Q's about factory Spec.B tires...

A few hours ago, I traded in my 2008 Legacy 2.5 GT Limited for a 2008 Legacy Spec.B. I couldn't pass up the opportunity when a used Spec.B in great condition was found. Probably a bad financial decision, but my inner child is happy.

 

Anyway, the Spec.B comes with Bridgestone Potenza RE050A summer tires. I know performance degrades when temps get near freezing, but I would like to know how bad? I live in Chicago, and I have the pleasure of living in a spot with major streets all the way to the workplace.

 

Will careful driving during the winter suffice? Or will it negatively affect the structure/integrity of the tires that when summer rolls around, they won't perform? Recommendations? Thanks!!!

chicago gets some bad snow imo, get winter rubber!

 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/wraithakamrak/poster66480382.jpg

I think the term "degrade" is an understatement. Summer tires will freeze up and become rock hard in the winter resulting in little or no traction whether there's snow on the ground or not. They could be pretty dangerous to drive on through the winter months.

Speaking from personal experience, and this goes back in time a little before getting to the point, I originally bought a 2005 LGT limited sedan in December 2004, and with the stock RE92A's it handled winter in the mountains of southwestern Virginia adequately, but by next winter (2005-6)were not nearly so good, even with only 15K on them, and I then (2006-7) went with dedicated summers (Azeni 615) and a good closeout dedicated winter brand, some type of Nitto tire, which were unbelievably awesome in the occasional snows ( up to six inches), and more importantly, in the black ice conditions, (with plenty of melt and refreeze ice on the roadways at subfreezing temperatures). When I sold the car (with both sets of tires/wheels) the new owner actually preferred the softer ride of the winters over the 615s, and I had to tell her she would ruin the winters running them in the summer.

 

Fast forward to last year, which is when I sold the old LGT and bought a 2008 spec B. At the time I wasn't fully aware the tires were dedicated summers, which this last summer I have truly enjoyed. During that first winter, even brand new, they were actually worse than my old RE92A's. Because of that I have now bought a set of Dunlop Wintersport 3D dedicated winters for this year, and am back to alternating the tires per season, which around here is about mid-november to mid-april for the winter weather temperatures. Of course I am in the same TPMS boat as everyone else, but I can live with a light on my instrument panel, and my state inspection is in fall before I need to switch tires.

 

Bottom line, if you have snow or ice to contend with, the AWD is not as effective with summer tires, and a FWD or RWD with dedicated snows would likely do better. For my peace of mind, and for the health and well being of my family, the only reasonable solution is to use a better tire than the stock RE50's. I debated using an all season year round, but have plenty of tread left on the stockers and can't justify getting rid of them yet. I don't care to repeat last year's experience of sliding down my driveway to the road, with zero grip from my useless summer tires.

I'm in the same boat as you and even in the same location. I just got some Goodyear Eagle GT all seasons and time will tell how they handle in the snow. I only had ~5K on the RE050s.

Do NOT drive with RE050 in Chicago. I live in Northern Ontario. The winters here are colder than Chicago ... but not by much.

 

You will not be able to drive in the winter with the 050 ... at all ... period.

 

I got caught late last spring in a storm while I was out of town and after I swapped to my summer 050. I do LOTS of winter driving and was very mindful of the tires. No matter how careful or slow I drove, the car would not slow down, turn, etc. A really scary experience. Oh yeah .... this was simply driving a couple blocks to get supper. Thankfully temps. warmed up the next day when I needed to drive home and all was well.

 

Certainly more mindful of timing between my summer and winter wheel setups.

Anyone can drive with Summer tires on in the winter, it just depends how lucky/stupid you feel you are. The temp alone will, like everyone says, turn the summer tires hard allowing you to do nice donuts. If you will never have to suddenly stop or make any kind of hard maneuvers you will be ok. Summer tires are called Summer tires for a reason. Of course if you live in Florida you can get away with them.

Been there done that.Almost wrecked my Spec B in my driveway with only 1" of snow! Wife got out and walked.Tires only had 10k on them.I just put Goodyear UHP a/s GT's on 3 days ago.Let you know how they do.

Here's the best way to put it. I run Yoko AVS Sports. Great summer tire. Anyway, here in "cold" Los Angeles, there's a noticeable decrease in traction, even on dry roads, when the temps dip under 50. I notice it a lot in the morning on my way to work. There's a particular left-hander on to a freeway on ramp where the rear will easily break loose in cold weather. I don't even want to know how little grip there would be in truly cold conditions.

 

Point being, get some decent winter tires or at least all-seasons.

I just bought a new 2008 Spec B. I have already ordered a winter tire/wheel package. We had a just a dusting of snow (unexpected) today and I had to go 7 miles. It was a quite uncomfortable. I have put 1500 miles on the car since I took delivery last week. It is a great machine as I am sure you all know. Very pleased so far, but will feel better once the winter rubber is on.

Summer tires don't just suck ins now and ice, they also suck in cold weather.

Below about 40F, my RE-01Rs have no grip until they warm up, around 20F no amount of warming will save them

Buy some winter tires unless you want to wreck your car.

I can feel the pain..........this is the first winter with my '07 SpecB (it was stored last winter because I was on deployment) and it is down right dangerous. The lightest dusting of snow and it is like the car is on ice skates, which makes driving almost impossible. The plan is to down-size to 17" and put snows or just a good all-season (depending on the cost).

I can feel the pain..........this is the first winter with my '07 SpecB (it was stored last winter because I was on deployment) and it is down right dangerous. The lightest dusting of snow and it is like the car is on ice skates, which makes driving almost impossible. The plan is to down-size to 17" and put snows or just a good all-season (depending on the cost).

Cheap snows will be far better than cheap all-seasons in the winter.

Okay, I'm convinced that I should not be driving in the winter with summer tires. Thanks guys!!!

 

But here comes the next question. I'll never (hopefully not; what do they say, never say never?) take my Spec.B out to the tracks. Even though I've had many racing lessons under my belt and am quite efficient with basic skills like double-clutching and drifting (never tried it on an AWD before though), I am fairly certain that at my current age, the only time I'll do any kind of aggressive driving is when I want to get away from the idiot tailgating me or unable to stay in his lane, or when I just want to flex my muscles only for a few seconds. (I know, you're probably asking, then why get a Spec.B?)

 

So the question is, should I:

A) Buy a winter tire/wheel package (and if you opt for this, would you recommend a 17 or 18 incher), or

B) Buy all-season tires, replace the RE-050A, and call it a day?

 

Why the dilemma? When I had my 2008 Legacy 2.5 GT Limited, it came with factory Potenza RE92 allseason's. According to tirerack.com, it is rated one of the best. However, during the summer time, there were a couple times when the road was a little wet (after the rain), and when I hit this curve going southbound between 35-40 mph ([ame=http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&ll=41.901131,-87.620409&spn=0.002823,0.006502&z=18]Google Maps[/ame]), I lost traction and gently slid into another lane by about 8 to 10 inches. Not only that, on dry pavement, I've actually slid another time on another corner in lower Michigan Ave (if you live in Chicago, you probably know there are a lot of fun places to drive under major streets in downtown, like lower Michigan or lower Wacker). And I wasn't even going fast, about 30 mph in dry pavement. Granted, the slide was controlled, but totally unexpected. When I had my 2000 Mitsubishi Eclipse GT, it came with Goodyear Eagle RS-A allseason's, and I was able to take the same Lake Shore Drive corner in wet pavement at sometimes 40 mph with no problem! I was simply shocked that a highly rated and tested tire like the allseason's on my previous Legacy 2.5 GT Limited performed badly, considering that the H4 engine has a lower center of gravity. Was it that the Bridgestone allseason's simply sucked?

 

That is why I'm really torn in deciding if I should get winter tires and wheels, or just go with allseason's. Tirerack.com did a study some time ago that showed that allseason tires simply don't offer any advantages when snow is present (http://www.automotive.com/auto-news/02/24889/index.html) or (http://www.tirerack.com/winter/tech/techpage.jsp?techid=120#wont_as). So now, it threw me back into the dillemma, sort of leaning towards another set of wheels with winter tires, which is going to cost me about $1300 minimum (if I go with cheap winter tires, cheap wheels, and TPM sensors).

 

Thoughts?

Give the low long term extra-cost (amortized over the few years you'll get out of them, remember miles on winters are not miles on summers -- and wheels and sensor sare one time costs), I see no reason to not have dedicated summers and winters.

A proper set of winters is just soi much better in the winter. And summers are too in summer.

RE92s are crap though.

If you are in Chicago I would definitely recommended a dedicated winter wheel setup. It is quite surprising the difference it will make in the winter over all seasons.

 

We just swapped out some brand new Michelin all seasons on my wife's SUV for Nokian Hakka R last week. My wife claims she sees and feels a noticeable difference. BTW my wife is not in tune with the vehicle and the fact that she has noticed any difference at all was my point. The difference is obviously dramatic ... especially on a heavy vehicle like the SUV. We run dedicated winter rubber on both of our AWD vehicles. Mind you we are further north than Chicago ... but not by that much.

 

When I got my Spec.B I stumbled across a used wheel/tire setup on the drive home. I was on the RE050 in extremely poor conditions. The wheel shop had sat on the wheel setup for the entire winter and was really eager to get rid of them. For the price it was a no brainer. My winter wheels are 17".

 

I have contemplated whether or not this purchase under normal circumstances would have happened. In a perfect world I would have bought the car in May rather than February-March and wouldn't have needed winter rubber right away. I would have put winter rubber on the stock wheels and bought a new and more sharp summer wheel setup after major research .....

 

My situation now is that I have the 07 Spec.B stockers, a 17" winter setup and about 2 weeks ago I bought my NEW summer wheels that will go on in the spring with new rubber.

 

Obviously some money was spent having 3 setups .... but I am happy with the results. I'll have the stockers and may put snows on them for next season and sell the current winter setup .... or just store the stockers for the future when I decide to sell the car. The good thing that happened to me in this situation is that I had 2 full years to shop and find the new summer wheel setup that I love.

 

Good luck.

?

 

Why the dilemma? When I had my 2008 Legacy 2.5 GT Limited, it came with factory Potenza RE92 allseason's. According to tirerack.com, it is rated one of the best.

 

 

Unless something has drastically changed,the RE-92s were rated horribly on tirerack, and many of the members here including me have had very scary situations with them in rain and snow.

 

They are really bad.

 

However, there are plenty of really good A/S tires that may offer you the balance you are interested in.

 

I run Continental Contiextremecontacts that I LOVE all year round. They are one of the best in snow. Not snow tires, but way better than most A/S and in the summer they are really good.

 

Goodyear A/S are suppposed to be great, as are Michelin pilots, and other Bridgestones RE-960s

 

I think Yokohama came out with a new A/S that is supposed to be great

This is where I read that the RE92 AS is rated good: (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=28) I guess the comparison test was done several years ago. I looked up the Continental ContiExtremeContacts as you recommended, and it got rated 3rd in last month's comparison test (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=28).

 

I guess this will require lots of careful consideration. Unfortunately, I simply don't have time because it's starting to get cold here in Chicago!

 

More questions: If I were to go the route of the having a separate winter setup and purchase the TPMS sensors and kit,

A) Can I register the the sensors to the vehicle myself, or does that require a trip to the dealer? If it's DIY-able, anybody know how?

B) Can the vehicle store 2 different sets of TPMS sensors, or only one at a time?

 

Thanks!

More questions: If I were to go the route of the having a separate winter setup and purchase the TPMS sensors and kit,

A) Can I register the the sensors to the vehicle myself, or does that require a trip to the dealer? If it's DIY-able, anybody know how?

B) Can the vehicle store 2 different sets of TPMS sensors, or only one at a time?

 

Unfortunately Subaru did not include a way to register new sensors yourself. The system can also only store 4 sensors at one time. The only way to have a new set of sensors registered is a trip to the dealer.

This is where I read that the RE92 AS is rated good: (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=28) I guess the comparison test was done several years ago. I looked up the Continental ContiExtremeContacts as you recommended, and it got rated 3rd in last month's comparison test (http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tests/testDisplay.jsp?ttid=28).

 

I guess this will require lots of careful consideration. Unfortunately, I simply don't have time because it's starting to get cold here in Chicago!

 

More questions: If I were to go the route of the having a separate winter setup and purchase the TPMS sensors and kit,

A) Can I register the the sensors to the vehicle myself, or does that require a trip to the dealer? If it's DIY-able, anybody know how?

B) Can the vehicle store 2 different sets of TPMS sensors, or only one at a time?

 

Thanks!

 

The RE92s might have been second in the aforementioned test, but keep in mind that they're second from the bottom in the end-user survey results (although I think the stockers might be RE92As which are foruth from the bottom). The Spec.B stockers (RE050A) fair much better in their respective category. There are still mich better tires available for each category, though.

I appreciate all the info on this thread, it's good to hear and like the original poster, I live in Chicago as well, and just bought a Spec-B on Monday 12/1, I know perfect time to buy a car with summer tires...but the deal couldn't be beat. So, I'm stuck with summer tires and need to find a good winter tire. Either option I go with is tough for me, since I have little storage space or area for 4 tires since I live in an apt. Am I better off staying with the 18 rims and just getting a tire or swapping down to a 17" rim and winter tire?

If you don't have the room for tires get some good all-season tires.

I appreciate all the info on this thread, it's good to hear and like the original poster, I live in Chicago as well, and just bought a Spec-B on Monday 12/1, I know perfect time to buy a car with summer tires...but the deal couldn't be beat. So, I'm stuck with summer tires and need to find a good winter tire. Either option I go with is tough for me, since I have little storage space or area for 4 tires since I live in an apt. Am I better off staying with the 18 rims and just getting a tire or swapping down to a 17" rim and winter tire?

Get the snows and have an interesting coffee table.

I can tell you from experience this year already that the stock Spec B tires are crap in the snow. Going straight isn't a problem. Turning is ok if you have another lane you can use. But stopping was the one thing the car just didn't do.

I got a set of Michelin X-Ice in 215-45-18, and haven't driven in the snow yet, but already notice much more grip in everyday driving. Rank #2 in testing and are the least expensive for that size.

 

Dave

Here's my update on my dilemma:

 

I was very close to getting 17" rims and winter tires, and I thought I had finalized that thought. But this setup with cheap rims costs about $1,300, or $1,000 without the TPMS sensors.

 

Then when I read about the Pirelli PZero Nero M&S http://www.us.pirelli.com/web/catalog/car-suv-van/catalogo_desc.page?categoria=/catalog/car-suv-van/car/all-season&uri=/pirellityre/en_US/browser/xml/catalog/car-suv-van/CAR_PZRNMS_ALL.xml&prodotto=Nero&vehicleType=CAR-SUV-VAN, I totally changed my mind. It is an ultra high performance all season, with mud and snow capability (hence the M+S indicator in the product name). I figured that for living in Chicago with pretty good street salting and plowing on major streets (which I live on one and work at one), I figure the most I'll encounter is snow, which these tires can totally handle capably. If there ever is an ice storm, winter tires won't help at all, unless I get studded winter tires, which isn't practical for all winter long driving, plus the noise from the tires.

 

Of all the all season tires, these Pirelli's are rated pretty darn good in terms of grip, even though it can't be as good the summer ones, but I won't be taking my Spec.B out onto the tracks, so I figure these will suffice. =)

 

Anybody interested in a set of Bridgestone Potenza RE050A 18 inchers? They all still have 8/32" of tread depth left. Driven for 7650 miles. I'll also post to the Classifieds.