Stage 1 or 2 cobb tuning

So I just stumbled onto this forum this morning and after browsing around literally all day I have learned a lot and found loads of good info. One question I haven't been able to answer is this..

With stage 1 and 2 tuning every one seems to be quoting anticipated horsepower of about 220-250. My question is; isn't the 05 Legacy 2.5GT already at 250hp? Are all the numbers I've been seeing in relation to other non turbo'd model legacys? If thats that case does anyone know what to expect from a stage 1 and 2 tune (with appropriate other mods) as far as realistic horesepower gains?

^What he said. Manufacturers use crank horsepower to skew the numbers that the car can actually put down and make it seem faster. In reality, the LGT is somewhere in the lower 200s at the wheels from the factory.

With stage 1 tunes, you can look at about 260-270 crank and stage 2 pushing close 300 crank horsepower for comparison with stock. Stage 1 power increases come mostly from cranking up the boost up to the 15ish range from 13 or 13.5 stock. Stage 2 usually turns boost up to 17-20 depending on how aggressive your tuner is and some other mods you may have. Keep in mind that many other things are being adjusted in addition to the boost levels, so do your research before changing your ECU.

What joeblow said. Learn before you tune or pay someone who knows what they are doing. I have Cobb AP on both cars and use a local tuner to street tune. He sits in the passenger seat while I drive. He has his laptop plugged into the OBD2 port. I do a 3rd gear pull from 2500-5000rpm typical, then drive for while, while he makes adjustments to the Map. We'll do a few pull's until he's happy with tune.

He's in W. Springfield MA. http://www.tuningalliance.com

Stage 1 really can be that simple. You buy an AP, load the maps for you car (05-07 vs 08-09 and MT vs AT) and plug it into the OBDII port and load to the ECU. The off the shelf (OTS) maps just aren't very specific for your car. They're designed to be safe for any LGT in the range of your car so it won't be very aggressive. As mentioned the other option is to get a specific tune.

With AP stage 2, boost is limited to 17.5psi with limited timing adjustment. A professional tuner can adjust timing and boost levels to give you a super aggressive tune that's still safe for your car, but might blow the engine on another, almost identical, LGT.

I ran stage 2 OTS on my AP for more than 6 months. It didn't cause any issues with the car, but it definitely wasn't running as well as it could. I had some fine learning knock correction in the peak boost range. Nothing terrible, but still some correction. Now that I'm running an Infamous tune that is specific to my car, I have 0s across the board on the knock correction scale, and all my datalogs look great.

For the sake of ease and finances, if you're planning on going stage 2 in the near future, just buy the AP and load the OTS stage 1 map until you get the parts for the stage 2 "build." Once you get the parts together for stage 2 get a pro tune. Up pipe and Downpipe are the only "requirements" for stage 2, but you might add a larger intercooler, drop in filter/intake, or catback. Whether you choose a road, dyno, or e-tune is up to you, but do your research first.

Stage 1 really can be that simple. You buy an AP, load the maps for you car (05-07 vs 08-09 and MT vs AT) and plug it into the OBDII port and load to the ECU. The off the shelf (OTS) maps just aren't very specific for your car. They're designed to be safe for any LGT in the range of your car so it won't be very aggressive. As mentioned the other option is to get a specific tune.

 

With AP stage 2, boost is limited to 17.5psi with limited timing adjustment. A professional tuner can adjust timing and boost levels to give you a super aggressive tune that's still safe for your car, but might blow the engine on another, almost identical, LGT.

 

I ran stage 2 OTS on my AP for more than 6 months. It didn't cause any issues with the car, but it definitely wasn't running as well as it could. I had some fine learning knock correction in the peak boost range. Nothing terrible, but still some correction. Now that I'm running an Infamous tune that is specific to my car, I have 0s across the board on the knock correction scale, and all my datalogs look great.

 

For the sake of ease and finances, if you're planning on going stage 2 in the near future, just buy the AP and load the OTS stage 1 map until you get the parts for the stage 2 "build." Once you get the parts together for stage 2 get a pro tune. Up pipe and Downpipe are the only "requirements" for stage 2, but you might add a larger intercooler, drop in filter/intake, or catback. Whether you choose a road, dyno, or e-tune is up to you, but do your research first.

Well said jb!

Just to clarify though, it is not a requirement to replace the UP for Stage 2 (according to COBB). It's just highly recommended for folks with cats in their UP ('05 and '06 vehicles) as the cat will eventually begin to disintegrate and destroy your turbo. It's also much easier to replace the UP when you're under there replacing the DP.

Cheers!