 

I'm curious to know how many WRX STI drivers ACTUALLY use the DCCD.

I'd venture to say VERY FEW. Since it seems every test of the car at the strip and on the track has shown the best times have come when it's left in "auto" mode and letting the computer make the adjustments for the best results.

 

I could be wrong, but I have a feeling the DCCD is more of a marketing tool than it is "needed" or even "used" by owners.

The driver controlled part of it may not be that useful but the Auto part definitely is. The combination of that and the front LSD really changes the nature of the car when compared to a WRX.

Why the obession with 6 speed? Besides the gas savings in 6th gear, it doesn't give you much.

 

I'm surprised I beat 05legacygt330ci in here. (I might have slightly butchered his username... the one with the surf avatar )The E46 330s went from a 5-speed box to a 6-speed box after their introduction, and there's little difference in performance, or highway mileage.

 

With the GT's powerband, I'm not sure it's going to be worth much.

 

If they do it, however, I'd be interested to see if real-world performance/mileage is affected much.

Maybe I'm still getting used to it, but I still find myself reaching for another gear when I'm already in 5th. I can see a 6th gear being useful a little bit. I'm not jonesing for one or anything, and I certianly am not going to sell my 05 to get it when it comes available, but it will be interesting to see.

Yes the current fifth gear is quite sort, which makes for great driveability. But when I'm on the highway, I wish I had one more gear to lower the RPM.

I believe the current LGT 4th and 5th gear ratio is the same as (or very close to) the STi 5th and 6th gear (respectively), which really means you wouldn't get better gas mileage on the freeway, you just have an extra gear in the middle somewhere.

 

The front LSD is more appealing to me.

 

EDIT: I guess it doesn't necessiarly mean that the LGT 6-speed will have the same ratios as the STi, but I would assume so.

Driving the STi daily is sometimes a pain-that extra gear means you shift a LOT more. The gears are very short. I'd hope Subaru wouldn't do this in the LGT. I'd hope 6th gear would be a TALL TALL highway gear.

the big difference is syncros ... the 6 speed has ones that actauly last

I have to admit that I'm hoping Subaru will put a 6 speed in the Legacy at some point, but I hope they do it right....otherwise I guess I'd rather have the 5 speed. I think the only reason I want a 6 speed is because I've driven the TSX and TL with a six speed and was absolutely impressed with both. A six speed manual has become almost a standard in this price range.

 

Having said all of this, I personally know only one person who has drive an STI and he wasn't very impressed wih the tranny. He couldn't say enough about the power and the handling, but he said the tranny was just "OK". His friend (who owns the STI) complained that it took a while to get used to the pattern --- six gear being all the way to the lower right. I think I prefer the pattern of the TSX and TL better...just nit-picking here though!!!!

the big difference is syncros ... the 6 speed has ones that actauly last

 

Huh? Legacy GT has only been out a year here, I haven't seen the stories of people breaking transmissions yet. I think the LGT gearbox will prove to be quite strong.

 

The reason the TSX and the TL have 6 speeds is because they have no torque so they have to keep the revs up

I'm curious to know how many WRX STI drivers ACTUALLY use the DCCD.

I'd venture to say VERY FEW. Since it seems every test of the car at the strip and on the track has shown the best times have come when it's left in "auto" mode and letting the computer make the adjustments for the best results.

 

I could be wrong, but I have a feeling the DCCD is more of a marketing tool than it is "needed" or even "used" by owners.

 

 

I agree with you. Yes it is probably very useful to some people, but to most I'd bet it's a neat thing that does stuff. I think brembo's have become the same way. There are people who will use the car to a point where having that extra little bit the brembo's offer matters, but most it's more for coolness. It's like when Honda debuted the new Civic Si concept last week. It has brembo brakes, and all the boards are saying things like, "if it doesn't come with the brembo's it's gonna suck." I'm betting those people don't even come close to using their brakes in which it would be needed. </rant>

i loved the 6spd in my nissan se-r -- it took me a week or two to get over that temptation to shift into 6th in my legacy.

if the lgt had 6 gears i wouldnt have bought it. i had a 6 in my SE-R and it was a bitch in LA traffic...1st...2nd...brake...1st....2nd...brake.

 

5 gears is much nicer

Don't get me wrong, I love the 6-speed in my STi. Bulletproof tranny. But the ratios do not belong on a luxury sport sedan.

Ratios can be changed.

 

The Legacy 3.0R spec B in the rest of the world gets a 6 speed. Probably not the same ratios a the STi

 

The Forester STi in Japan had a 6 speed trans with different ratios than the WRX STi, as well.

 

DCCD isn't a requirement, but having the hardware in the trans doesn't mean it needs to be "selectable". Full time auto (basically VTD) on the DCCD would be a great system, especially with a 1.5 way front LSD. Better yet a front and rear torsen/helical gear diffs with the VTD center planetary gearset.

 

Please, SOA, make this a 2.5GT Spec B. 2.5 Turbo powertrain, re-rate the car at it's actual 260 hp, or perhaps ~280, put in the taller ratio 6mt with the VTD center, and front and rear LSDs. The outback's fender flares, JDM-spec b or blitzen front bumper/body kit, wider wheels and tires, and bright colors. And then it is just a short jump to put the 3.0 twin turbo H6 in it and market it as the Legacy STi.

 

Come on. The revised A4, S4, and RS4 are coming. They need to be undercut by a more reliable platform.

Come on. The revised A4, S4, and RS4 are coming. They need to be undercut by a more reliable platform.

 

I wouldn't be too worried about the A4.

 

The S4 and the RS4 are MUCH more expensive platforms that sell LESS units. I bet they don't make as much money on the S4 as they do on the A4. The S4 and the RS4 are to sell the lesser models by saying "You can't afford this, but the A4 is a great platform and it's from the same family" type thing.

And a Legacy GT, GT-Spec B, and STi are at progressively less money respectively than the A,S, and RS4s, with a car that doesn't spend all it's time in the shop, with a greater fraction of the power than of the price of an Audi would be a good thing.

 

a USDM Spec B, or an STi would sell fewer units, too, but it still figures into amortizing the fixed costs of the platform, and if they make the automotive world sit up and take notice, just like the WRX STi has already, they'll sell more Legacy GTs and possibly more 2.5is, by association, just as you describe the Audis.

 

If a $60+k RS4 can potentially sell a 32k 2.0T A4, or a 40k 3.0 A4; then a 35k Legacy STi, or a 31k GT Spec B could sell 26k GTs, or 20k 2.5is.

We don't want a 6spd for closer ratios in 1-5. We want the same first 5 gears we have now and a nice deep overdrive for 6th. Some of us cruise at 90+ on the interstate and would find it really useful.

And a Legacy GT, GT-Spec B, and STi are at progressively less money respectively than the A,S, and RS4s, with a car that doesn't spend all it's time in the shop, with a greater fraction of the power than of the price of an Audi would be a good thing.

 

a USDM Spec B, or an STi would sell fewer units, too, but it still figures into amortizing the fixed costs of the platform, and if they make the automotive world sit up and take notice, just like the WRX STi has already, they'll sell more Legacy GTs and possibly more 2.5is, by association, just as you describe the Audis.

 

If a $60+k RS4 can potentially sell a 32k 2.0T A4, or a 40k 3.0 A4; then a 35k Legacy STi, or a 31k GT Spec B could sell 26k GTs, or 20k 2.5is.

 

True, but most of America wouldn't even think about spending 35k on a Subaru. Right now we need models like the 2.5GT to spark people's interest. Coming over right away with all the higher end models doesn't make sense financially.