Weird no-start issue

Started a few weeks ago - randomly the car would not start. Key turned, lights on, not response from the engine, no clicks or anything. I released the key again it worked fine.

 

This happened a couple of times over a couple of weeks, then I got a check engine light / flashing cruise right after getting the car started. Pulled the codes right there and then - Crank Postion circuit fail, and both Cam position circuits failed. But the car ran fine. I cleared the codes, and the car ran like crap for a couple of days (like the battery had been unplugged)

 

The no-start has continued randomly, but a second turn of the key always fixed it. Every ten or so times this happened I'd get the check engine light and those same 3 codes.

 

 

This morning I got in the car and had the no-start thing again, only this time I heard a click, like a very dead battery, but the lights were on strong. I released the key and tried again - still dead. Tried the key a few more times then finally it started normally.

 

 

So I'm thinking that 3 simultaneous position circuit failures is not realistic, and that the codes are a symptom of the starting issue. I'm going to check the clutch interlock and starter motor wiring tonight.

 

 

Anyone else seen these symptoms together and wants to save me an hour of buzzing out wires?

i had something similar over the winter...or was the previous winter..

i didn't get any codes but i had some issues starting my car.

 

what seemed to solve the issue was replacing the battery.

 

i doubt it's going to be the same deal with your car though

Started a few weeks ago - randomly the car would not start. Key turned, lights on, not response from the engine, no clicks or anything. I released the key again it worked fine.

 

This happened a couple of times over a couple of weeks, then I got a check engine light / flashing cruise right after getting the car started. Pulled the codes right there and then - Crank Postion circuit fail, and both Cam position circuits failed. But the car ran fine. I cleared the codes, and the car ran like crap for a couple of days (like the battery had been unplugged)

 

The no-start has continued randomly, but a second turn of the key always fixed it. Every ten or so times this happened I'd get the check engine light and those same 3 codes.

 

 

This morning I got in the car and had the no-start thing again, only this time I heard a click, like a very dead battery, but the lights were on strong. I released the key and tried again - still dead. Tried the key a few more times then finally it started normally.

 

 

So I'm thinking that 3 simultaneous position circuit failures is not realistic, and that the codes are a symptom of the starting issue. I'm going to check the clutch interlock and starter motor wiring tonight.

 

 

Anyone else seen these symptoms together and wants to save me an hour of buzzing out wires?

 

This exact same situation is currently happening to me. It was actually this morning when I got the CEL and flashing CC, but I have no way of reading codes yet. Its gotten progressively harder to start over the last couple days, and today it took several tries to start. After finding this thread I went out and picked up a new battery since the one in there was old junk, but when trying to start the car it did it again.

 

Thing is after that fail, it started the next 3-4 times I turned the car on and off to check so I will wait to see what happens tomorrow. Im guessing it will still be intermittent, it almost felt like it was the switch on the clutch pedal.

 

The reason I say that is when I would try to start the car with it in neutral but no clutch nothing would happen (like it should). Then with the clutch in still nothing for a few times, then when I did get it to start again I never took my foot of the clutch, but I turned the car on and off several times like that and it worked fine. But once I took my foot off the pedal and pressed it a few times, it wouldnt start again. But once I got it to start (after pressing the pedal a few times), I could hold the pedal down and turn the car on and off with no problem again. If the battery didnt do it, thats my next step, unless you find something.

Maybe an ignition switch? I know in VWs they are pretty tricky and they go pretty often. They have some strange symptoms.

I have had cars where the crank position sensor would work randomly. I believe the crank sensor sends a signal to the PCM when the engine is cranked and then the PCM turns on the fuel pump. The camshaft sensor signals the PCM top dead center #1 cylinder and then begins the injector firing sequence. The fuel pump should turn on for about 4 seconds when you turn the key on with the engine off. If you crank the engine then and the pump doesn't come on, it could very well be your crank sensor.

 

Kind of strange that both your sensors would have issues at the exact same time. Maybe one is affecting the other.

i get a random no start issue, but mine will crank just not start. All i gotta do is try it a second time and it starts. Wierd. Sometimes i think it happens when i try to start the car to fast and the needles arent done doing there sweep.

Thing is when it's happening there is no cranking. You turn the key and it's just silence.

Sorry to keep posting, but I just drove my car to work and it started right away on the first turn. Turned the car off and back on a few more times and it started up each time. Before I changed the battery it wouldn't start on the first turn at all so I'm hoping this is a good sign.

 

Lol I just got my aux in mod and I don't want to touch it until I get this no start sorted out.

Other than a battery problem or a voltage drop across the starter circuit or cables, take the two grounds off the driver side intake ( back of head, dr side ). Take them off and clean them up.

Having clean grounds can make all the difference in the world. My sons old 92 Legacy was throwing all kinds of codes and I could not figure out what it was. Turned out to be some dirty grounds. Cleaned them up and everything went away.

I'm going to get the car in the workshop this weekend and check all the grounds, the starter wiring and clutch inhibitor switch wiring. I think I'll call in at the auto parts store tomorrow and have a battery test done too...

After a full day of driving around and making plenty of stops, it's still starting right away on the first turn. Before I bought the battery I had cleaned the starter solonoid contacts because a CV boot had ripped and thrown grease all over. But that didn't make a difference.

 

I'll update if it comes back, but it seems the new battery did the trick. Good luck.

@Fee Did you have the old battery tested or just replace it on a hunch?

While searching I saw someone else mention the battery as a possibilty. But after seeing how similar your symptoms were to mine and the first reply was this:

 

i had something similar over the winter...or was the previous winter..

i didn't get any codes but i had some issues starting my car.

 

what seemed to solve the issue was replacing the battery.

 

i doubt it's going to be the same deal with your car though

 

I figured it was worth a try, especially since I've only owned the car a month, the battery on there was a unknown to me brand, and the terminals were looking pretty nasty. It was time for a new battery anyway.

Hey scruit, please post here again when you get yours sorted out. All was still working fine for me today when I drove to work, but if it happens again I would like to have other options to try. Thanks and gl. Nice avatar btw.

Sounds almost like the anti-theft system isn't recognizing the transponder in the key fob. Eyeball the "security" light on the dash when you have this problem and see if you notice anything.