Bilstein BTS kit group buy...?

Why the 5056 instead of the 5058?

Mike's car is identical to mine and he's very satisfied with his modification, so I imagine that it would work fine for me, too. I don't know enough to engineer my own suspension set-up, so I'm willing to go with something already proven to work well.

I DO know that the stock suspension on my Outback needs help. Early in my experience with the car I did a fast lane change at highway speed on the interstate and was alarmed by the way the car was pitching and rolling back and forth. I must have done it just right to get an oscillation going. I prefer a more planted road feel.

You mentioned something about the weight of the 2.5 XT vs the 3.0 engine being almost the same. Do you know of any advantage to using a different set-up? You probably know more about this than do. I'm ready to listen.

That is my main question, what the differences are.

If you look at the curb weights, the 3.0 and 2.5xt are within a few pounds of eachother, while the 2.5xt is a few hundred more than the 2.5i.

I'm willing to bet the valving is different, but I don't know how they would have changed it.

That is my main question, what the differences are.

 

If you look at the curb weights, the 3.0 and 2.5xt are within a few pounds of eachother, while the 2.5xt is a few hundred more than the 2.5i.

 

I'm willing to bet the valving is different, but I don't know how they would have changed it.

to me, too. Maybe someone can enlighten us.

I'm surprised to hear that a turbo adds a few hundred pounds to the car's weight. I thought that they were supposed to the light-weight solution to more power. It didn't seem to me like that little turbo and inter-cooler sitting on top of the engine would weigh that much.

I think it's a pretty lightweight solution. You are making 73hp and 71ft-lbs more torque than the N/A at slightly less weight than the H6 (and with a boat load more torque).

I'm basing my figures off of the automatic versions of the 2009 2.5i limited, 2.5XT and 3.0R.

2.5i Limited - 3481lbs

2.5XT Limited - 3616lbs

3.0R Limited - 3631lbs

Seems like the 5058J might be the better option for the OBXT owners, unless there is something I'm missing.

Mike's car is identical to mine and he's very satisfied with his modification, so I imagine that it would work fine for me, too. I don't know enough to engineer my own suspension set-up, so I'm willing to go with something already proven to work well.

 

I DO know that the stock suspension on my Outback needs help. Early in my experience with the car I did a fast lane change at highway speed on the interstate and was alarmed by the way the car was pitching and rolling back and forth. I must have done it just right to get an oscillation going. I prefer a more planted road feel.

 

You mentioned something about the weight of the 2.5 XT vs the 3.0 engine being almost the same. Do you know of any advantage to using a different set-up? You probably know more about this than do. I'm ready to listen.

You may want to look at aftermarket lower control arm bushings as well. I got AVO poly bushings and makes handling more planted. Also will be installing AVO steering column poly bushings. These combined with the Bilsteins should significantly improve the handling.

I think the reason why the Outback handles this way stock is that it was truly designed to be a rugged off-road vehicle. So much so that some people say NOT to mod the swaybars because you lose some of the independent suspension qualities to go over rocks etc. Don't really need to go offroad that much personally...I mostly use my Outback as a truck for hauling stuff.

You mentioned something about the weight of the 2.5 XT vs the 3.0 engine being almost the same. Do you know of any advantage to using a different set-up? You probably know more about this than do. I'm ready to listen.

I think everyone tracking this thread has read Mike's write up and will agree that an upgrade to one of the Bilstein kits will be an improvement over stock. But, what's the better "fit" for OB XT's given the differences in weight? The 5056 or 5058 kit? Thoughts?

2005 curb weights

2.5i with AT = 3,355 (-125)

2.5XT with AT = 3,480

3.0R LLBean = 3,600 (-120)

Hi there - new to the list. I have a rear passenger side shock that has blown. Very interested in the Bilstein option. I have also been looking at King Springs from Australia - have not searched the site for this yet. What is the status of the group buy? How does this work? Sad to see that others have the same problems that I dislike about my car. I concur with Mike - first time Subaru buyer, last time too.

Thanks!

05 Outback XT 5sp manual

Wow, the weight difference is huge between an 05 and an 09. Looks like anyone with an 09 should look at getting the 5058j kit.

I think everyone tracking this thread has read Mike's write up and will agree that an upgrade to one of the Bilstein kits will be an improvement over stock. But, what's the better "fit" for OB XT's given the differences in weight? The 5056 or 5058 kit? Thoughts?

 

2005 curb weights

 

2.5i with AT = 3,355 (-125)

2.5XT with AT = 3,480

3.0R LLBean = 3,600 (-120)

Wow, the weight difference is huge between an 05 and an 09. Looks like anyone with an 09 should look at getting the 5058j kit.

The weight of the 2.5XT that I listed for was the base trim. I believe starting with 06 models the 2.5XT was only available as a Limited. Weight for a 05 XT Limited AT is 3,565. So, a lot closer to the 3.0R.

hmmmmmmm

very tempting

I'm amongst those very interested in a suspension upgrade for the OBXT... but $1700 is a pretty high price to pay for that.

Being especially cost conscious, I'm wondering, ride height aside, why folks don't just grab a junkyard legacy suspension and toss that on along with a stiffened rear sway. Am I missing something there? I'd love to know, as I'm planning this change myself.

IMNSHO - merely lowering down to Legacy height will cause some issues in geometry, screwing up the camber curve. Improves static camber, but go into a corner and you'll end up with less negative, maybe positive camber. I think.

If, OTOH, you remove the spacers that make the difference between a Legacy and Outback, it may be another matter. That's more work.

And last, do you really want junkyard shocks?

You may want to look at aftermarket lower control arm bushings as well. I got AVO poly bushings and makes handling more planted. Also will be installing AVO steering column poly bushings. These combined with the Bilsteins should significantly improve the handling.

 

I think the reason why the Outback handles this way stock is that it was truly designed to be a rugged off-road vehicle. So much so that some people say NOT to mod the swaybars because you lose some of the independent suspension qualities to go over rocks etc. Don't really need to go offroad that much personally...I mostly use my Outback as a truck for hauling stuff.

Better control arm bushings - a good idea. That goes on the list.

I see that you also installed 25 mm sway bars front & rear. What brand did you select and why did you choose that over the other brands available? Did you add stronger bar mounts and end links?

Many people just add a rear sway bar. Does the front one make that much extra difference?

Hi there - new to the list. I have a rear passenger side shock that has blown. Very interested in the Bilstein option. I have also been looking at King Springs from Australia - have not searched the site for this yet. What is the status of the group buy? How does this work? Sad to see that others have the same problems that I dislike about my car. I concur with Mike - first time Subaru buyer, last time too.

 

Thanks!

05 Outback XT 5sp manual

There isn't any Group Buy. Member rB5 researched it and found what seems to be the best deal on the Bilstein kit and no group participation is required. Everyone makes their own purchase at the current exchange rate and shipping costs.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe that the source for the kit is HKC, found at http://www.hkc-speed.com/index.php

Better control arm bushings - a good idea. That goes on the list.

 

I see that you also installed 25 mm sway bars front & rear. What brand did you select and why did you choose that over the other brands available? Did you add stronger bar mounts and end links?

 

Many people just add a rear sway bar. Does the front one make that much extra difference?

Yeah I looked at the stock front bar before it got pulled and it looks like 20mm maybe? I got a Tribeca front bar which is 25mm after the mechanic Shtboxer here recommended it for 2.5i. It fit perfect with plenty of room to spare. Shtboxer recommended Forrester endlinks that are designed for the rear stock bar and they also fit perfect - no issues.

The rear bar is 25mm by Perrin for only $89 but weighs a ton and barely cleared the exhaust. Definitely needed the AVO mounts for this massive bar.

The rear endlinks were a challenge...the dealer traded me a set of Whitelines for my Kartboys that didn't fit.

Also used front/rear heavy duty bushings with new u-clamps by Energy Suspension and Mobil 1 synthetic grease recommended by Subietonic in his install write-up.

IMNSHO - merely lowering down to Legacy height will cause some issues in geometry, screwing up the camber curve. Improves static camber, but go into a corner and you'll end up with less negative, maybe positive camber. I think.

If, OTOH, you remove the spacers that make the difference between a Legacy and Outback, it may be another matter. That's more work.

And last, do you really want junkyard shocks?

At this point in time, I'm not sure that anything could be much worse than the suspension that is on there right now ... however, I completely agree that there may be an issue with the dynamic camber. OTOH, I think that by lowering it only an inch or so, I'll probably be in good shape. What I'm a little more concerned about is the dynamic toe in the rear, which is already a known issue.

I'd _love_ to do the full Legacy suspension conversion, but that involves sourcing the rear lateral links and other parts that I'm not sure where to get. I talked briefly with the local junkyard and they said that they don't stock those. That, combined with not having a good, comprehensive list of parts, has left me a little concerned about doing the full conversion correctly.

While I'm not in love with the idea of junkyard shocks, it at least gives me a starting point for the suspension... if it's better than current and will align alright and not cause any dynamic stability issues, than I'll go with it. From that point, I have my choice of aftermarket shocks in the future... unlike the Outback, where I'm stuck with either Monroe or KYB.

... however, I completely agree that there may be an issue with the dynamic camber. OTOH, I think that by lowering it only an inch or so, I'll probably be in good shape. What I'm a little more concerned about is the dynamic toe in the rear, which is already a known issue.

A quote from the Outback manual...

"The rear suspension is a multilink type.

The suspension on each side consists of a rear arm, front link, upper link, rear link, sub frame support arm, shock absorber, and a coil spring.

The front link, rear link, and upper link are all attached to a sub frame which in turn is installed to the vehicle body through bushings.

This type of suspension is characterized by small changes in camber and toe-in against external input of vertical, longitudinal and lateral forces."

Also the specs indicate that the hide height is about 17.2" with a tolerance range of +0.47" to -0.94". So dropping an inch should still allow a proper alignment setting.

Just a side note on poly bushings...you'll need to re-grease them every few months, at least I need to to stop them from squeaking. I actually drilled/tapped and installed grease fittings to my swaybar mounts to inject grease without removing them.

Dale

Time and money... I've given up on finding a super deal on a BTS Kit. May be off subject, but I'm going to use a set of Koni Yellows (for a Legacy), and make my own kit to maintain the factory ride height.

Anyone interested to know how it turns out?

Summary:

For the front: an Outback strut housing, and a Koni Sport cartridge #8610-1447 (+ a little custom fab work to correct overall height), coilover sleeves, and springs.

For the rear: Koni Sport shock #8010-1053, plus spring (tbd), and spacer to correct overall height

I'm in to hear how it turns out.

Reviews and people I've talked to say that the Koni's are brutally harsh.

I've got an email in to HKC-Speed, I can't take it anymore. I'm finally taking the plunge and fixing this crappy suspension properly. I want to adjust my alignment at the same time so I stop wearing out the edges of my tires.

Let us know what they say.

My friend in Japan contacted Hirano for me and this is what he told me:

they said they cant deliver to USA.

Buyer has to arrange on their own if they wanna ship it to out side of Japan.

Insurrence is covered by the delivery service agent if its within Japan.

They can except Visa card, but there will be 5% charge for it.

The price you saw on the web is for cash only.

They also suggested if you are sending abroad, you should covered the

product in plastic case or someother ways to protect the product.