Steering/braking anomaly coming into a corner

The other day I was coming into a corner at around 70 in my LGT and when I got on the brakes (fairly hard) I was unable to turn the steering wheel. Once I let off the brakes I could easily steer again. The car has Ion springs with stock struts and a stock front sway/Cusco rear sway. It's riding on 245/35/18 F1s on 18x8 wheels. I'm not sure if any other information is relevant.

Does anyone know why this could have happened and how I can fix it? The car does seem to track cracks and dips in the road, if that helps.

No idea... but funny things happen when at the limit.

Not really supposed to brake hard while steering anyway it destabilizes the car and is the quickest way to loose control unless you are REALLY good at trail braking.

The other day I was coming into a corner at around 70 in my LGT and when I got on the brakes (fairly hard) I was unable to turn the steering wheel. Once I let off the brakes I could easily steer again. The car has Ion springs with stock struts and a stock front sway/Cusco rear sway. It's riding on 245/35/18 F1s on 18x8 wheels. I'm not sure if any other information is relevant.

 

Does anyone know why this could have happened and how I can fix it? The car does seem to track cracks and dips in the road, if that helps.

I believe the serpentine belt powers the power steering pump, correct? If it's slipping, that might cause the steering wheel to stop turning as the pump stops working. You'll need massive force to turn the wheel without the pump's assistance. My belt now needs replacement and at parking speeds this is happening to me now.

there's a simple solution so this never happens again...

Stop driving like idiot on the street!!!

The other day I was coming into a corner at around 70 in my LGT and when I got on the brakes (fairly hard) I was unable to turn the steering wheel. Once I let off the brakes I could easily steer again. The car has Ion springs with stock struts and a stock front sway/Cusco rear sway. It's riding on 245/35/18 F1s on 18x8 wheels. I'm not sure if any other information is relevant.

 

Does anyone know why this could have happened and how I can fix it? The car does seem to track cracks and dips in the road, if that helps.

I know what the problem is! You should not be using your hands to brake, you should be using them to steer....

there's a simple solution so this never happens again...

 

 

 

Stop driving like idiot on the street!!!

Ahhh, get a life....

He's not driving like an idiot, he's exploring his street performance envelope.....

I know what the problem is! You should not be using your hands to brake, you should be using them to steer....

I bet I could see out the windshield a lot better that way too!

Having to hit the brakes hard enough to have steering issues when coming down from 70 to take a turn is not "65-70 in a 55"

I know the driver; he's not an idiot. My guess is that the either the PS pump was momentarily "overwhelmed" (which I had happen a few times over 60k miles) or there were some serious ruts in the road. It also may have to do with the revised front end steering geometry due to the lowering that the ION springs give to the front end.

To call Unique TIII an idiot for a mechanical anomoly is to also call me an idiot. While I support your ability to speak your mind, I don't think you want to be labeling people in such a cavalier manner.

Now, let's get back to the main issue: Autocrossing in School Zones!!

you can say waht ever you want... but there is NO WAY you can defend the fact that he was driving like an idiot.

I don't care if micheal schumacher took that turn at 70.... he'd by driving like an idiot too..... and HE'D know it

you can say waht ever you want... but there is NO WAY you can defend the fact that he was driving like an idiot.

 

 

I don't care if micheal schumacher took that turn at 70.... he'd by driving like an idiot too..... and HE'D know it

OK, time to come down.....

Let's get back to the main discussion: Speeding through Hospital Zones...

I didn't take the turn at 70. Brakes slow cars down.

Speaking of race driving, though...there's a hairpin turn at the track where I autocross that you come into at about 60 and this had never happened to me there in the WRX (under much heavier braking with much harder steering...weird). I guess it really is a mystery.

I get that. This just didn't feel normal.

I did slow down before the corner. As I started to turn that's when I was letting off of the brakes and the steering wheel started to react once the brakes were released.

I guess I'll just get the alignment and steering components checked again and go from there.

simple physics... u reached the threshold of friction. you only had enough friction to brake (friction brakes to wheels) or steer (friction wheels to road). think of it as driving in the snow if you hit ur brakes u cant steer but if you dont hit ur brakes you can steer.

hope this helps

Believe it or not that is normal.

Its due to weight transfer during braking, which increases the load on the front wheels, and suspension geometry.

For one, the the struts are not plumb. They are tilted in order to allow the wheels to easily return to center. The suspension geometry also causes wheels to tilt to keep the contact patch flat against the ground. Basically it tilts the top of the wheels out when the suspension is collapsed and in when fully extended. The bottom of the wheels will move in the opposite directions (in when collapsed, out when extended).

All this to keep the vehicle stable during hard braking, which is in direct opposition to you trying to turn and potentially destabilizing it.

If you increase load on the wheels, the power steering has to work harder in order to overcome the forces generated by the suspension geometry which want to keep the wheels from turning. Also, our Subies are equipped with variable assist power steering which by nature generates less power at high speeds. VAPS takes some time to ramp up when you slow down.

When you stood on the brakes and attempted to turn, the power steering system simply could not generate enough power to over come this. When you let off the brakes, the loading of the front tires was reduced, which in turn reduced the forces the power steering had to fight.

If you were in a car that had no power steering and did that, you would have been turned into roadkill, unless you had arms the size of redwood trees.

Believe it or not that is normal.

 

Its due to weight transfer during braking, which increases the load on the front wheels, and suspension geometry.

 

For one, the the struts are not plumb. They are tilted in order to allow the wheels to easily return to center. The suspension geometry also causes wheels to tilt to keep the contact patch flat against the ground. Basically it tilts the top of the wheels out when the suspension is collapsed and in when fully extended. The bottom of the wheels will move in the opposite directions (in when collapsed, out when extended).

 

All this to keep the vehicle stable during hard braking, which is in direct opposition to you trying to turn and potentially destabilizing it.

 

If you increase load on the wheels, the power steering has to work harder in order to overcome the forces generated by the suspension geometry which want to keep the wheels from turning. Also, our Subies are equipped with variable assist power steering which by nature generates less power at high speeds. VAPS takes some time to ramp up when you slow down.

 

When you stood on the brakes and attempted to turn, the power steering system simply could not generate enough power to over come this. When you let off the brakes, the loading of the front tires was reduced, which in turn reduced the forces the power steering had to fight.

 

If you were in a car that had no power steering and did that, you would have been turned into roadkill, unless you had arms the size of redwood trees.

Good Answer! Good Answer! (Family Feud supportive chant...)

Seriously, makes sense...