Guest Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 So today during 6MT install we made unexpected discovery. One of the Superpro (Fulcrum) LCA bushings I had installed in SpecB arm walked out a bit from the arm! See the pic. This is surprising because I was running another pair of these - also in SpecB arms for over a year (and >10k miles) without any issues. Granted, unlike before, this pair was subject to hard track & autox driving. I replaced the arms because I had extra set that I used to install the Whiteline roll center kit (removed since then anyway). Could it be installation issue? Like pressing them in at an angle and messing up the arms? The original bushings was installed by whitetiger who knows his s***. The walking one was pressed in by a local shop (Fastrack automotive). I had bad vibes about the latter - when I picked the arms up from them I noticed there were marks on the arms around the bushings from clumsy attempts to clamp them and said they destroyed the original bushings during removal (something whitetiger had no issues with). UPDATE 07-JAN-09: It's confirmed. The shop ruined both of my LCAs!!! The one that walked out has the part of hole "crushed", effectively enlarging the diameter. The other one has multiple gouges. I verified the diameter of the Superpro bushings and it is exactly like stock. UPDATE 22-JAN-09: The shop (Fastrack) replaced both arms free of charge. I am very pleased about it - especially that these arms are not cheap. It was great to find the shop is honest and takes responsibility for their work, which made me want to be their customer forever. Surprisingly and sadly, the owner when I picked the arms today acted like I did something wrong (how?) and mentioned "he does not believe it was caused by the press work" And it kinda felt like I am not welcome there anymore - I don't know if so, but it felt awkward. I sorta expected at least "We are sorry for the inconvenience". After all the outcome of the bushing walking out completely could have been very not pretty. I guess I expected too much.... http://i150.photobucket.com/albums/s108/wujek1976/2009-01-03_152436_b__2220.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I vaguely remember reading something about a tweak in the OD going from Superpro to AVO bushings. IIRC, the AVO's had a slightly larger OD on the metal sleeve to ensure a proper force fit. Glad you caught it before something catastrophic happened. The Crimson Dynamo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 I vaguely remember reading something about a tweak in the OD going from Superpro to AVO bushings. IIRC, the AVO's had a slightly larger OD on the metal sleeve to ensure a proper force fit. Glad you caught it before something catastrophic happened. Yes, I remember AVO posting that claim, but then Global (Superpro distributor) responded claiming the measurement is the same (they even posted a picture with a micrometer on bushings). I don't know what to do now. I might get Group N bushings, which are like stock but stiffer. I found out that the Group N bushings for 08 STI will fit. In fact not only the rear big bushing (in the picture) but also the front one! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beanboy Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Wouldn't be too surprising if the install had something to do with it. I check mine every so often. -B http://www.standardshift.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
itsme Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 it might be something to do with the install. Aluminum is a soft metal and if they damaged it taking out the stock one they could have enlarged the hole. I installed my super pro at my friends shop with a hydraulic press. IMHO I would be worried about using that control arm. Racer X FMIC for '05-'09 LGTs, '08+ WRX and '10+ LGT,'14+ FXT, and '15+ WRX TMIC Racerxengineering.com Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SBT Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 AVO's has a significant ridge around the one end of the bushings to ensure that it doesn't "migrate" under load and stays where it's supposed to. Don't believe the Superpro has that. I'll try to find a picture I took of the improved AVO or find the link to the one on the site. - Pro amore Dei et patriam et populum - Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MOMSWGN Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Got the AVOs have checked several times and no problems. Group N ones sound/look nice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted January 4, 2009 Share Posted January 4, 2009 Yes, I remember AVO posting that claim, but then Global (Superpro distributor) responded claiming the measurement is the same (they even posted a picture with a micrometer on bushings). I don't know what to do now. I might get Group N bushings, which are like stock but stiffer. I found out that the Group N bushings for 08 STI will fit. In fact not only the rear big bushing (in the picture) but also the front one! Unclemat go with the AVO or check out the perrin's on perrins website. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LittleBlueGT Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The AVO ones only have a lip on one side, so is that going to solve the problem for sure? Full tune of 68HTA, KSTech 73 MAF, Racer X FMIC and ID1000s................by the DataLog Mafia!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grmorrow04 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Yes, it should. Reason being that the lip keeps the bushing from going farther in. Granted, you have to install the bushing with the lip on the bottom of the control arm, but that's the intent of the design. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kha Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Yes, it should. Reason being that the lip keeps the bushing from going farther in. Granted, you have to install the bushing with the lip on the bottom of the control arm, but that's the intent of the design. I'm about to put in AVO bushings, and I was thinking lips at the bottom too. But the instructions that came with it says "the CAB sleeved assembly must be pressed in from the top of the control arm assembly, with the lip at the top." Can someone confirm this? Paul? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 ^That is correct. I just did these a few weeks ago. I think the reason for this is the force these have on them would pull the bushing out from the bottom side I am assuming. Since you have a lip on the top of the bushing, on the top side of the control arm it cannot be pulled through. I just did them as the instructions stated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Remove the rubber bush assembly from the control arm with a hand press or mechanical press. Press the AVO CAB bushing outer assembly into the control arm with a mechanical or hand press. The CAB outer metal sleeve has a small raised lip at the top outer edge. This is to keep the CAB from being pushed out of the control arm in heavy use. The CAB sleeved assembly must be pressed in from the top of the control arm assembly, with the lip at the top. This holds the assembly in place correctly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The Superpro walked out towards the top (as you see in the pic). So even if they had a lip there it would not do anything. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=90287&highlight=AVO+bushings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scooby2.5 Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 The Superpro walked out towards the top (as you see in the pic). So even if they had a lip there it would not do anything. Interesting, Ill keep an eye on my AVO bushings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sportwagon Posted January 5, 2009 Share Posted January 5, 2009 Great... I had my superpro bushings installed into Spec B arms at fastrack too! Hopefully they are still in the correct seated position... Another thing to worry about! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Turninconcepts Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 You could use some locktite on the metal to help hold it in place. Never seen it happen in person though. Tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gmachine Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 What about drilling 2 small holes 180 deg. apart, thru the sides of the control arm and into the bushing. Then hammer in roll pins to keep bushing from walking up or down? Or tapping the holes and using machine screws as a sort of set screw,less permanent than roll pins. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mercury3545 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 What about drilling 2 small holes 180 deg. apart, thru the sides of the control arm and into the bushing. Then hammer in roll pins to keep bushing from walking up or down? Or tapping the holes and using machine screws as a sort of set screw,less permanent than roll pins. I would think that would weaken the control arms drilling holes in them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grmorrow04 Posted January 6, 2009 Share Posted January 6, 2009 Are the holes that the bushings go in tapered? If they have a straight thru bore, then I think Superpro and AVO need to redesign the bushing to have a lip on the bottom instead of the top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 7, 2009 Share Posted January 7, 2009 The holes are not tapered. It's confirmed. The shop ruined both of my LCAs!!! The one that walked out has the part of hole "crushed", effectively enlarging the diameter. The other one has multiple gouges. I had them pressed out at another shop in order to verify diameter. Diameter of Superpros is correct, just like the stock ones, as it has been posted by their distributor's representative: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1273153#post1273153 I called the shop that installed them. They told me to bring them back and they will look at it. We'll see if they take responsibility for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ridgeracer Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 Sucks about them screwing up your LCA. I have my Superpros in for about 30K miles with no problems.. "Gimme mines Balboa...Gimme mines".....Clubber Lang - Mr. T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sportwagon Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 The holes are not tapered. It's confirmed. The shop ruined both of my LCAs!!! The one that walked out has the part of hole "crushed", effectively enlarging the diameter. The other one has multiple gouges. I had them pressed out at another shop in order to verify diameter. Diameter of Superpros is correct, just like the stock ones, as it has been posted by their distributor's representative: http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?p=1273153#post1273153 I called the shop that installed them. They told me to bring them back and they will look at it. We'll see if they take responsibility for it. That Sucks... I really hope they do own up to it and make it better!!! Do me a favor... Say hi to my poor car while you are there! Tell her that I miss her and she's gonna be all better soon! And when she's all fixed up... I'll take her for a long, long ride! and get Ice cream, too! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
atc5 Posted January 8, 2009 Share Posted January 8, 2009 It's confirmed. The shop ruined both of my LCAs!!! The one that walked out has the part of hole "crushed", effectively enlarging the diameter. The other one has multiple gouges Brutal. You just can't win...every shop that does work on your car/parts just f^c(s it up (including Subaru). Sorry to hear it and I hope the bastards make good on this for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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