Performance of 2.5i

I recently test drove the 2.5i and came away with a few impressions. I'd like to hear from people that drove the 2.5i back-to-back with the GT, as I haven't had a chance. First, some background: I currently drive a Miata. Handling is WAY more important to me than power (more important, not unimportant). My wife likes the Legacy because it's relatively quiet...quieter than the E46 3-series and the Volvo S40 T5 AWD (both handled well, but both are a bit steep $$$) that I test drove. However, back to handling, the Legacy feels big, the steering ratio seems pretty slow, as is turn in. It also squatted quite a bit under acceleration (not that big of a deal). Is the GT any better in these aspects? Is the suspension tuned differently? I know the GT has a 15:1 steering ratio (same is the Miata) compared to the 16.5:1 in the 2.5i, so maybe lifting that out of a GT into the 2.5i would help....? So many reviews seem to think that the 2.5i is a good handler, what am I not seeing, is it that I'm comparing outside its class (Miata, 325i, S40)?

 

Also, note that I'm really not sure about stepping up to a GT, the few thousand more has turned into an issue of late, as well as the MPG on 93 octane that costs $2.39/gallon here in lovely Michigan...not necessarily my issues, but rather OUR issues. I hear the Mazda6 is a great handler, but I can't get over the FWD thing...it's a phobia I think.

 

Sorry for my rambling writing, but just trying to get some thoughts out and start some conversations with like-minded individuals....and I know my Miata weighs 1100 lbs less than the 2.5i so it will handle better...I just want good handling

Do we actually let 2.5i drivers post on this forum?

Well, I personally feel the handling isnt TOO different between the LGT and the 2.5i. The main difference is in the tires. THe i gets more sidewall, which tends to not be as good a handler. As far as suspension set up, they are pretty similar if any differences at all. There is only power delivery differences in respect to F/R split of the power depending on the model, etc. Other than that, a 2.5i with some minor suspension tweaks is a lot of fun. I personally am a handling type of guy myself, and I'm throwing on some coilovers, sways, and some new wheels/tires. That's pretty much all the basic suspension tuning, but it's more aggresive than most like as far as just a normal car. And that 93 octane, yeah...that is kinda hard...you'll want to "test the potential" of your GT, if you decide to get one. Hope I'm not just rambling and this helps...

Do we actually let 2.5i drivers post on this forum?

 

Not trying to be rude or start anything, but that's kind of surprising coming from someone that has 7 posts...You must be coming from an BMW or Audi forum or something. Alot of ppl on these forums dont even have Legacies. sp?

Hell, Tide, who created this forum, drives a WRX . And yeah, that stung cus I have a 2.5i. SO?!

I mean where do we start here...I own an 05 outback base model and a LGT. The LGT needs about $500 in mods (sway bars) to the suspension in order to get on the handling side of the comfort/handling comprimise. Tires also help alot. Point being that, in its stock form, the LGT is soft and comfortable. Far from Miata handling. but if you are willing to do mods over time the LGT can be unstopable. As for the gas, its not pretty compared to the RSX-S I just traded. My brother has a Mazdaspeed protege, lets just say the four door Mazdas aren't quite as tight as the Subies...Finally, my non-turbo outback is a softer pig....

Well first off i am surprised that you are comparing the 2.5i with a turboed volvo as well as the 3 series, as both are substantially more than a 2.5i Leg. A well equipted 3 series is pushing almost 10k more i would htink.

 

As far as price, i would htink that the 3 series would be off the list and that a 2.5 non-turbo volvo would be best suitable for comparison.

 

I personally never drove the 2.5i so i can't really comment on its characteristics. I can say however, that if you are thinking of trying to swap components, that the GT would be a better choice in the long run. It may be a little more up front, but as soon as you start changing parts, things can add up quickly. I think the better out of the box solution would be the GT.

 

The miata is no where near the same handling characteristics of any Leg. You may be able to make some changes, but i doubt you will ever get that same type of feeling with this car...and if you do it won't be cheap.

 

As far as FWD, it really depends on the situation. Michigan obviously gets a good deal of snow, so i can see the tendency towards AWD. However, don't discount a FWD with good snow tires on. A FWD car with good snow tires can do better than a AWD with mediocre all seasons in the same situations.

 

Gas prices can be a concern. Do some math though, it all depends how tight money is and how much you drive. If you are driving on 12k a year, the $.20 more a gallon would work out to somewhere in the neighborhood of $100 / yr more in gas, estimated with 24 mpg. That is not much money by any means. So it all depends.

The 325i I drove was used, it's the outgoing body...but even then it's more expensive, on par even with the new S40. As for why I'm cross shopping these cars, the Legacy is the only car in its class that I'm interested in, because my FWD phobia has more to do with personal preference than snow (I've driven my miata through a few Michigan winters now). I'd look at a used TSX (2 yr old for $22k) but I just can't get over not liking FWD (wish I could). I hardly wanted to drive the S40 because its a Haldex rather than a pure mechanical center diff as in the manual Subarus. This makes it very hard to shop, because there the ony sedans I know under $25k which are RWD or AWD are the Subies and the 300 (4 spd auto unless you spend $30k, even then, it's still an automatic...so I don't count it). $30k seems to be the magic amount for a new car. Maybe I'll have to push for the $26k for the LGT, then I'll have quicker steering and decent sized rubber. You can get good gas mileage if you can bring yourself to stay off the throttle, right?

Lotus: I think the Mazdaspeed 6 is just what you are looking for. The handling of a Mazda with 274 hp of all-wheel drive.

 

http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayPage.action?pageParameter=mazdaSpeed6

 

I agree with msavino, the stock suspension is soft and comfortable on the LGT, even more so on the 2.5i. You would need suspension mods to suit it to your liking.

having driven both the 2.5i and the GT (since i own the GT), allow me to toss a couple of coins into the arena.

 

handling - handling is somewhat simliar. the GT feels like it has a 'tighter' suspension than the i, but that may be do in part to the fact that the tires on the i are not low profile and therefore allow more 'roll'. in my opinion, the GT feels like it sticks a lot more to the ground versus the i. both the GT and the i had a nice quiet ride. the GT seemed to have a better balance when it came to performance and comfort with regards to handling.

 

the major thing that turned me off from the i is performance. the GT has a significant advantage here, making handling much more fun.

 

but, to each their own.

Well the Mazdaspeed 6....should be an interesting car, i know i am interested in seeing it...However, it has been delayed till September is what i heard, either way certainly end of summer / fall.

 

Not to mention it will have 18" strictly summer tires on it...Have fun imediately buying new tires if you want any driving in snow. At 18", expect them to be expensive, hard to find, and not many choices in that size.

The 325i I drove was used, it's the outgoing body...but even then it's more expensive, on par even with the new S40. As for why I'm cross shopping these cars, the Legacy is the only car in its class that I'm interested in, because my FWD phobia has more to do with personal preference than snow (I've driven my miata through a few Michigan winters now). I'd look at a used TSX (2 yr old for $22k) but I just can't get over not liking FWD (wish I could). I hardly wanted to drive the S40 because its a Haldex rather than a pure mechanical center diff as in the manual Subarus. This makes it very hard to shop, because there the ony sedans I know under $25k which are RWD or AWD are the Subies and the 300 (4 spd auto unless you spend $30k, even then, it's still an automatic...so I don't count it). $30k seems to be the magic amount for a new car. Maybe I'll have to push for the $26k for the LGT, then I'll have quicker steering and decent sized rubber. You can get good gas mileage if you can bring yourself to stay off the throttle, right?

 

Honestly, a little more money spent now would probably put you into a car you will like and tend to keep longer. The worst thing you can do when purchasing a car or any big ticket item, is settle for something.

 

Best advice is to get out there and look around at everything.

 

As far as the LGT, i would bet the deals will only get better as new modles loom.

Lotus - I had a 2.5i 4eat wagon today as a loaner. It has more body roll than the LGT, but not much. Frankly, I thought it handled very well.

Lotus: I think the Mazdaspeed 6 is just what you are looking for. The handling of a Mazda with 274 hp of all-wheel drive

 

all indications are that the price as tested on this car will be over 30K....

me thinks the rx-8 would be what you need. although gas mileage may not be the best. but it has good handling and better oomph than the 2.5i, 3-series and s40 t5. heard wit traction control and a set of winter tires, the 8 is a capable snowy road partner.

I appreciate all your opinions and info...the RX-8 sounds fun, but a rotary...meh, interesting engineering, but too many other issues...and the wife would not like the 8(?) cubic feet of trunk. I think I'm going to have to try and not be so picky.

 

....250hp does sound fun.....

All things considered, it sounds like you'd be best off with a WRX. A Miata is such a light, smooth handler, but the WRX would come the closest out of the Volvo, the 325i, and the 2.5i.

 

Have you even considered one? Are you upgrading from your Miata because you want a bigger car, or is that not really a concern?

Well, I figure I should update the thread since I started this;). I drove the LGT and I found significant handling difference between the LGT and the 2.5i. I think the 15:1 steering ratio helped alot....and the 17" furthered it a bit. Turn-in was quite a bit different between the 2 cars. Oh, and the hp...maybe that helped my impression...just a little...maybe...The WRX was fun, tighter than the LGT but, probably too small...this coming car will be the one that sees rug rats, I think, so a little more space is nice. And the WRX was quite a bit louder on the highway.

 

Still no decision though, since I haven't taken the wife out in the LGT. She isn't a fan of turbos, but I thought that compared to the Jetta 1.8T we tried a few years back, the LGT didn't have really accentuated turbo lag.

the subies i had were a 2004 wrx, 2001 l.l.beaner wagon, and a 87 outback sport.

 

this last time i test drove a 2004 leftover legacy sedan, a 2005 2.5i, a 2005 gt, and the 3.0r of which i bought.

 

the gt had a turbo and too much power for me to abuse.

so i choose the smoother detuned 3.0r

 

the 2004 legacy and 2005 2.5i are dogs when comes to power otherwis they are just fine as all around cars for people NOT in a hurry.

 

btw no sense modding a slow car when you won't get too much bang for the buck.

 

just my 3.0r cents

How is the 3.0r. I never even did drive it, but just curious as to your take on it. It still has 250 HP though right? just a little less TQ. If you had to make a ballpark guess, what would you put the 0-60 at? The 3.0r is the outback sedan right?

 

I think i was behind one a few months ago. Caught me off guard because i didn't recognize what it was off the bat.

yes it's a outback.

 

0-60 i think is 7 sec or little less, not fast but respectable.

 

h-6 is smooth and mates well with the 5eatme tranny.

 

ride is a little smoother than the gt.

 

it doesn't corner as well as the gt but, can be improved with new tires and rear swaybar.

 

since few are sold it's more "exclusive".

 

basically powerwise it's 85% of the gt

cornering it's 80% of the gt

Lotus,

 

Having a turbo background myself - and coming in to this also with a wife who was always N/A (hum, that's strange, I thought all humans were N/A? ), yes, I definitely understand your wife's concern for turbo lag.

 

Actually, coming from harder-hitting turbos myself, my chief concern when shopping the WRX for Sara, my wifey, was whether or not boost would come on too suddenly.

 

From my point of view, current-model WRXs are pretty benign in their boost behavior. However, it still took Sara a bit of getting used-to driving the WRX around-town, where the "on-boost" behavior in lower gears was more pronounced. That said, it took her about a day to get used to it (and get addicted to it...whenever I mention "boosting" now, she just gets this grin across her face), and pretty much, she said, driving around without boost was just as docile and responsive as her '01 Civic EX. Thus, "lag," per-se, was not a perceived issue.

 

With the wide torque-band of the LGT, most drivers find that lag is pretty much a non-issue unless you're really caught-out in terms of which gear you're in.

 

Since my wifey and I are '05/'05 owners of the LGT and WRX (sedan), it's definitely true that the WRX does not offer nearly as compliant of a ride over rough roads nor is it anywhere near as NVH-proof on highways. Although the WRX is not, I would say, any more or less noisy than any other average compact import, it definitely sounds sportier than the typical "family sedans" that are one level up. Similarly, comparing stock suspensions, the WRX sedan's is very much biased toward sharper reflexes than that of the LGT's.

 

In terms of space and rugrats, my original purchase decision was down to, actually, the LGT and a WRX wagon. Overwhelmingly, my "local" Scooby enthusiast Forum recommended the LGT.

 

Hope this helps!

 

-A

Do we actually let 2.5i drivers post on this forum?

 

How long will it take for you to get banned.

How long will it take for you to get banned.

 

Apparently a bit more than three years...

Bahaha holy thread revival.

Yikes...this has been on here longer than i have...random resurrection