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BulletProof-TMIC Mod - LGT, 08+ WRX


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  • 1 month later...

 

Besides, I'm already at a place with the WRX, power-wise, that I worked years and spent many thousands reaching (then dealing with) with my LGT. I have the power, the handling, the daily fun of a lighter car, with the familiarity of a powerplant I know and prefer. I tried to justify an STI... but it wasn't as nice a DD, and its raison d'etre and my goals were incompatible.

 

I find the two models very different although mechanically they are obviously very similar.

 

I could have bought an STi instead of my LGT but for one thing my Wife said she wouldn't ride in the same car as me. Not refined enough for her tastes and too racer looking.

 

Secondly I cant be bothered having every kid pulling up alongside me wanting to test their civic against my STi.

Looking in the mirror wondering if the cop is going to do a U turn and pull me over and check everything is legal on the car because its a flashy looking Rex.

Worrying that people are eyeing up the car whenever its in a carpark somewhere.

Having people look at me like I haven't finished growing up yet and driving a 'sensible car'.

 

To me driving a WRX is like walking around in a clown costume.

Its far too obvious.

Nice to drive a friends perhaps on the weekend but I like my subtle LGT.

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I posted first here in this thread:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/intercooler-cracks-do-151413.html

 

My thread on NASIOC:

 

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2106384

 

This simple mod is the absolute cure for the "plastic" TMIC, that makes it better IMO than the solid aluminum WRX TMIC, and I also argue that it is better than most of the aftermarket alternatives... for a street driven DD Stg2.

Very nice & clean, My steel straps are still work , over 16psi & 173k later.

http://i99.photobucket.com/albums/l293/HAMMERDOWNGT/Subaru/th_0821071157.jpg

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/stock-tmic-peace-mind-mod-68994.html?p=1334884#post1334884

Mike

Mileage:331487 Retired/Sold

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I find the two models very different although mechanically they are obviously very similar.

 

I could have bought an STi instead of my LGT but for one thing my Wife said she wouldn't ride in the same car as me. Not refined enough for her tastes and too racer looking.

 

Secondly I cant be bothered having every kid pulling up alongside me wanting to test their civic against my STi.

Looking in the mirror wondering if the cop is going to do a U turn and pull me over and check everything is legal on the car because its a flashy looking Rex.

Worrying that people are eyeing up the car whenever its in a carpark somewhere.

Having people look at me like I haven't finished growing up yet and driving a 'sensible car'.

 

To me driving a WRX is like walking around in a clown costume.

Its far too obvious.

Nice to drive a friends perhaps on the weekend but I like my subtle LGT.

 

Since that post I've obviously moved on :icon_mrgr My wife actually made it happen. My '11 OBP STi sedan is a far different car, despite its similarities, than the WRX. It turns heads, too, but with a nice difference. I came out of a restaurant this past weekend to find a late teens girl photographing it. It is a beautiful car, including its new wing.

 

I enjoyed my LGT as well as loving it. It remains, to me, the zenith of Subaru styling art. Four years and half the price of a new one later in repairs (to things I broke) and mods and it had become... old, to me. Plus, I knew what I wanted to replace it. It took an '09 3.0R Ltd, the best Legacy Subaru may ever build, and an '11 WRX to confirm that want. The '11 STi fulfills it.

 

I'm old enough to not worry what people think about me. It was my own conclusion that the car didn't "fit" me... but you're correct about it being obvious. Part of the "fit" incongruity, aside from appearances, was the LGTish-ness of it... I'd done that, and was ready for the good stuff. The STi starts off being superior in every way that matters to me. It also fits me perfectly appearance-wise.

 

I still have the plate from my LGT... ZZZZZZZZ. I enjoyed it as the sleeper it was. Its picture is still on the wall in front of me. But my thoughts and my energy now go, happily, into my STi. Turning the pages.

 

This might be a good time to say, once again, that the LGT/08+ WRX TMIC (BP Modded, of course :) ) is the best TMIC for a daily driver on the planet. I'm happy with my STi's large, hood-scoop-filling, TMIC... but it sucks as a DD. Luckily that isn't a problem often for me. This thing gets wicked hot, and is never cool to the touch after driving around town this summer... the opposite of the TMIC in my LGT or WRX, which were almost always cool no matter what.

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Lots of bickering here, some good information, some not so good. Oh, and BTW, the TMIC on the Z06 is a Bell core which measures 24"x6"x12" and flows enough for 2100HP, but only if you're driving on the moon for the reduced gravity :lol: No? FunnyFail? :confused:

The whole TMIC idea baffles me. I get it Subaru, a hood scoop is "cool" but that is the shittiest place to put an IC of any type. Heat rises, and placing the TMIC near the turbo and dowpipe and hot engine is stupid. Of course heatsoak will be an issue with this location.

I'll say this though: Heatsoaked situations aside, pretty much any bar and plate TMIC will out-flow and out-cool the stocker. The larger the ∆T the better. The smaller the ∆P the better. I don't really understand what is so hard to grasp about this? The IC is a resistor to flow. The lower the ∆P the better it flows, the more power you will make. The larger the ∆T the cooler your intake temps, the more power you will make. Because the inlet temp to the IC will be constant, the IC that has a larger differential is the better IC from a thermal standpoint. Without measuring pressure and temperature before and after the IC, nothing can be proved about which is a better IC. But in my experiences on other turbo powertrains, there is no chance an aftermarket IC won't flow and cool better than the stock application it is intended to replace. Period, nothing else to it.

If you spend time in bumper to bumper traffic or multiple stop lights, then your aftermarket IC will heat soak, and eventually, so will your stocker. I don't have any data on that, but in theory it makes sense, because the OEM IC is smaller and has thermoplastic endtanks, which don't conduct heat like AL does.

Oh, and data isn't for people who can't think; it's for people who DO think. Engineers and scientists, you know? Mr. Empirical Data hands Mr. Theory his ass, 10 out of 10 times in the real world.

For me, personally since I won't be going higher than Stage 2, I'm doing the BPTMIC mod. I can't afford the cost of an aftermarket TMIC on my DD, and as long as the stocker doesn't blow apart, I can't justify the need for it, to myself. I'll probably only hit full boost twice ever, I just want to be tuned for when I do. Eventually, if/when I rebuild the engine and get a bigger turbo, I'll get a FMIC, because as I stated, the TMIC is stupid.

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  • 1 month later...
  • 1 month later...
Seriously considering this and Infamous stage 2 e-tune. Keep hearing it's the cat's meow...just afraid to jack something up like brick my ecu!

 

The BPTMIC mod isn't that hard. One thing I did do was leave my BPV installed because the bolts didn't want to come out. Didn't want to strip the inserts out of the plastic.

 

As far as etuning, Infamous can help you with the process, but using the eBay VAG-COM cable and a laptop, the process is very easy on an 05.

 

Yes, stage 2 is very fun. And I have hit 17psi more than twice in the last week, so my estimate was off :lol:

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i built the BPTMIC kit, just havent had a chance to install it yet.

 

its very simple, just be careful when you're drilling the holes in the long "beams". I used a towel on my dining room table, drill bit went through, bit into the towel, and spun everything including the metal shavings all over the dining room :lol:

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  • 3 weeks later...
I have been running this mod for quite awhile now and it has held up to more than 5 trackdays at 17psi on the VF40. I have since upgraded to a VF52 and am running ~20psi now. I have a trackday coming up, as well as many more. This will be a great test of this mod as to how well it holds the endtanks hold together, especially since im exceeding the limit by a couple psi and will be doing it for 5x 20min sessions -- thats alot of hitting peak boost.
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  • 1 month later...

Just wanted to add my 2 pennies as I just did this mod. DO IT!! Unless your growing a money tree I think everyone with the OE TMIC should do this. I was only running a COBB Stage 1 tune and noticed the little tabs spreading and oil seeping out of the cracks. While I think the Subaru TMIC is a good design and a good match for the stock turbo I think the execution could have been better. A higher strength metal for the piece that joins the plastic end tanks to the core would have added a few bucks to the cost of the TMIC but would have eliminated the weak point.

That said I think major props should be given to SeeeYa for coming up with such an easy cost effective solution. For less than 15 bucks in parts and a few hours labor you have a nearly indestructible TMIC that should last a VERY long time. :)

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Anyone know the part number for the U-Channel? Where is everyone getting it from?

 

When I tried the same mod on my own earlier, IIRC, I found them at Lowe's. Either that or Home Depot, I can't remember 100% because I know I went to both - one of them fits VERY nicely (just a little tapping with a hammer). I actually found two sizes of U-channels that would fit inside each other (from the same store) to do extra reinforcement. However, SeeeeYa's machining skills (he sent me a kit) are WAY beyond mine.

 

I did find his kit rubbed on the driver's side front, as I expected it might (it's a REALLY tight fit there) so I didn't install it there (I had not yet tried mine there, so I can't say if there is any solution). Trying to make a "fits every variation out there" kit is tough.

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More updates! I've done Willow Springs (WSIR) and Streets of Willow (SOW) with this mod. I peak at 20psi and taper off at 15psi on my VF52. I logged 80miles of racing at SOW and 120miles at WSIR. This thing held up like a champ and I suffered no heatsoak issues since you're constantly moving at the track. This thing serves its purpose as being a cheap alternative to an aftermarket TMIC that doesn't spit at boost levels greater than 18psi and also overachieves by being able to handle the long duration, multiple cycles of repeated boost.

 

For those contemplating this mod, do so in confidence.

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Not sure what you mean by ugly? With the cover on you can tell anything was done to the TMIC..

 

I got the 3/8" channel from lowes. All you need is one piece as its enough to cut into the 4 smaller pieces. I also used low profile nuts and bolts from lowes as well and it worked perfectly. No need to trim anything on the cover. One thing I also did differently is I only trimmed down the side of the channel that sits on top of the plastic end tanks. The other side snugs down nicely on the IC core for a nice smooth appearance.

 

Here's a pic of what I'm talking about

channel.jpg.3664a79935d4b7a223a4dcfb7d2735cd.jpg

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Not sure what you mean by ugly? With the cover on you can tell anything was done to the TMIC..

 

I got the 3/8" channel from lowes. All you need is one piece as its enough to cut into the 4 smaller pieces. I also used low profile nuts and bolts from lowes as well and it worked perfectly. No need to trim anything on the cover. One thing I also did differently is I only trimmed down the side of the channel that sits on top of the plastic end tanks. The other side snugs down nicely on the IC core for a nice smooth appearance.

 

Here's a pic of what I'm talking about

 

A BP TMIC Mod Kit built to spec has both sides trimmed, but to different lengths. They are not equal. The one on the plastic side is, as you noted, trimmed so that the U-ch sits fully onto the seam. The IC side is trimmed to allow airflow to the entire core. No harm will come from leaving it longer, but it will remove a small percentage of efficiency.

 

Good work, 05COLEGGT!. Variations here and there by those who built their own, or modified pre-made Kits, contributed to the design. Frankly, given the work it takes to shorten a side, if leaving one side at "stock" length gets your TMIC reinforced I consider that a definite WIN.

 

The plans are available to anyone who wants them. It works beyond ANY criticism, as Saul_Good has proven. No TMIC, regardless of boost has or will fail once Modded properly. There will always be detractors no matter the subject, but also as always, Time Will Tell. This mod works. Period.

 

That said:

 

Maybe this isn't the place, but it's here... I don't know what has happened to LegacyGT.com relative to comportment. It isn't the website I joined or was once proud to reference as an example of an intelligent, civil contrast to NastySocks. Thankfully, although I'm sure it will also devolve into the slums, IWSTI.com moderators would have removed the post by W R and admonished others to stay on topic. Such is life.

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I haven't been on LGT long enough to comment, but I have seen the same trend happen on other forums I was once proud to be a part of. I think it stems from having more and more younger, less experienced people join forums. These people come from the 'Spoon Fed' generation. People that lack the imagination necessary to foster innovation. They grew up with programmable calculators so they didn't have to learn long division. ;)

You can see the trend not just in the automotive aspect but everywhere in the world. They want the quick fix without learning about what the fix is.

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If I still had my OEM TMIC, I'd do this mod. Seems like as simple a mod as you could find that provides significant return on investment v-a-v buying a replacement OEM or AM one.

 

And just a reminder to all, let's keep this on topic, positive and moving forward, for the good of all.

- Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum -
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I posted first here in this thread:

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/intercooler-cracks-do-151413.html

 

My thread on NASIOC:

 

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2106384

 

This simple mod is the absolute cure for the "plastic" TMIC, that makes it better IMO than the solid aluminum WRX TMIC, and I also argue that it is better than most of the aftermarket alternatives... for a street driven DD Stg2.

 

Unfortunately for the NastySock community, that thread was deleted, but there are others the same mods shuffled to various places if you look for them. Vendors, not the membership, are most important there, unlike here on LegacyGT(dot)com.

 

http://i167.photobucket.com/albums/u148/cherrybloom203/bp-imafinish.png

 

"Clever" humor... but it's the picture that is relevant here, mostly. :)

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3710924&postcount=499

 

I'll have data for mine eventually here.. got a little tough with rupturing my Achilles and having my fuel pump fail... FWIW, I was able to get better dyno numbers with my stock IC than with the AVO, I suspect due to the terrible angles for air flow and the fact that it sits right over the turbo, whereas the stocker was shaped to not be above it.

 

My stocker blew out the endtanks though, even jbwelded at 17.5psi, actually several stock ICs did... The ProcessWest obviously has some airflow angles as well, but they are smoother and less abrupt. I wouldn't be surprised to see it perform much better than an AVO/Perrin...

 

Thank SSpeed for this, and wish him a speedy recovery.

 

http://legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3707462&postcount=266

 

More updates! I've done Willow Springs (WSIR) and Streets of Willow (SOW) with this mod. I peak at 20psi and taper off at 15psi on my VF52. I logged 80miles of racing at SOW and 120miles at WSIR. This thing held up like a champ and I suffered no heatsoak issues since you're constantly moving at the track. This thing serves its purpose as being a cheap alternative to an aftermarket TMIC that doesn't spit at boost levels greater than 18psi and also overachieves by being able to handle the long duration, multiple cycles of repeated boost.

 

For those contemplating this mod, do so in confidence.

 

Saul_Good :icon_mrgr

 

Sometimes, pudding takes longer to make than others. ;)

 

My thanks to everyone who has positively contributed to the BulletProof TMIC Mod and this thread. Your efforts have influenced not only the design, they have also paved the way for others to follow.

 

I'm working on making the data for this more accessible, but as always since the beginning, anyone who wants the plans can have them for free. PM me meantime.

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Here's my list break down from lowes. I lost my reciept but I know it wasn't more than 15 USD for everything

 

(4) 4" 1/4 x 20 Hex Tap Bolts

(4) 1/4 x 20 Flanged Hex lock nuts

3/8" AL Plywood Channel

 

Excellent. Simpler, easier, and cheaper than my conservative design.

 

My only comment would be to watch the interface of the rail and bolt at the BPV recirc hose. After a while on the WRX the contact from the original design, somewhat like yours is now, showed the recirc hose was being abraded. Feedback and my own experience caused me to change to the updated design specs. Lack of space is why I swept the channel back, used smallest possible "bolt" diameter and, after flattening the bolt there, covered it with shrink tubing. Some vehicles have more, some less space. All are close.

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