Jump to content
LegacyGT.com

Time to Tune


Recommended Posts

Hi all. I'll be getting my JmP VF40 installed in less than two weeks, along with an STi cat-less UP. The banjo filters are removed.

 

To answer your questions, yes I have browsed the tuning forum. Yes I have read this thread.

 

I'm gonna be at Stage 1, I guess. I just know I need to x-nay the stock tune for reliability purposes. Do I spend the money on an AP? Do I go the VAG-COM cable route? What tunes do you recommend for someone who uses his LGT as a DD and not a track car?

 

Thanks all, pardon the noobiness :spin:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 63
  • Created
  • Last Reply
Tactrix + Local forum tuner should do the trick. AP will cost more and then you still have to pay for custom tune, if you were going for a vanilla setup then AP with OTS maps would be sufficient.

05 LGT 16G 14psi 290whp/30mpg (SOLD)

12 OBP Stock 130whp/27mpg@87 Oct

00 G20t GT28r 10psi 250whp/36mpg

22 Ascent STOCK

Link to comment
Share on other sites

older ECUs sometimes work with VAG-COM. But it seems to be a pain / doesn't always work / sometimes bricks the ECU.

 

A tactrix setup is like $180 and I think the VagCom is $15 so for a lot of people it's "worth" the risk / time to try and get that cable working.

 

That being said - I have been using tactrix for years and never had any issue and will continue to keep using them.

 

Edit: Alex - depending on where you are you might be able to borrow a Tactrix cable from someone for a month to do a remote / e-tune.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Age-old debate, here.

 

That said, the Cobb unit is smaller, more portable, and more useful, than say, carrying your laptop around to datalog and/or tune. A Stage1 tune is pretty PnP, and will require more effort on an Open-Source tune than just doing Cobb's OTS.

 

But, you're also not gonna stop there -- You're gonna go Stage2 eventually, and then will need another map/tune. By that time, you're in for about the same as having bought a Cobb unit. (V2 goes for about $325 shipped these days.)

 

I say go with the Cobb.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

so I can't give personal experience on OTS tunes - but it's really nice to have a tune personalized for your vehicle / set-up.

 

So regardless of Cobb or Tactrix - get a tune from a vendor here.

 

I personally do this:

Tactrix cable: $180

Heiche BtSSM hardware / app: $120

two personalized tunes: $325

 

So really, I am not ahead of a Cobb in anyway.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd be willing to let you borrow my Tactrix cable to help flash an initial tune. As others already mentioned there's various pro/cons that fit people differently. Some people may like being able to tinker a bit more or have less initial cost with open source or there's the convenience of a flash and go with multiple maps via AP. An etune from a vendor on here is a solid option vs trying to do anything on your own.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I vote AP or tactrix with an etune. Talk to Dave Aka Cryotune or one of the many other fine etuners (Bren,tuning alliance,etc...). I really enjoyed working with Dave during my early tuning days. Car got progressively better and the feedback and learning about what is going on was extremely insightful. Also buy a $120 wideband. Really dial in those good afrs.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Not sure where I got the VAG COM idea. Thought it was a thing people used. Lol.

 

I'm interested in the Tactrix route. If I could get some guidance that would be awesome. I'll probably buy a tune. I guess the next question is who to buy it from?

 

So basically, I can either buy a tune and hit the road, or I can make my own and use my laptop to log everything and fine tune from there?

 

Needless to say, I'm confused.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I have the cobb which is what my tuner prefers. Really comes down to who's tuning the car on what they prefer. As stated do NOT attempt to tune your own car unless you know how tuning works. Its very easy to make a couple changes that will destroy the car very quickly.
Link to comment
Share on other sites

VAG-COM was much more popular a few years ago before the Tactrix really became solid and popular. You see it in a lot of the older posts if you are going backwards to read (good for you if you are).

 

You definitely want to get a professional tune. Don't let anybody kid you either, tuning our own cars is beyond 95% of this board's members' capability too. This is best left to the professionals unless you have a *lot* of experience already and are willing to risk blowing up because you don't know what you are doing.

 

You either can do it in person with a tuner or you can do it electronically via email. A tune in person can either be a road tune only (cheaper) or a dyno tune plus a road spot check to go with it (more expensive). If you do it in person (either dyno or road-only), you technically don't need anything other than yourself and the car as the tuner can use his own laptop and whatever cable he likes or has made for himself to tune the car. That said, it's still a good idea to be able to monitor your tune after the revisions are done to make sure things stay solid and you don't have a mechanical issue develop that doesn't play well with your tune. So while not strictly necessary when going the in person route, some solution is still recommended.

 

The most popular solutions these days are the Tactrix and the Accessport. If you come to a tuner in person with an Accessport, he'll use it to tune for you. If you have a Tactrix, he probably doesn't need it, but it will be great for logging after the fact on your own.

 

If you would rather just get an eTune from an online vendor (several here are excellent), you will be emailing a parts list to your tuner who will email a tune file that you will then load onto your car and go out a do a few test pulls on the highway in 3rd gear (note that you will most definitely be a fair bit above the speed limit by the end to do this in 3rd, so be advised of the expectation now) while logging and send the results back to the tuner. A few back and forths until you both are happy and you're good to go. It is also worth noting that some vendors will limit etunes to Accessport only, while others will do either Accessport or Tactrix.

 

So in the end, it boils down to this ... the absolute "best" option (and the most expensive, by far) is to get an Accessport and then take it directly to a tuner and have him use it to do a dyno tune. You get the tune that is customized to the car in a lab environment by a pro and you also get all the convenience and features that the Accessport brings to the table. However, this is going to be over $1000 just for tune solutions, not counting hard parts. Therefore, most folks find a way to bring that price down in a way that they are comfortable with. Willing to do a little more stuff yourself in a less convenient way? Tactrix and an etune is still a great solution. Personally, I wouldn't run an off the shelf tune from Cobb (that comes with the Accessport) other than a stage 1. No off the shelf tune will ever be as good as one that has been customized to your car specifically. Personally, I chose the Tactrix and a dyno tune from BrenTuning, a great tuner local to me. I still find myself coveting an Accessport and I may pick up one of those used ones that pop up for sale at some point.

 

Edit: Looking back a bit to the original post if we're talking just about stage 1 only, I would say you'd probably be okay with the Cobb off the shelf for stage 1 and I'm not sure I'd spend the money for a protune for just stage 1. Protune will be better than Cobb's because it's specific to your car, but at stage 1, it's not quite as important as you are basically still running all stock parts and that is reasonably well established dataset for Cobb's stage 1. Save the protune for stage 2 and 3. Or skip stage 1 and go straight to stage 2. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Yes, thank you Dujo. Tactrix will be what I do. So I just need to decide who to buy an e-tune from.

 

Do not make your own tune. For god sakes if you had to make this post you should not be making your own tune. You will blow up your car.

 

Quoting myself:

 

Needless to say, I'm confused.

 

I'm not confused anymore, and I didn't run out and try tuning it myself :rolleyes: the thought of it sounds terrifying. I thought that's what some of you were implying.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Can I ask what the differences and/or advantages are between a road tune and a dyno tune? I know the road tune should be bit cheaper because you don't have to rent a dyno.

 

And dyno time is very expensive. Will at least double the cost of the tune. A road tune is very similar to what's going on with an etune. You go out and do your 3rd gear pulls on the highway and adjust the tune accordingly. Difference is that tuner is sitting in the car with you and is making instant revisions right there. An etune is the same thing, but you do the pulls by yourself and the revisions are back and forth over days/weeks via email.

 

A dyno tune is better because it is a more controlled environment. When you are out doing the road tune, there's all sorts of environmental factors that are not controlled for. Bumpy roads, traffic, wind, aerodynamics of the car messing with the air load, etc, etc. Think of doing a dyno tune as doing the same thing, but in a laboratory environment where you can more easily control airflow into the intake and across the intercooler as well as the dyno itself being able to control the torque load. Needless to say, it's also bit safer than doing wide open throttle pulls from 45 to 90 on public highways. Even with a dyno tune though, any tuner worth his salt will also take you out on a quick road session to make sure everything looks good in the real world environment too, but it's more just driving than wot pulls. But like I said, dyno time is expensive. Dynamometers are extremely expensive equipment and dyno owners rent dyno times to professional tuners, even competitors because they have to recoup their costs. As such, tuners recognize that there is a market that doesn't want to spend that money and so they'll take you out and do it the old fashion way too. Then you're just paying for their expertise.

 

Yes, thank you Dujo. Tactrix will be what I do. So I just need to decide who to buy an e-tune from.

 

I believe BrenTuning does Accessport only etuning, so Cryo, InfamousP&T's "new" guy, Tuning Alliance, etc. Somebody else you see and like. I really like Cryo and Infamous because in addition to being monetary vendors, they both post and contribute greatly to the overall knowledge base of our site and freely share a lot of their expert knowledge. Feel free to reward their effort and time with your business. Look up some reviews and let your peers help you decide. Enjoy! Have fun!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I agree with others that the laptop on an etune and tactrix is clunky. For my stage 3 etune I picked up a tw700 windows 8 tablet for $60 new. The tablet has 2 usb ports and is simply a small 32bit, quad core, full windows computer.

 

In the coming weeks I will be molding the 7" tablet into my cubby for a clean factory look. Not only will I have the benefits of a car pc/tablet but I can also use software for gauges, logging, and map swaps.

 

BTW, if you get an etune check out Cryo, he's an excellent tuner who knows his stuff!

image.thumb.jpg.16cf393288412cd1bbbe5ca42a83e2e0.jpg

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Infamous Performance and Tuning - uses Delicious Tuning. Delicious tuning does Cobb and EcuTek tunes. Not Tactrix / Opensource. To be a EcuTek vendor / tuner you have to agree to not do opensource anymore.

 

I have also used Cryotune and have had great experiences with him and will soon be doing my stage 3 tuning with him.

 

Delicious is very cool - and the only system that can do Subaru flexfuel set-ups (any % of E85)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

^ Ah good info right there. Thanks for the correction. I think we can see where the wind is blowing here. Dave has made a lot of customers very happy. Do your due diligence too though. Nobody's perfect and I'm sure there are 1 or 2 unhappy customers out there for every vendor. ;)
Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'd imagine with JmP's turbo you will need a custom tune regardless if you change anything else.

 

For the increased flow characteristics, due to the more aggressive billet wheel (the biggest factor of the billet wheel itself), it's probably not a great idea to be running it on the stock tune, considering what we know about it. That said, I don't know if anyone is running the Custom40 on the stock tune -- I hope not! Other than that, a Stage1 or Stage2 OTS map should be rich enough to handle it. I know mine is!

Link to comment
Share on other sites

^ So you have a JmP BBVF40 running Cobb's OTS stg2?

 

BBs were scrapped -- Rollers are currently "forthcoming". But for now, I'm running the upgraded journal-bearing VF40 with inconel shaft and billet wheel. On the Stage2 OTS map. For now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.




×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

Terms of Use