Nadal4Hand Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Just a Stage 1 tune: Stock: HP - 263 TQ - 259 Stage 1 (OTS): HP - 264 TQ - 295 Stage 1 (Custom tune): HP - 265 TQ - 326 +2 hp over stock +67 tq over stock ^_^ http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/8136/20120221141633682.jpg I am VERY happy with the results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CL21376 Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 Nice pickup over the OTS maps. Enjoy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Drift Motion Posted February 21, 2012 Share Posted February 21, 2012 holy crap that's a lot of torque... but are those numbers WHP? kind of weird to see stock being 263 hp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOneDoubleN Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Those are obviously numbers at the crank Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DHracer Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Great numbers, huge torque! But like every dyno I see there is no gain at all over stock all the way up top, whats the reason? Is it because boost tapers to stock levels? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eckseleven Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Those are obviously numbers at the crank So do they have some kind of formula to come up with an estimated crank HP? I'd honestly rather see WHP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minuccims Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 holy crap that's a lot of torque... but are those numbers WHP? kind of weird to see stock being 263 hp Nope, those seem like wHP and wTQ. The scaling is always difficult to use as a comparison. Some of the engines are stronger than others. Stage II does seem to normalize the engine performance. http://www.efilogics.com/dyno/graph.php?gb=0&hp=1&torque=1&rpm=1&sl=1&sln=1&runid1=1121&rgb1=000000255&runid2=1122&rgb2=204000000&runid3=964&rgb3=000153000&runid4=965&rgb4=153000255 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eckseleven Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Nope, those seem like wHP and wTQ. The scaling is always difficult to use as a comparison. Some of the engines are stronger than others. Stage II does seem to normalize the engine performance. Are you talking just about the stage 1 OTS and custom stage 1 numbers? Because I can't believe a stock car with roughly 265 crank HP makes 263 at the wheels with an optimistic 15% AWD drivetrain loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGT For ME Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 holy torque is right.... just a stg 1 tune and nothing else? You migh have a hidden spec b as we all know those are blessed... looks great, and a big improvement over 4th gen cars. I'm trying to get close to those #s stg 2e Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOneDoubleN Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 EDO performance says 18% drivetrain loss is probably near accurate for our cars. Either the actual results of the dyno numbers have basically been divided by 0.82 to convert the whp #'s to crank hp, or the dyno correction is waaaaaaay off. Either way, we always come back to the point that if you're doing all your runs on the same dyno, who cares what the number is, it's the change interval that matters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minuccims Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Are you talking just about the stage 1 OTS and custom stage 1 numbers? Because I can't believe a stock car with roughly 265 crank HP makes 263 at the wheels with an optimistic 15% AWD drivetrain loss. Look at my post below. EFI Logics heart beaker Mustang dyno. Stock wHP is 258HP. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CL21376 Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Maybe these are a little under rated stock? Those numbers seem on par with other posted stage 1 dynos. Edit: Was that on 91 octane? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadal4Hand Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 EDO performance says 18% drivetrain loss is probably near accurate for our cars. Either the actual results of the dyno numbers have basically been divided by 0.82 to convert the whp #'s to crank hp, or the dyno correction is waaaaaaay off. Either way, we always come back to the point that if you're doing all your runs on the same dyno, who cares what the number is, it's the change interval that matters. I believe these numbers are to the wheels. Edit: Was that on 91 octane? Yep, 91 octane and car is stock. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eckseleven Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 Alright, maybe the source of my confusion is what people mean by wheel hp. If these numbers are estimated crank HP but it is read from the wheels, I guess I can see how people would interpret that as WHP. I just know that in my past car community, WHP meant actual power at the wheels and it was dead-on accurate when you took manufacturer crank HP and factored in drivetrain loss. 8G 6MT Accords consistently dynoing at 240-245 at the wheels. Honda states 270 at the crank. Makes perfect sense with 10-12% FWD loss. With these 5G LGTs, the numbers rarely makes sense. The ones with 220 at the wheels I can believe. Maybe the ones that reach 230 if the car is unusually strong. But I have doubts about anything beyond that. Even if they are a bit off from what Subaru claims, it would have to be a hell of an underrating to make up the difference. In the end, yes, using the same dyno is key since that will show gains between modifications. It just would be nice to know if these are actual at the wheel measurements or just an estimation at the crank. In my opinion, crank hp (or an estimation of it) is almost useless since the power at the road is really what is moving you. Sorry to derail this thread. Just trying to make some sense of it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eckseleven Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I believe these numbers are to the crank. Not sure how they calculated it out but I agree with you that it doesn't really matter cause I will take my car back here for future tunes. Thanks, that makes more sense then. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tytek Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 I believe these numbers are to the crank. Not sure how they calculated it out but I agree with you that it doesn't really matter cause I will take my car back here for future tunes. Yep, 91 octane. These are very nice TQ gains over stock and OTS. How many pulls on the dyno? Any road tuning after the dyno? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
acumenhokie Posted February 22, 2012 Share Posted February 22, 2012 But like every dyno I see there is no gain at all over stock all the way up top, whats the reason? I Small turbo runs out of puff up top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadal4Hand Posted February 22, 2012 Author Share Posted February 22, 2012 These are very nice TQ gains over stock and OTS. How many pulls on the dyno? Any road tuning after the dyno? Wasn't present when they were doing the pulls so can't say how many pulls. No road tuning but my "butt" dyno on the way home felt good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nadal4Hand Posted February 28, 2012 Author Share Posted February 28, 2012 So I emailed Ronnie from Cobb SoCal regarding the dyno output and this is what he wrote: "Our dyno, actually all dynos read by wheel horsepower. It's hard to get crank numbers unless you pull the motor out and run it on an engine dyno. Otherwise everyone just can have some kind of estimate." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 Just a Stage 1 tune: Stock: HP - 263 TQ - 259 Stage 1 (OTS): HP - 264 TQ - 295 Stage 1 (Custom tune): HP - 265 TQ - 326 http://img715.imageshack.us/img715/8136/20120221141633682.jpg I am VERY happy with the results. I'm happy for your gains, but a stock 2011 Subaru LGT is rated for 265 HP, 258 TQ. I find it hard to believe that Subaru would be underrating the engine by 15-20% from factory stock because that's what would be needed to generate those stock numbers that you got after drivetrain loss. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gire Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 ^^^^ Why so hard to believe? There's a print out right there! They may be under-rating it quite obviously because they want the crown jewel STi to have the highest published numbers. Car makers do this all the time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted February 28, 2012 Share Posted February 28, 2012 http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/2011-legacy-gt-stage-1-calibration-efi-logics-161341.html EFI has maintained that there are huge gains to be made with a catback on both the 2010 and 2011, and that with a tune with just a catback, even more gains. Do you have a catback? Also: The HP on the 2011 is crazy. I looked at the numbers from the 2010 that EFI replaced the turbo on and the bone stock 2010 was 214whp/214wtq. The 2011 with just a SPT catback is 245whp/232wtq? This is awesome. What is going to happen with a downpipe? How about an intake? Both? I am getting Goosebumps. Someone does mention that there seems to be some wide variation in the 2010 even running bone stock though... as much as a 20-30WHP difference, so maybe that's all there is to it. Wish I had a 2010/2011 now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOneDoubleN Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 So I emailed Ronnie from Cobb SoCal regarding the dyno output and this is what he wrote: "Our dyno, actually all dynos read by wheel horsepower. It's hard to get crank numbers unless you pull the motor out and run it on an engine dyno. Otherwise everyone just can have some kind of estimate." Sounds like their dyno is a little off then , sorry, but I don't attribute those numbers to wild power fluctuations from engine to engine that are more commonly seen in something like a Nissan GTR, and I certainly don't think you have 0% drivetrain loss. Those numbers are great for a relative comparison for your gains, but they're horribly inaccurate whp numbers. There's just no way, sorry, I wouldn't go around telling people that's what you're putting down to the wheels. Did he give you some kind of explanation for the fact that those numbers show an impossible 0% drivetrain loss? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOneDoubleN Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 And isn't this the same Cobb map that claims 10% increase in hp and 30% increase in torque? I don't see anything close to a 10% hp gain.....if their dyno(s) are indeed accurate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOneDoubleN Posted February 29, 2012 Share Posted February 29, 2012 ^^^^ Why so hard to believe? There's a print out right there! They may be under-rating it quite obviously because they want the crown jewel STi to have the highest published numbers. Car makers do this all the time. I've driven the LGT and STI back to back, many, many times. They aren't under-rating the LGT compared to the STI, especially stock vs. stock . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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