Why not to drive on a dyeing clutch. The TOB horrors inside.

I get asked to explain it all the time. So, rather than write it I will show it.

 

Subarus are notorious for the TOB wearing out before the clutch. When the TOB wears it rides on the snout in a non-perpendicular angle, causing major wear. This can be remedied with a TSK-3 kit if caught early. When you push it, you get to buy a new tranny.

 

This tranny is a LGT 05 5MT wagon. TOB is in so many pieces I can not count. Two remaining pieces on the shaft are seized. I can not get them off without causing more damage.

 

If you hear it, feel it, or suspect it. Might be time to check/replace it.

For the uninformed, what would be some telltale symptoms that it may be time to check it out?

Ouch. Good info there. I would also like to know some of the telltale signs

Odd vibrations at engagement, whirring noises that go away when clutch pedal pushed in, slipping clutch at high boost/tq but fine otherwise.

 

Snout is part of the case. New case is approx $450 plus shipping. Going to spend no less than $1000 to remove guts and drop into new case then re-install. Might as well buy a used for the same price and have a whole bunch of spare parts. Its a rock and a hard place situation. A clutch replacement that gets way more expensive. Putting it off does not save money.

It's too bad there's no way to stick an inspection camera in there and look without pulling it all apart.

what would cause this kind of damage Mike?

 

http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d3/desperatedano/IMG_20120209_172625.jpg

More pix of the damage. I was able to cut off the remaining pieces of TOB and "clean" up the snout so you can see the grooving very clearly.

 

 

Dan, while not grooved yet, looks like the TOB has been riding out of alignment and starting to almost peel the snout like a banana. TSK-3 should "fix".

 

On this one, the grooving is bad, and the snout has "burrs" on it too. So I dont feel good about trying to sand it down and get a TSK-3 sleeve to hold.

What's a tsk-3 sleeve?

http://www.infamousperformance.net/media/00/a20791712c0013eab9c9d0_s.jpg

Subaru Tranquil TSK3 Sleeve Kit

 

The Subaru Tranquil Sleeve Kit ' TSK3 ' is the perfect solution for the notorious grooving of the quill that occurs on 5MT transmissions.

 

Grooving of the quill causes:

-Clutch chatter

-Uneven engagement

-Premature clutch and throw-out bearing failure

 

The Trans Snout Kit takes less than 10 minutes to install while replacing the clutch assembly, does not require any modification or machining, Removable and reusable, & provides a noticeable smoothness to the clutch engagement Eliminates noisy clutch linkage rattles.

Thia isnt limites to just subarus.. any TOB wear or suspected failure wnds poorly when driven on.

It can happen to any tranny. But it is a known issue with Subies. A weakness in the design that has been a problem for many years. There are actually TSK1, 2 and 3 kits for Subies. It is the TSK3 that works for 5MT's in LGT's. Not an issue in 6MT's. Difference between push and pull design.

Useful info - thanks

damnit, i keep driving my car on its dying clutch while i wait for mine to get here. i hope this doesnt happen to me.

DOES YOUR CLUTCH JERK OR CHATTER?

DOES YOUR PEDAL FEEL ROUGH OR NOTCHY?

DOES YOUR PEDAL FEEL LIKE IT’S STICKING?

ARE YOU HAVING TO REPLACE YOUR CLUTCH & / OR RELEASE

BEARING MORE OFTEN THAN YOU SHOULD?

THE PROBLEM:

These are the most common symptoms associated with a damaged or grooved quill on a transmission. It is also referred to as the snout, bearing carrier, or case extension. In most cases it is an integral part of the transmission case & cannot be replaced. The logical solution is to replace the case or the transmission. Both options are expensive & time consuming, neither of which solves the problem permanently.

THE CAUSE:

In the operation of the clutch, the release or throw-out bearing slides on the clutch snout or quill, allowing you to engage and disc-engage the clutch mechanism. Due to various reasons the quill becomes grooved over time. If the quill were made of a harder metal than aluminum, this would not be as common. The most common causes are: improper clutch adjustment, defective clutch assemblies, stop & go traffic, keeping your foot on the clutch (commonly referred to as riding the clutch), loss of lubricant, heat, & etc.

THE EFFECT:

The effects of these grooves on the clutch operation are catastrophic. They cause: premature clutch disc wear, premature bearing failure (further adding to the problem), sticky &/or jerky pedal travel, rattling clutch forks, transmission damage, etc.

THE SOLUTION:

The Transmission Sleeve Kit (TSK) solves this problem by utilizing a sleeve, precision machined of 304 Stainless steel, which slips over the original quill. This provides a smooth, hard surface for the oversize bearing to slide on. It is anchored with set screws and is removable & re-usable. As in the case of the Subaru, it must be removed in order to allow any transmission repairs.

THE RESULTS:

After installing the Transmission Sleeve Kit (TSK) you have eliminated the problem forever! You will notice a smooth, fluid like, feel to the pedal. Your engagements will be smoother. Your clutch will last longer. This in turn, will reduce the wear on your transmission. It will never groove again!

THE KIT:

The kit comes complete with a 303 Stainless steel sleeve, set screws & hex wrench, oversized release bearing, hi-temp grease packet, notification sticker, & instructions. The kit comes with a 1 year, unlimited mileage, warranty.

Thumbs up for a good post. I actually had this happen (TOB self destructed) to my old DSM right after I bought it. I didn't get any warning signs, the clutch pedal just stuck down on me at a stop light and wouldn't come up unless I pulled it up with my foot. Limped it about 10 blocks down the road and the aftermath was a new tranny as the case was trashed.

 

-Steve

Seen it in Toyotas too. Any tranny with an aluminum housing and an aluminum snout. But it happens in Subies all too often. I would far rather swap a clutch for a customer than have to make the call that we found a catastrophic failure.

So what about older 5mts from the secound gens. I have never heard of this problem before and you think I would of being the age of the secound gen legacys

 

Sent from my Galaxy Tab using TapaTalk 2

So what about older 5mts from the secound gens. I have never heard of this problem before and you think I would of being the age of the secound gen legacys

 

Sent from my Galaxy Tab using TapaTalk 2

 

Its the difference between push and pull style clutch systems.

 

Its not as common, but TOB failure can happen on any manual trans.

I should post the photo of my TOB. the shaft collar in the center was off-center and slightly bent. Thankfully I had a slipping clutch and replaced it in time. The scoring on the snout was in the axial direction, which indicates the bearing was spinning, but not sliding well. Scotch-Brite actually smoothed out the surface and I put the TSK3 on it.

^^ Correct.

 

^This sounds like the more normal situation we encounter. A little scotch-brite or light sanding cloth and a TSK3 to the rescue.

The kit is good, but it would not fit over the shaft on mine so i did not instal it. Mine looked and felt good as new after 100k on the car.

Good write up. Thanks

We have installed a TSK-3 kit (after a lot of cleaning of the snout). Looks like it might just hold, so the test shall commence. If this works, it is the most damaged snout I have used a TSK-3 on. It also saved a tranny (if it holds).

 

Pix of the TSK-3 installed on the damaged snout.

My experiences with the TSK3 kits have been excellent. I'm currently on my 2nd sleeve and TOB (108k miles). OEM one grooved the snout, and the TSK3 fixed that one. After 40k some miles later the TSK3 TOB started to go and grooved the sleeve, but didn't go all the way through to the snout. Used a dremel to cut off the old sleeve and replaced it with a new TSK3 kit. The nice thing is the new sleeve will add more protection to the snout.

 

For me, my TOB starts to go out about every 40K - 50k miles. Most of that is due to a lot of city driving in stop/go traffic.

We have installed many, many TSK-3 kits. This just happens to be the worst damaged snout I have used 1 on (to date). Was a little surprised it fits as tight as it does. Lots of metal lost from this snout.