Replacing turbo - what else should I do NOW?

Following my other thread where my turbo crapped out, I have now gotten everything pretty much apart. There are a few other things I'd like to throw out here for discussion and advice.

There are 5 or 6 what I think might have been rubber hoses that cracked apart. More dealer stuff I have to wait on while the downpipe and upgraded oil supply arrive. Basically anything that does not feel right I am going to replace now. Is that enough or should I try to get every hose? Whats the conventional wisdom?

I also notice some oil on top of the head on the passenger side that I am guessing is from the valve covers. I am going to go ahead and replace the VC gaskets while we're in there. Wise?

The passenger side oil banjo bolt is easy to get to so will remove that filter, but the driver's side will not clear without removing the entire front cover. Do ya'll think that is a need for that side or will it be OK just doing the one side?

One of the new parts is an AVO intake elbow. it comes with fittings, but there is no opening for the PCV that was on the old one. What do I do about that? I also need some T-Fittings that did not come with it and a single T-fitting that did not come with the new turbo (turbo to waste gate). What is a good source for those? Not sure of the sizes, but I can figure that out easy enough.

I have the turbo, inlet, down pipe, up pipe, oil supply, gaskets, coolant hose, oil outlet, etc. So what other "other stuff" is a good idea to do now while it's all apart? For instance would it be a lot easier to do gauges now or is it not a big deal with it all back together?

I appreciate all discussion and advice.

You can remove the front banjo bolt by cutting the raised portion off and then use a 17mm wrench to remove it.

You should also zip tie all the vacuum hoses.

The short hose to the T on the compressor housing has the boost pill in it. make sure that goes on the compressor side of the T.

I used a OEM intake hose so I wouldn't have any problems.What's wrong with yours ?

I also bolted the turbo on the catless up pipe.

You do have a catless up pipe, right ?

Oil leak up top is not normal, look closer at the top of that head.

Max, just to make sure I am understanding:

Not quite clear on the banjo bolt... cut the raised portion.. of what?

Zip tie all vacuum lines instead of the metal clamps?

The short hose to the T on the compressor housing has the boost pill in it. make sure that goes on the compressor side of the T.

I used a OEM intake hose so I wouldn't have any problems.What's wrong with yours ?

It has different fittings, including nothing for the PCV. I will just hang that up out of the way somewhere probably.

You do have a catless up pipe, right ?

I do

I'll have look closer at the top of that head, thanks

Mr. Bean, already got my OCVs and they are being replaced. That T replacement... you're referring to the one at the turbo/wastegate?

Since the exhaust portion of the turbo was the real mess I am guessing most of the crud went out the exhaust. I still want to remove the oil pan to clean out any potential metal. Do you think this is necessary? What about replacing the oil cooler?

Thanks fellahs... as usual, much help and very much appreciated.

That T replacement... you're referring to the one at the turbo/wastegate?

My replacement tee is for the one located at the back of the intake manifold. AFAIK the one at the turbo isn't a common problem. If you're worried about that one you might as well do a 3 port EBCS and eliminate it.

Here's a great diagram, you can see the blue tee near the center:

http://legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=4643684&postcount=15

Thanks BMB

Max, just to make sure I am understanding:

 

Not quite clear on the banjo bolt... cut the raised portion.. of what?

HAMMER DOWN came up with the technique Max Capacity's referring to, to remove the more difficult to access banjo bolt:

http://legacygt.com/forums/showpost.php?p=1326330&postcount=158

I understand the AVO intake is missing a port, What wrong with your OEM intake tube that you are not re-using it ?

We tell every one to zip tie all the small vacuum hoses, boost will blow them off the fitting.

Not sure small fuel line clamps will go small enough.

OK, lots of new stuff, let me address each of you:

Turkeylord: I am not aware that the blue T in that drawing is any issue for me. The one That goes between the turbo compressor and waste gate IS because the tubes on the new hardware are larger than stock, the the existing lines are too small. I don't know how the pill will act in a new/larger line but the stock lines are too small. I am going with an aftermarket BCS but not until I get to the Tuner, so it has to run 1st. I will check tomorrow morning on the T you pointed out and contact you if I need it.

BarManBean - completely understood and I will undertake steps to ensure what is what. I don't want to assure that because the damage was on the exhaust side of the turbo that it all went out the exhaust. I am replacing the oil cooler and will drop the oil pan and check for metal. That in itself if a pain.

stm25rs - that you so much for that link! That makes it very clear. I will glad sacrifice a wrench to keep from having to take everything off the front of the engine.

Max - The OEM intake is cracked. Along with a bunch of other rubber tubes it simply got super hard and cracked. I understand on the zip ties now (and the DS banjo bolt!) and will do so religiously.

Thank you gentlemen again. This information helps a lot.

I'm considering offering 1/4" barb replacement EBCS fittings as well, so when the time comes that might interest you as well. I didn't like adding reducers to my lines - two more failure points.

If I were you, I'd probably add short sections of 1/4" vac line to the turbo, then reducers to the stock tee lines. Ugly and bulky, but it will get you to the tuner.

I am in the same boat as Markbo as far as I can tell. I'm at 92,000 miles btw.

I just got my banjo bolt out after removing the turbo yesterday. There's stuff in the banjo filter, but not a lot and I can't tell how long it's been there. I'd estimate that it was roughly 50% clogged.

My turbo was oil starved because I lost about 3 qts. in a short while.

I was driving on the highway in the rain and I heard a slight squeal for just a moment. Sounded like a belt. I stopped a little later and started the car again after an hour. The squeal came back a few minutes later and didn't go away. Then I got codes P0011 and P0021. And, burnt rubber smell.

I cleared the codes and checked the oil and there wasn't any on the dipstick. Got some oil nearby and added 3 qts... (Heavy-sigh, I'm usually so careful and never let it get low.)

Drove 35 miles home as carefully and smoothly as I could with the turbo squealing the entire way.

What I believe (and hope) from what I've seen so far is this:

Turbo was starved and the bearing surface wore. Exhaust pressure shifted the impeller forward to the point where it was rubbing against the housing on the exhaust side. Enough material has worn off the backside of the impeller that it looks very thin. Then it lost a few pieces at the edges and became unbalanced as well. I didn't have any rattling sounds the entire trip home. I don't have a lot of side-to-side movement or any fin damage that I can see. The intake side seems undamaged but maybe a bit oily. I'm hoping and thinking that the majority of material went out the exhaust.

I'm planning to replace the turbo with a bnrsupercars 16g. I need to figure out a filtered oil supply for it. I'm going to take the pan off, and change the oil cooler as well. I have always used Mobil1 5w30 on this car and I've changed it every 5K. (Now I'm reading that I'm letting it go too long. Don't pay attention for a few years and look what happens!)

I'm not a total noob fwiw. I was a mechanic back in the late 80's. I haven't worked on cars much at all (beyond maintenance and small repairs) for quite a few years though. I'm worried about the possibility of metal in all of the passages and orifices. I'm hoping that the pan doesn't look bad.

That's my story and I'm sticking to it...mostly.

Suggestions and ideas welcomed!

I ordered an oil supply kit from Jeff Fuller as recommended by BNR. I am not happy with it. For $200 I got what looks like some bent brake line tubing with fancy anodized connectors and a filter. I could have gotten a used BNR unit for 1/2 that if I had known he was not going to supply the braided line unit he advertised. I would not recommend you his. Search my name and see a couple of different threads. You don't HAVE to go with a/m uppipe and downpipe, but it's highly recommended and you might find a whole bunch of tubes/hoses have to be replaced.

FWIW if you don't exhaust the search feature before asking your own thread questions you will likely get flamed severely like I did. Some people here will complain about taking the time to answer a question but will take the time to type a 2 page diatribe against answering questions- not all, just some. I have said several times that some folks have been extremely helpful. I am grateful for all the knowledge and advice I have gotten here. But I use the search feature first.

Hi guys, I am just a title ahead of where you are in the process. My situation is different as I am upgrading to Stage 3 without turbo failure. I have a 2005 Legacy GT 5EAT wagon with 168K I am doing about all I can think to do both in upgrades and preventative maintenance possible because most of what is on top of the engine is so inaccessible it pays to do all you can. Check all of you Crankcase vent hoses and vacuum hoses and replace them all if questionable. As I got into mine I found my throttle body was about to go, so that got done. OCVs, coil packs plugs. I also installed a Cobb EBCS. If you install a larger turbo you'll have to change the fittings on the EBCS unit as the ports on the turbo are larger than stock as well. I'm installing a BNR 20g. I'm also installing a RacerX FMIC, which makes some things easy to get to and others impossible to get to unless you pull it apart...

With putting in the FMIC I needed to replace the condenser and radiator. After 9 years on the road there was some clogging and covering them with the inter- cooler I wanted it to run as cool as possible and was less than $200 to replace both.

Bottom line is I have loved driving my LGT and I'm looking forward to doing some auto crossing this year and I want to have as much reliability as possible. Nothing worse than going through what you are and then have the car nickle and dime you to death. I hope this helps, I anticipate getting my car running Monday!!!

Jerry

Okay, I've got my pan off...

It isn't pretty. I'm submitting a picture for opinions.

I'm planning on a new pan, new pickup, new oil cooler and gaskets, etc.

There is no way I'm going to install another turbo without some kind of filter for the supply. It's clearly needed in my case.

Oil flush:

I think an oil flush would be a good idea. Something that can get to all of the crevices everywhere and rinse out contaminants.

I'd like to run the engine without the turbo on some light high-detergent oil for a few warm up cycles. There's still no guarantee that I'd get everything, but it could get the majority of contaminants out maybe.

The problem is, I wouldn't want to run that kind of oil through the turbo. I'd have to feed the turbo supply back into the engine somehow. (That might be easy.) I'd still probably need something on the uppipe for backpressure.

Are there other suggestions for flushing the oil system on these engines?

Update: The tech in my shop was giving me grief about not wanting to drop the oil pan or change the oil cooler, etc, etc so I just towed it over to a local Ricer shop. It was recommended by a couple of the local Subaru guys I have been in contact with.

They obviously know their stuff and I am confident in them. Anyway, dropped the pan and it has some golden color to it. Bronze bearing dust from the turbo according to shop manager. His recommendation is to continue with the repairs/build and just do several short duration oil changes once it's all back together.

IF (and I am hoping & praying it's not when) the engine fails, I would be looking at a new short block, head rework and probably another turbo. Frankly I can't afford another $4 grand and the car isn't worth that much so everyone say a little prayer for me.

Now, I am replacing the oil cooler, banjo bolt filters are gone, new IPT oil supply, etc, etc with the other non oil related parts and the BNR 16G turbo. A tune will be done very quickly - after the oil changes are done so they can actually run it. One question I have I hope someone can help me with concerns an oil flush. I keep seeing that recommended here but I don't know ANYone that does oil flushes. Only tranny and coolant flushes. Who can I contact to see about an oil flush to do that extra little bit to ensure everything is out of the oil system?

Or will just changing the oil 100 miles 2 or 3 times get most of it out. I know I can't get it all out that way - or even if a flush can do that, but I'd like to do what I can to try.