Boost Controllers and YOU! MBC's and EBCS

Hello all,

 

Time for another informative thread of facts, opinions and solutions. This one will be based on boost controllers and their function's, abilities and whether or not to upgrade to an aftermarket unit.

 

Stock boost control

 

First off there is a LOT of skewed information when it comes to the stock boost controllers ability. The stock unit is an electronic 2 port boost controller. The purpose of an electronic boost controller is to "control" the amount of pressure in the lines between the turbo, wastegate and the controller itself thus controlling the pressure put on the wastegate actuator. The stock boost control is a 2 port bleed type system that uses a restrictor pill in the line going from the inlet nipple to the T.

 

Removal of the restrictor pill on the stock 2 port boost controller will result in very low boost regardless of wastegate duty cycle. If you just switched turbos because of a failure you must make sure to retain the boost pill/restrictor pill in the line coming off the compressor nipple to the T. If you install an aftermarket 3 port EBCS the restrictor pill is removed entirely.

 

This system is actually very well designed and can control the stock turbo with NO issues IMO. The only reason to upgrade to an electronic boost controller with the stock turbo imo is if you run out of wastegate ability because of high altitude or something along those lines. A smaller boost pill is a much cheaper option as well but does require tuning to keep control.

 

Some people mistake the boost controller upgrade as a "fix" to be able to run higher boost in the higher rpms with the stock turbo. The fact that the vf40/vf46 tapers boost as rpms increase past 4500rpms is a mechanical limitation due to compressor inefficiency and cannot be "fixed" by adding a electronic boost controller.

The stock boost control has been used on larger turbo's as well and can be tuned without issue if the wg is up to par BUT having the quick reactions of an aftermarket electronic 3-port can be very use full when tuning larger than stock turbo's with very fast response once near the threshold.

 

Some People will debate this but I prefer to see the boost controller upgraded when the turbo is upgraded. That is my personal opinion.

 

Electronic Boost controllers

 

The selection of boost controllers is actually smaller than you think since at least two manufactures use the same unit.

 

Both the Cobb and Grimmspeed units both utilize a MAC valve so they are essentially the same and both come with a factory harness connector so no splicing is required.

 

The prodrive solenoid is another less commonly used unit and I have not had any issues thus far.

 

The Perrin works as advertised as well.

 

The GM solenoid is another cheaper option that works great but requires modification of the factory harness or using a plug off a spare factory ebcs unit

 

They all perform the same function so the choice is yours.

 

Manual boost controllers

 

Manual boost controllers are used in two ways on these cars and have mixed reviews.

 

The first is in replacement of the electronic boost control system. This makes the boost control system fully mechanical and can have a few drawbacks. You loose all control for the Factory PID system to control underboosts, overboosts, temperature compensations, altitude compensations etc.

 

The Manual boost controller can be used in unison with the electric system and this is considered a "hybrid" boost control system. The benefit of the hybrid system is supposed to allow the ecu to control all the part throttle boost and the manual boost controller to control peak boost.

 

There are times a manual boost controller has its place but its more common to need it when boost pressures get very high and the hp level is above what most are seeing here.

 

Some people will debate this but I personally do not like the manual boost controller method used in either of these situations. I have had great success without the need of the MBC in any common configuration. Again this is strongly one opinion among many so take it with a grain of salt.

 

Common Boost control issues

 

The Stock unit is not common to fail but does like any man made device.

 

If you have low boost after installing a new turbo make sure the restrictor pill is in place in the line between the turbo nipple and T like mentioned above.

 

Make sure to remove the Pill in the line when upgrading to an aftermarket electronic boost controller like mentioned above.

 

Make sure to ziptie all vac lines when upgrading to an aftermarket electronic boost controller, this avoids lines blowing off during tuning/after tuning etc *go nuts under the hood while your at it, ziptie any vac line you see!

 

Clicking from the EBCS is normal

 

 

Boost control is a beautiful thing when dialed in properly and can allow early strong power output while maintaining consistent torque across the rpm range.

 

I hope this is helpful to some and if you have any questions, comments or opinions as always please share.

 

Thanks and have a great day

 

Dave

Excellent writeup and I agree on all points and your opinions regarding MBC vs aftermarket EBCS vs stock EBCS.

Thank you for the kudo's. I get asked a lot so I figured it may be helpful.

 

I appreciate the thanks but it seems these threads always sink to the bottom because they don't get bumped. At least they show up in the search feature IF people use it

 

Dave

Thanks. I was on the fence about picking one up for my stage 2 build. I think I'll save my money for now. I appreciate the help.

Not a problem, glad it could help and thanks for bumping the thread for others.

 

Dave

Can you review pros Vs. cons of using a 3-port EBCS like the GrimmSpeed in 2-port mode?

 

Thnx in advance for your time & knowledge.

Pros:

None

 

Cons:

You wasted money on the GS EBCS

You get none of the benefits of a 3 port

 

Why would you run it in 2 port mode? You got a 3 port for a reason. The stock BCS is already a 2 port.

^ lol!!!

I vote SSSSSSSthticky!

I told think my e-tuner told me about removing the restrictor pill now that I have a GM EBCS, this is something that definitely needs to be pushed out of the vacuum line?

 

http://www.fredbeansparts.com/media/catalog/product/cache/1/image/5e06319eda06f020e43594a9c230972d/2/2/22326aa260_2.jpg

Hello there,

 

Most if not all aftermarket 3 port electronic boost controllers available for this platform require removal of the restrictor pill.

 

Dave

as soon as i'm back from vacation in april I was going to be ordering an e-tune thru you anyway. I'll have to pop that pill out then once i'm ready to go. Or should I push it out now, will it effect my current tune to remove it without re-tuning?

Normally that t is completely removed once an aftermarket 3 port ebcs is installed since you have different reference lines going to the WG and turbo nipple. I would say leave things as they are till we start tuning it.

 

Dave

Bump for a couple people asking these questions recently via pm. Hope it helps

 

Dave

Hybrid boost control is fun

^ about that hybrid, I've never got it to work properly.

Some say to seal off one of the 3 port's port (the one that bleeds to intake)

 

I tried that and I produced no boost!

^ about that hybrid, I've never got it to work properly.

Some say to seal off one of the 3 port's port (the one that bleeds to intake)

 

I tried that and I produced no boost!

 

 

I have mine still venting into the inlet. Works great.

That's the way I have mine now. Ask me if it's working, lol, don't even know

bump to make more available for those looking for a good read.

 

Dave

My shop that installed the Grimmspeed 3-port EBCS said that they vent the 3rd port to atmosphere rather than back into the intake. Reason: no advantage except for emissions. Comments?

Is there a reason they have it open to atmosphere? Because it's just a simple straight vacuum line... There's no advantange to NOT hooking up the line and in fact by leaving it open to atmosphere instead of routing it back to the intake tract, you are letting metered air escape.

Here's their answer:

To give you a more technical answer, the amount of air that is dispensed by that port is miniscule enough that it will not affect the cars drivability or horsepower output. That vent primarily only opens when the car is requesting peak wastegate duty cycle (flooring it) and since all cars are tuned after installing a 3 port BCS the very small amount of air vented to atmosphere will be negligible during the tuning process.

I still don't understand why you wouldn't just put the little piece of vac line on from port 3 into the intake when there's no advantage to leaving it off? Minuscule or not - there is air vented. I do get what they are stating as far as no major negligible effect, but they haven't stated a single advantage to leaving it off (weight savings? ).

I still don't understand why you wouldn't just put the little piece of vac line on from port 3 into the intake when there's no advantage to leaving it off? Minuscule or not - there is air vented. I do get what they are stating as far as no major negligible effect, but they haven't stated a single advantage to leaving it off (weight savings? ).

 

If you aim the nozzle toward the back of the car, it's worth at least .02 HP. Aim up for downforce, aim down for MPG. Aim in your face if you've already removed your air conditioning.

 

Seriously though, just plumb it back to the inlet

I always suggest re-plumbing it back into the intake as I have not seen any benefit of venting to atmosphere.

 

Dave