version 8 STi swap

So, car took a crap and mechanic suggested I just swap out the entire engine(cheaper!).

 

Anyways, looks like I may be going 2l after all(only reason is because I originally was interested in using the turbo and heads from that motor anyways) The EJ255 shortblock will get rebuilt in the mean time and swapped back in later on.

 

When swapping in a EJ20(7) from a version-8 STi, does it basically drop-in? As in, no wiring needed and I can use the JDM ECU or remapped stock-ECU? IIRC, the only thing different I saw was that the JDM engines do not have TGV...but the JDM ECU would plug up with no problems?

IMO your going to spend more money going that way, then buying a new EJ257 short block for $1700. having your heads freshened up and put the car back together.

 

Plug and Play.

That's true if I were doing the work myself(which I don't have time to); but having the shop do it ran to about $4200(assuming $1750 for the SB, though most of the places had them for about $1900-$2000 shipped). The swap is running me $3400 for a engine I pick, and $700 for the labor($4100); and he'll basically have it back to me in about a day after he gets the engine. Both of these are better than the quote I got for a complete rebuild with original SB($7100!!!)

 

What really moved me towards the swap was I wanted those heads and turbo to begin with; which would have ran me another ~$2500 on top of the rebuild.

 

Thank you very much Max Capacity!

You're wasting your time for a 2.0L, regardless of JDM-ness. Get an oem ej257 and slap all your shit on it- done

For the mileage on those JDM motors, that's kind of hard to beat. The engines my mechanic were able to find for me cost the same or more with much more miles(I had similar results).

 

Also, it will NOT stay a 2l. The EJ25 block will be rebuilt(with aftermarket components); but that probably won't be finished until next year or something.

you would need a jdm ecu and harness since the ej207 is dual avcs.

They're single AVCS. I believe the only EJ207 with Dual AVCS was the B4.

Hmm, the jdm swap I did in BDII's wrx was dual, maybe his was a ver 7, and we needed to install the jdm ecu and such.

and a tune for your octane

 

my friend got a complete jdm engine for $1.2k installed it, ran it hard for a while:rolleyes: then spun a bearing

 

He said it was another $1.5k for a tune w/ stand alone

I guess you have not seen this from one of the vendors at the top of this forum.

25% off

http://www.heubergermotors.com/parts/index.htm

 

 

bmx045 and I are just saying you can get the ej257 for under 2 grand, have your heads done, and the same guy should be able to do the install with gasket for almost the same as your paying 4100 or a little more.

 

Do you need a clutch with the new set up, or is your car a automatic ?

 

There are a few small nickel and dime things that add to the cost.

 

 

My machine shop buddy has told me if I want to stay below 400hp stay with a oem short block, he can't rebuild my 152,000 mile block for that money. And I don't want to mess with assembling the block to save a few bucks. I did that stuff when I was much younger.

 

It sounds like your car is currently NA ?

I have seen that; I have a spreadsheet on dealer(and retailer) prices for the STi shortblock(if the shipping was correct; Perry Subaru has them beat with $1759 shipped vs. $1810 from Heuberger; and not including shipping, Concordville has them for $1645 also).

 

My car is a 5spd, and turbo. Clutch was already replaced a couple months ago by the previous owner.

 

The biggest issue, at least personally for me, with going with a new shortblock I would need to replace a majority of "wear" components(oil pump, gasket set, etc.) and that just basically adds up(parts+labor; which wasn't included in that quote above). With the JDM motor, we're probably just going to replace the belts and drop it in.

 

I believe the EJ207(non-B4) didn't get dual AVCS until version 10? Anyways, my biggest concern right now is what to do about drive-by-wire. The motor is supposedly drive-by-cable so I might need to reuse the OE intake manifold or switch to an USDM STi one.

That's what is was talking about with the nickel and dime stuff.

 

I think you would want to talk to one of the Tuners here. Check out that forum. They should have the answers you seek.

 

Good Luck. I just hope you don't end up having to buy or put up with some things that don't work with your car and new ECU.

 

hopefully one of the shop guy's like AZPinstalls might have some info or one of the other guy's on here.

I say get a 207 motor, way more reliable than the USDM blocks, power towards to top end revs higher takes ton of boost without building since its semi closed deck. Been in two different cars a GC8 and Bugeye with the V7 motor in it... unbeatable. well worth the extra time.

Just thought I'd update you guys with my findings(which took a LOT of digging so I hope you guys appreciate the info). I decided to go with a V9 STi engine due to age and mileage(I believe the one I got is from a late-2006 model).

 

-The Legacy is drive-by-wire so I had to get an intake manifold that would work(I went with 04-06 STi manifold and TGVs to retain the stock injectors). I also have to run a remapped stock ECU(v9 has immobilizer; v7,8 and 9 do not support DBW).

 

-The USDM AVCS and DBW equipped cars with the 32-bit ECU that use hall-effect intake cam sensors; the JDMs use VR sensors all around. The JDM cams use "raised" timing marks(notches above the surface of the cam), and the USDM uses grooves. Supposedly they're timed differently but I can't verify as of now(though, I'm assuming it just has to do with the trigger teeth setup; as the USDM edge is rising, the JDM edge is falling, and vice verse).

 

The solution to this is use any "USDM" cams(even aftermarket) and the original hall sensors. The RH side swaps over fine, but the LH side has the sensor too far forward. Two proven ways around this is either open up the bore to allow the sensor to point towards the grooves(Motion Lab), or have the grooves extended ~3mm to reach under the sensor(Dylan @ DS1). What I will try to do instead of the two above is use an aftermarket 12mm diameter hall effect sensor(basically the same as the 034 Motorsport sensor) and have it offset in the bore; I didn't get the measurements of the stock sensor width, but 12mm was the smallest I could find and I'm hoping it'll work.

Iv done a Ver 8 swap on a car and let me tell you, you have a lottt more research and pain ahead of you than you think.... You have to worry about emissions issues such as the JDM ecu not passing, using a WRX ecu to pass it, the years dont match up because its an 05 legacy with an older 02-04ish motor in it, 2.0 differences, there is a lot dude...

 

I know conceptually it sounds cool to have a version 8 swapped legacy but stay usdm take it from me. The quickest way to get the car back on the road is to not **** with the wiring, manifolds, emissions, ripping the whole thing apart instead of just the engine and just get a 255 or 257 and get on with it.

I'm not using the JDM ECU. The car will need to be tuned so they can most likely take care of any tail-pipe emissions issue.

 

The original thread says V8 but I've gone with a V9 instead; but even then where I live the year is not an issue.

Interesting well with a usdm wrx ecu which is the only one you can use besides an expensive utec or other brand you sacrifice 8k redline, avcs and other properties so what's the point? An sti ecu will not work and even still if you have obd2 emissions in your state it will read as a usdm 04 05 wrx ecu and not a legacy which they will question. When they see its not an 05 or newer motor you may have emissions issues.

 

I went through all this and took measures to prevent it so I know trust me haha

Motion Lab Tuning and Dylan at DS1 has done this too. I initially found out about this by speaking with Motion Lab about it and they told me they had already done it before(they have a small thread about it on NASIOC).

 

Why would you say the 04-05 WRX ECU is the only one that will work? The stock Legacy ECU can already be tuned and supports all the necessary equipment(AVCS) already. I know this first hand since I bought a VAG-COM cable and was able to check it out myself. Not only that, but weren't those WRXs DBC? The +05 LGT and +04 STi were DBW; hence why I have to run one of those 32-bit ECUs.

 

As stated before it's a v9 engine('05-06); not a v8. And, it wouldn't matter because our state does not check the engines; they just look for emissions equipment and do the OBDII test and tailpipe tests.

Any updates on this swap? if so what did you do to make it work?

im in the process of doing same swap.

Hey, sorry for the long delay. The motor has already been swapped but I haven't got it running; though it's basically there(long story short; the mechanic didn't finish the job and I don't have much time to work on it). One thing that was overlooked was the crossover tube, etc. had to be swapped over and such(mainly due to the lack of TGV on the JDM engine), in addition to that I had to swap over the LGT PS pump and A/C compressor. I think using all "top" parts, turbo inlet, and misc hoses from a DBW STi would have made everything much much easier.

 

The BIGGEST concern was the sensors; but what I did was build a converter box using the JBperf dual VR board: http://jbperf.com/dual_VR/v2_0.html and purchased connectors for both end that essentially made it "plug and play"; no splicing or tearing up the stock harness. PM me if you need to know which wires go where on the connectors; I already done the research so you don't have to.

 

I hope to have it started up by the weekend after next(yes, that's how busy I've been. I worked on it two or three times, about 1-2hr, ever since I got it back from the mechanic).

Your swap sounds more labor intensive. Anyways I got mg 207 in and runs like a champ. Keep up thee good work and dont let those tell u can't do it. I had a higher up tuner tell me it was impossible even after it was running. Needless to say that person wont and never was gonna tune me ;-)

Nice!!! I'm glad it was easier for you. Did you just reuse the Forester top-end pieces?

 

Also, did you have to do anything with the cam sensors?

Is there something I don't understand here. Why can't you simply buy a v7 motor lets say and just swap over the intake manifold and get a FMIC to run the vf30? Obviously just get a tune for the LGT ecu and that should be it correct?

VR sensors vs. Hall sensors(-7v-7v sine wave vs. 0-5v square wave).

 

Also, the coolant part on the engine block has to be swapped over too along with the connectors for AVCS(different shape).

can i swap the cam sensors and all over?