Stability Control

Well, just joined and my first post.

 

I'm getting rid of my audi due to LOTS of problems and unbelievable expense at fixing them.

 

My question revolves around stability control. I live in Pennsylvania off of some windy roads. We get snow and ice during the winter. I'm use to AWD cars with stability control.

 

It appears that the Legacy doesn't have it -- do any of you live in snowy areas and have any comments on stabilty control and the legacy? Is it an issue?

Take my opinion for what it's worth, the legacy is the first AWD car i've owned, and my fiancee's Mazda6 is the only car i've owned with any kind of 'electronic nanny' like traction control or stability control.

 

Traction and Stability control are nice, and can help keep the car from being pushed beyonds it limit, however they can't brake the laws of physics or anything else. Especially in the snow.

 

Traction control is great for getting out of muddy driveways or snowy parking lots. However the AWD legacy never has a problem with that. In the snow the tail end of the legacy is a bit easy to slide out, however thats easily avoidable by not flooring the gas around turns.

 

And especially in the snow, traction and stability control can only do so much. THey can't just create additional traction. SO if you've lost control of your car, thier is nothing it can do about that. If you're doing 80mph on a highway and come up on an ICE slick, no amount of stability control is going to give you control.

 

 

Just drive smart, don't push the tires beyond what they're capable of, and you won't have any problems.

 

SO, i wouldnt worry about it, the AWD system in the legacy is great and give you ample amounts of control over the car. Just don't be stupid in the snow.

Plus, it's full time AWD, and some snow tires would do it that much more justice. Dedicated snow tires really help TONS. Though, here in NY, I have hardly ever needed them. Last winter was brutal...in terms of snowfall...and I hadn't any issues. But, I am sure with snows, it's just as good as having traction control. God luck, and welcome to the board.

subarus do not have electronic stability controls. The mechanical AWD systems are pure to it's motorsports form, which already gives the driver the freedom of doing whatever they want with the controls and have fun. That's what makes a Subaru a blast to drive.

 

If you are worried about spinning out and such, you might want to consider some time behind the driver seat. Stability control just regains as much of the grip as possible and minimizes the car from a spin out.. what most drivers try to do (instinctively) is to steer away from hitting things, the stability controls prevents your car from turning too much, sometimes resulting to not turning enough to avoid something.

 

When it comes down to it, stability control is usually electronic and it can hinder your driving.

 

The question to focus on here is: "do you need it?"

I am really not a fan of all these new stability control devices. Yes they may help in some situations but, you should not be driving in a way that these systems would kick in anyway. I think these things make people over confident in their cars, they think they can talk on their cell phones and go the same speed they normally do in a damn blizzard. Like others have said, you can not defy the laws of physics, no electronic car nany can save you if you drive like an idiot. Unfortunately most people drive like idiots. It is amazing that each year the first snowfall we have here all the news talks about is how many accidents there were. People act like they don't know what snow does to roads even though they have gone through years and years of winter weather. Last year I did just fine a Mustang GT, probably one of the worst winter vehicles, it was not fun even with snow tires but it was doable. Reason- I did not drive beyond the means of the tires and the road. Moral, don't drive like an idiot and you will never need stability control; end rant.

I havent actually driven my Subie in the snow yet as I just got it about a month and a half ago, but... From what I see, there are a LOT of Subies up in Montana, Washington, and Idaho (from what I have seen). And to put it quite frankly, I have never seen one of them in the ditch, spun out, or anything of that sort. But as everyone else has stated, dont think you can hit a 90 degree turn going 40mph on black ice and expect ANY car to hold. But, from what I have seen, the sheer # of Subies in the north where it snows like crazy, and the lack of seeing them stuck would suggest that they do well. So, I wouldnt be too worried about loosing any type of handling by going from the Audi to the Subie. But no expert on the subject either.

Congrats on the car... They are AWESOME

Doesn't one or more of the Outbacks have Stab Control? I thought someone posted that as a fact. I remember the H-6 models having it.

 

Anyone?

yea... the "VDC outback" ... vehicle dynamics control

Outback VDC has it. You don't need it with AWD. Like the brochure for my WRX said: "All Wheel Drive: what traction control wants to be when it grows up".

Subaru does offer stability control, the Outback with VDC.

 

The arguement that stability control systems and how it can hinder you driving is not completely true. I can go into extreme detail on how the system works, but it would be much too long to go into. But basically stability control systems allow you to drive to the limit of the traction, but not beyond it. So in the previous example of how it won't let you turn too much, it knows how much you can turn at x speed. It knows that if you keep turning the wheel more at that speed, the car can't turn any faster and you go into understeer, basically you are trying to defy physics and it'll try it's best to prevent you from doing it. There are situations where exceeding the traction of the tires can be beneficial, but you are departing from control situation, which you have to option to turn off the stability control. Example of this is pulling the e-brake to spin the car around a tight turn. A stability control system won't let you do this and will probably give you an warning light because the system couldn't do it's job.

 

If you were to allow stability control systems to used in motosports, you will end up with very consistant and fast lap times. The only thing the driver can do is go slower by missing the brake marker or missing the turn in. The ABS will allow for maximum deceleration, traction control allows for maximum acceleration, and stability control allows for maximum cornering. If used in racing, it would make for a very boring race except when the driver screws up which would be very difficult to do. This is also why they are banned in racing.

You'll be fine without stability/traction control. I drove my STi two years ago through a northwest PA (Erie) winter; September - March. And that was my first time ever driving (full-time) in snow/ice. Adjust your driving style to different snow/ice conditions, and you'll be fine. AWD = fun in snow.

 

And I've had an Audi with ESP (2001 Audi S4), but it was rarely activated while I was in Los Angeles.

 

-Mike-

I have not driven my Legacy in the snow, since I have not even had a month of ownership.

 

My last vehicle, a VW R32, had alot more electronic nannies: ASR (traction control), ESP (stability control), Haldex (electronically engaged 4wd). I also own a '99 Audi A6 Avant - no stability control.

 

Here's what I've noticed after one hellacious Boston winter last year:

 

1) in 99% of snow driving conditions (we're talking about on road here) on the street, I never saw ESP get activated

2) Audi has all seasons (new) - the VW had a dedicated snow and summer set. Tires make more difference than ESP

3) Even with the inferior tires, I only quarter the Audi once driving normally - and it was during heavy snowfall and I saw other cars totally stuck in the same spot just a few minutes later

4) To get ESP to activate (light blinks on dash), had to drive the R32 aggressively enough to scare other drivers in the snow

5) I hate ESP when it isn't snowing - it reigns in the action too much. In spring, I basically would get in the R32, fire up the ignition, and then turn off the ESP.

6) I was in a very high speed driving situation (I wasn't driving) in an acquaintance's supercharged R32 doing 200kph+ and he had the ESP off. The car slid. If ESP had been on, he would at the very least be needing some new body work, and I could have gotten pretty hurt.

7) In other driving situations, I've been scared to find out ESP is on - you basically pray the car will go where you are pointed, but you really lose a great deal of control.

8) Ever try to do snow donuts with ESP? You can't. Believe me - I've tried.

 

All in all, I think ESP is overrated for performance driving - if I wanted to get ESP so badly, I would have bought an Outback VDC....

 

Albert

I drove my WRX through last winter and I had a blast drifting it through snow in big parking lots. I wanted to test the AWD by trying to toss the car out of control on staight road and it would correct itself everytime, it was an amazing feeling of control on something slippery as snow. I am a firm believer of an educated driver, rather then some stupid stability control, becasuse like others have said, people just don't know how to drive their cars and fail to realize the physics behind any car. If you know how to drive your car then you should have no problems. I am sure the the LGT doesn't need stabiltiy control becasue the AWD and knowledge of basic driving principles should suffice. In case you wondering I should know, I drove through some of the worst storms here in NY in 8 years, at times in cars without even the basic ABS system, without one fender bender, so there .