ACT HD, Perf Street, TSK3 installed

Hi All.

Just installed a new ACT HD kit with Street Performance disc, OEM WRX flywheel, and the TSK3 kit, too.

The TSK3 was a last minute add… can’t believe I never saw the related postings on this. Oh well, got it overnighted just in time to have it go in. Everything was ordered from FredBeans… great customer service from Jeremy and Ryan.

First, a couple of comparisons. Per our mail scale at work the OEM flywheel weighed 22-23lbs. The original Dual-Mass flywheel is 27-28lbs. Only 5lbs difference. I was a little shocked by this, to be honest.

The DM flywheel had a lot of play in it. I could move it a good 1/2" by hand and I wasn't really trying. Not sure if this is normal, but if you combine that with my theory that the internal springs were failing/wore out, it certainly explains a lot of the crappy shifting in my car.

The install was a good 7-8 hours in a shop. It was paid, but at a friend rate... the friend did not expect the turbo clearance issues and would have charged me more if he had it to do all over again.

Ok, on to driving impressions...

First, clutch is heavier, but not too bad. It's been 3 days and I'm getting used to it, but it is noticeable. Engagement is mid-way plus up in travel, great location. The window is narrow... so, with the extra weight it takes some focus to feather in nicely.

Speaking of feathering in... given there is only a 5lb weight difference I am surprised at how fast the car now revs, especially from idle to ~2500rpms. This has made feathering in first a little tricky... but again, now on my 3rd day and it is better already.

NVH has increased, significantly, in my opinion. NVH is a relative term as each individual is attuned to different things. I hear and feel more engine and drivetrain NVH at all speeds. I am not saying this is bad… it just isn’t good. The DM flywheel must have served a purpose of more than trying to smooth out shifts… it did a darn good job of isolating the driver from mechanicals. It has more of an older WRX or STi feel/sound to it now. If I can eek out one pro here it would be that you feel more connected to the car.

There is no chatter or shudder that I can perceive. The TSK3 went in without issue and since I never drove one without I don’t know what I’m not missing. I’m thinking it was damn good insurance, at a minimum.

I haven’t really gotten on it as I’m still breaking it in, but there is no slop when you engage. In the past, I would feel the DM flywheel rotating and slapping on a full compression of the internal springs on a hard acceleration or deceleration.

I’m in it now for 200+ miles, half highway, and my overall impression of this setup is improving, but I can’t say if I had it to do all over I would choose this route. Here is my reasoning…

First… I am bone stock. I commute 100 miles a day. I really want peace and quite most of the time.

Second… Cost. I checked all around. Parts cost me $988 shipped (tsk3 was overnighted). Labor (friend rate) was $350. Elsewhere was a more typical $700, but was much further away… and no friend rate. So, I got a bargain at $1338. The dealer quoted me $1900 installed for the OEM w/DM flywheel. The DM flywheel is $250-300 more than the single, leaving about $250-300 more additional in labor for the dealer than what I paid… more in line with other external quotes.

Bottom line on cost would have been roughly neutral. You guys that can do this yourself obviously can save some good money. We were going to give this a go ourselves, but it is 10 degrees and the friend rate was too tempting.

It will be interesting to see how things improve/change over the next few weeks and I will update as to the cost benefit on this upgrade.

Thanks to everyone on the boards who have posted their installs over the past years. I’ve been looking at this mod since I had my silver Stg II sedan.

Yep, I get that. I just expected a bigger difference in weight between the two. The 5lbs is quite noticeable in the early and lower revs. I might notice more when I get past the break in period... however, by then I might just be completely used to it.

5 lbs on a rotating mass is alot...

The install was a good 7-8 hours in a shop. It was paid, but at a friend rate... the friend did not expect the turbo clearance issues and would have charged me more if he had it to do all over again.

I had the exact same turbo clearance issue. Without that I could have been done 4 hours earlier.

Next time you see your friend, ask him if he thinks removing the turbo would have made it easier. I resisted doing that becuase I'd have to crack open the oil lines and didn't have any copper washers on hand for the banjo fittings. Next time, the turbo is coming off.

What turbo clearance issue are you guys referring to?

Looking towards the transmission bellhousing from the front of the car... The 'bump' around the stud on the bottom edge of the turbo exhaust outlet comes into contact with the 11 o'clock position of the bellhousing.

As I was both removing and reinstalling the trans these two edged came together and left a few scratches in the bellhousing.

Stand by, I'll get a pic using the boroscope.

http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m159/Scruit/turboclearance.jpg

This image is take from the firewall looking towards the turbo, inside the heat shield. There's only about 1/8 inch clearance between the turbo exhaust flange around the low/center bolt and the flange around highest/passenger side bellhousing bolt as you're engaging/disengaging the trans. 1/8" too low and the studs won't line up. 1/8" too high and the bellhousing hits the turbo.

I wish I would have thought about the TSK3 before I had my clutch done.

We need to meet and catch up sometime.

I had to grind my bellhousing a bit and also forgot to preinstall the bolt and had to grind the head of the bolt to install it in lastly.

The NVH is increased 10 fold with the WRX flywheel and act clutch in my car.

I am now 400+ miles into the new clutch.

Driveability is better, due to me getting use to the new stuff and possible break in. Essentially, if you didn't know any better, you'd think it was stock and perfectly fine.

What isn't stock and perfectly fine is the NVH increase. Between 2500 and 3500 rpms it is down right annoying. Honestly, I think someone put a bull horn in the engine compartment, taped the trigger, and faced it toward the driver seat. I hear everything.

Serious dissappointment on the NVH.

rob

RTP or someone else: can you explain to me how an ACT HD clutch, engaged against the flywheel in a normal-weight flywheel car, could cause noise?

It's not like the WRX flywheel isn't exactly the same as the 07-08 car either. It's the same one used in the LGT.

How can an engaged clutch be causing this increase in NVH?

Joe

RTP or someone else: can you explain to me how an ACT HD clutch, engaged against the flywheel in a normal-weight flywheel car, could cause noise?

 

It's not like the WRX flywheel isn't exactly the same as the 07-08 car either. It's the same one used in the LGT.

 

How can an engaged clutch be causing this increase in NVH?

 

Joe

Honestly, I wish I knew. I never would have thought that a clutch setup change would cause such a change in NVH.

However, I do know that automotive designers and engineers spend an enormous amount of time "tuning" an automobile... I don't mean performance wise. The way it sounds is a very important part of the process in creating a new car.

So, given that the Legacy is the flagship line at Subaru (supposedly), then my guess is that the DM flywheel was introduced to tune down the boxer engine and drivetrain sounds for a more "upscale" feel for this car.

But that is just my guess.

rob

Just put my ACT clutch, 06 WRX Flywheel, and TSK3 kit in Monday.

Here is a thread on NASIOC about similar noise on the WRX. Early posts are from 01, but it gets up to 09 by the end. Long thread.

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103494

If you search WRX deceleration noise on NASIOC you will find many threads. Seems its a common problem on the WRX, and since we now have WRX clutch......

Did a google search: 2006 subaru wrx transmission noise

Good read:

Subaru WRX Transmission - Gear Attack

Gear set solutions

By Scott Wills

The Subaru WRX has established its superiority with an affordable price tag and unforgettable all-around performance.

The WRX in stock trim can be a competitor almost anywhere it goes, whether it is rally or road racing; out of the box, this car disappoints many adversaries.

The five-speed transmission, however, is the topic of conversation for many enthusiasts on the street and many competitors at the track. The majority of the complaint list goes as follows:

Gear Set Symptoms

1) Hard launches break first gear

2) The car will not go back into first gear unless you come to a complete stop

3) Fifth gear is absolutely useless at the track

4) Constantly stuck between the top of first and the power in second

5) Transmission makes noise during decceleration

These aren't reflective of the opinions of the average WRX owner, but instead from those who push their WRXs to the very edge. Of course, as always, preventative maintenance is the name of the game for the WRX and its not-so-loved transmission.

Most of our testing was done with a few rally-prepped WRXs. Rallying is the ultimate test bed for any product because of its extreme conditions. A rule of thumb is, if it can stand up to rallying, it will stand up pretty much anywhere.

1) Hard launches break first gear

Most complaints come from those who have admitted to revving pretty high before dumping the clutch. The AWD cars are great for getting power to the ground, offering astounding amounts of traction.

When you modify the 2.0 turbo engine, it's easy to find a lot of torque and horsepower quickly, but remember the rest of the car needs to be addressed to handle the power gains.

The number one suggestion is to be aware of potential weaknesses and don't side step the clutch. It is very possible to launch hard with a little clutch finesse; however, be prepared to regularly maintain the clutch linings.

The other option is going with an after market gear set. Most of the aftermarket gear sets are way stronger than stock, but hard launches can destroy way more than just first gear...trust us.

2) The car will not go back into first gear unless you come to a complete stop

It always starts with a little synchro scratching going back to first gear. A new car is usually able to find first gear from 20 to 0 mph. Eventually, that speed lessens until all you get is an excruciating grinding noise unless you are at almost a complete stop.

This noise is very frustrating at the track, especially when the track has a lot of hairpins or very tight corners where first gear would be effective. First gear becomes useless as soon as you shift out of it until you come to a complete stop. The first thing to try is upgrading the transmission oil. The factory Subaru oil is not bad, but there are some very advanced lubricants on the market that can help with this problem.

We stumbled into the ultimate Subaru tranny oil info. We all know the basis for R&D on the WRX is rallying, so what does the World Rally Championship Subaru team run in their cars? Neo Synthetic lubricants, which are manufactured and distributed here in the United States.

We tried some Neo gear oil and eliminated a lot of the issues with the synchros going into first and fourth. The car was once again able to find first gear at around 20 mph. If you have been experiencing grinding issues, there's a chance that nothing short of replacing parts can remedy the problems.

3) Fifth gear is absolutely useless at the track

A WRX with stock tires will do a little more than 120 mph in fourth gear. As best as we can tell, fifth gear is just for highway cruising and fuel economy. There aren't many venues for club racing that warrant or have the track for speeds of more than 120 mph.

Best option here is an aftermarket gear set that has ratios more inclined to keep the WRX in its powerband throughout every gear. A close ratio system is ideal.

4) Constantly stuck between the top of first and the power in second

The thing on every WRX owner's mind is the six-speed STi transmission. Yes, this is definitely the best option for some in-between ratios; however, the expense of the transplant is not cost-effective for some of the grassroots racers, nor will it be legal under some series' rules, which require a standard transmission setup.

Changing the gear ratio in the factory box is a very effective way to go about it. There are gear sets available that help to make first gear usable by making it just a little taller, and second gear a little shorter.

5) Transmission makes noise during deceleration

This is a common problem, but technically not a problem at all. It's just a matter of inconsistent factory backlash in the ring-and-pinion gear. Some models do it more than others.

The Subaru dealership can fix the problem, but not with performance in mind. The dealership will replace the 27 -pound flywheel with a heavier model to keep the gearbox loaded, thus eliminating a decelerating noise.

Going the opposite direction with the flywheel weight will not get rid of the noise, nor will it increase it. The lighter flywheel will be noticeable in how quickly the car finds its powerband. Suggestion: Get over the noise. It's not a big deal, and certainly not worth compromising power.

In our research we have come up with a gear set that can take care of most of the rally and road racers complaints. Gimmie Gears & Accessories offers a "Sport" ratio that is most effective across the board.

The taller first gear of the sport ratio tends to fill the first to second void, and when you shift through the rest of the gears, you have a slightly shorter than stock rpm drop (approximately 750 rpm per gear), keeping the WRX in its desired powerband. The gear set has fewer, yet bigger and stronger teeth, offering the necessary strength for even heavily modified WRXs.

We contacted GT Motorsports, in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif., about handling the gear install for us. Follow along as we see exactly what it takes to do a performance upgrade inside the 2002 WRX five-speed gearbox.

That is a good read. Thanks gregnauman.

I have never changed my gear oil. Looks like I'm going to go buy the good stuff and give it a try.

Just put my ACT clutch, 06 WRX Flywheel, and TSK3 kit in Monday.

 

Here is a thread on NASIOC about similar noise on the WRX. Early posts are from 01, but it gets up to 09 by the end. Long thread.

 

http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=103494

 

If you search WRX deceleration noise on NASIOC you will find many threads. Seems its a common problem on the WRX, and since we now have WRX clutch......

 

Did a google search: 2006 subaru wrx transmission noise

 

Good read:

 

Subaru WRX Transmission - Gear Attack

 

Gear set solutions

By Scott Wills

 

 

The Subaru WRX has established its superiority with an affordable price tag and unforgettable all-around performance.

The WRX in stock trim can be a competitor almost anywhere it goes, whether it is rally or road racing; out of the box, this car disappoints many adversaries.

The five-speed transmission, however, is the topic of conversation for many enthusiasts on the street and many competitors at the track. The majority of the complaint list goes as follows:

Gear Set Symptoms

1) Hard launches break first gear

2) The car will not go back into first gear unless you come to a complete stop

3) Fifth gear is absolutely useless at the track

4) Constantly stuck between the top of first and the power in second

5) Transmission makes noise during decceleration

 

These aren't reflective of the opinions of the average WRX owner, but instead from those who push their WRXs to the very edge. Of course, as always, preventative maintenance is the name of the game for the WRX and its not-so-loved transmission.

Most of our testing was done with a few rally-prepped WRXs. Rallying is the ultimate test bed for any product because of its extreme conditions. A rule of thumb is, if it can stand up to rallying, it will stand up pretty much anywhere.

1) Hard launches break first gear

 

Most complaints come from those who have admitted to revving pretty high before dumping the clutch. The AWD cars are great for getting power to the ground, offering astounding amounts of traction.

When you modify the 2.0 turbo engine, it's easy to find a lot of torque and horsepower quickly, but remember the rest of the car needs to be addressed to handle the power gains.

The number one suggestion is to be aware of potential weaknesses and don't side step the clutch. It is very possible to launch hard with a little clutch finesse; however, be prepared to regularly maintain the clutch linings.

The other option is going with an after market gear set. Most of the aftermarket gear sets are way stronger than stock, but hard launches can destroy way more than just first gear...trust us.

2) The car will not go back into first gear unless you come to a complete stop

It always starts with a little synchro scratching going back to first gear. A new car is usually able to find first gear from 20 to 0 mph. Eventually, that speed lessens until all you get is an excruciating grinding noise unless you are at almost a complete stop.

This noise is very frustrating at the track, especially when the track has a lot of hairpins or very tight corners where first gear would be effective. First gear becomes useless as soon as you shift out of it until you come to a complete stop. The first thing to try is upgrading the transmission oil. The factory Subaru oil is not bad, but there are some very advanced lubricants on the market that can help with this problem.

We stumbled into the ultimate Subaru tranny oil info. We all know the basis for R&D on the WRX is rallying, so what does the World Rally Championship Subaru team run in their cars? Neo Synthetic lubricants, which are manufactured and distributed here in the United States.

We tried some Neo gear oil and eliminated a lot of the issues with the synchros going into first and fourth. The car was once again able to find first gear at around 20 mph. If you have been experiencing grinding issues, there's a chance that nothing short of replacing parts can remedy the problems.

3) Fifth gear is absolutely useless at the track

A WRX with stock tires will do a little more than 120 mph in fourth gear. As best as we can tell, fifth gear is just for highway cruising and fuel economy. There aren't many venues for club racing that warrant or have the track for speeds of more than 120 mph.

Best option here is an aftermarket gear set that has ratios more inclined to keep the WRX in its powerband throughout every gear. A close ratio system is ideal.

4) Constantly stuck between the top of first and the power in second

The thing on every WRX owner's mind is the six-speed STi transmission. Yes, this is definitely the best option for some in-between ratios; however, the expense of the transplant is not cost-effective for some of the grassroots racers, nor will it be legal under some series' rules, which require a standard transmission setup.

Changing the gear ratio in the factory box is a very effective way to go about it. There are gear sets available that help to make first gear usable by making it just a little taller, and second gear a little shorter.

5) Transmission makes noise during deceleration

This is a common problem, but technically not a problem at all. It's just a matter of inconsistent factory backlash in the ring-and-pinion gear. Some models do it more than others.

The Subaru dealership can fix the problem, but not with performance in mind. The dealership will replace the 27 -pound flywheel with a heavier model to keep the gearbox loaded, thus eliminating a decelerating noise.

Going the opposite direction with the flywheel weight will not get rid of the noise, nor will it increase it. The lighter flywheel will be noticeable in how quickly the car finds its powerband. Suggestion: Get over the noise. It's not a big deal, and certainly not worth compromising power.

In our research we have come up with a gear set that can take care of most of the rally and road racers complaints. Gimmie Gears & Accessories offers a "Sport" ratio that is most effective across the board.

The taller first gear of the sport ratio tends to fill the first to second void, and when you shift through the rest of the gears, you have a slightly shorter than stock rpm drop (approximately 750 rpm per gear), keeping the WRX in its desired powerband. The gear set has fewer, yet bigger and stronger teeth, offering the necessary strength for even heavily modified WRXs.

We contacted GT Motorsports, in Rancho Cucamonga, Calif., about handling the gear install for us. Follow along as we see exactly what it takes to do a performance upgrade inside the 2002 WRX five-speed gearbox.

Subaru Extra-s (based upon others) or Amsoil Severe Gear 75w110 (my experience).

Quality stuff in the cold, and on mine is reduced gear deceleration noises by a fair amount.

There are no additives needed for either the front diff (which is shared with the transmission) or the rear diff (which is a LSD).

The front diff on the 5mt LGT takes between 3.6-3.8 quarts, depending on how much you let drain out. Buy 4 quarts for it.

The rear diff takes about .8 quarts.

You can use Subaru Extra-S gear oil and use it in both. It's available from fredbeansparts.com, a vendor on here known as the KingofParts.

I used AMSOIL Severe Gear 75w110 in both and have been running it for about 20k miles now with great success.

You'd have to ask someone running the Extra-S about their experiences, but my experience with the amsoil is that my gear noises decreased notably.

You can use Subaru Extra-S gear oil and use it in both. It's available from fredbeansparts.com, a vendor on here known as the KingofParts.

FYI, they changed their screenname to FredBeansParts.

I am using Redline 75W-90NS in my transmission and diff and they work great, although I can't say they made much difference in gear noise, which was never a problem anyways.

My tsk-3/act/wrx fly didn't add any NVH whatsoever. I think your issue is elsewhere

He doesnt have a problem at all. Search the web this is common with the WRX clutch, even stock.

TONS of articles on this on the net, in magazines etc. and even suggestions on how to combat it.

I will also note the original poster rtp said this:

NVH has increased, significantly, in my opinion. NVH is a relative term as each individual is attuned to different things. I hear and feel more engine and drivetrain NVH at all speeds. I am not saying this is bad… it just isn’t good. The DM flywheel must have served a purpose of more than trying to smooth out shifts… it did a darn good job of isolating the driver from mechanicals. It has more of an older WRX or STi feel/sound to it now. If I can eek out one pro here it would be that you feel more connected to the car.

There is no chatter or shudder that I can perceive. The TSK3 went in without issue and since I never drove one without I don’t know what I’m not missing. I’m thinking it was damn good insurance, at a minimum.

Looks like to me you reported a similar experience when you installed yours:

Ok, so i just had my mechanic install the hd5mm ACT HD street disk along with a stock 06 wrx flywheel. Just giving my opinion so far on how it feels. I have only put about 80 miles on it so far. Engagement of the clutch feels alot shorter. Almost like less travel to engage it. The stock feel seemed as if it just took forever to engage. Pedal does seem a tad bit stiffer. My mechanic also installed the TSK3 tranquil kit throwout bearing. I have no chatter on acceleration/engagement. I do have a small amount on delereration/engagement. So far I don't have any weird noises that I have heard to be common with this setup. I'm not sure if anyone else has used the TSK3 kit, but I will keep everyone informed on how its working. My stock clutch flywheel/pressure plate was in bad shape. Along with my throwout bearing. The surfaces of the fly and pp, were blue and purple, big time warping and hot spots. Hopefully this holds up better than stock!

READ THE WEB, THIS IS COMMON, TO HAVE THE DECELERATION NOISE.

Your car is fine, drive it like you put a heavy duty clutch in it!

My tsk-3/act/wrx fly didn't add any NVH whatsoever. I think your issue is elsewhere

Yep, my issue lies in between my ears!

I'm picky, sensitive, and critical to all mods and changes. Probably explains why I'm not married anymore, too.

It's all good. The clutch feel, engagement, etc is outstanding. Gear lash, as greg has pointed out in his posts, is the main culprit. Yes, I'm slowly becoming numb to it but it still frustrates me.

I'm pushing 1000 miles now, so I'm going to get on it in a week or so so I can report on the performance side... I don't think I will be disappointed.

I am the same way, but still married, I got a keeper

Ill be driving down the road and say honey do you hear that noise. What noise she will say.

I love to drive cars and I can hear/feel alot of stuff.

When the TOB went out, I heard the noise and immeadiately said, well I guess its time for a clutch. Went up placed my foot on the pedal and it was gone.

I have about 1000 on mine now and loving it. Its winter now and pretty cold out so Ill save my thrashing til spring when I can put E85 back in.