Yay - I'm in the shortblock club!

Had some knock being picked up in the off-idle area that I couldn't tune out. Nothing loose found. Just for giggles, I drained some oil. I'VE GOT THE GLITTER. Looks copper colored. Not a lot, but really any is too much. So I figure 1+1=order a new shortblock. So I got it, and I'm currently popping out the pistons and opening up the ring end-gap just a bit. A new saga begins...

Make sure there is oil in the cylinders before you start it up.

 

Look at the oil in my ej257. There other day someone toasted one because there's was dry. His picture like yours, looked dry compared to mine.

 

Your #3 looks kind of ok...

Thanks Max, I'll make sure of that. The pic is of the shortblock as it came from the dealer. I'll be sure everything is well oiled when it all goes together.

 

btw - your shortblock build thread was one of the first ones I studied when I got my car in Nov 2012

Why are u opening the ring gap? What kinda power are you going for?

Thanks, for reading it.

 

The thing still runs great. 37,000 + miles. Uses a little oil after about 2000 miles but at 21psi I'm not complaining.

I've heard a couple of times here the theory that if someone has ring land failure (which I didn't in this case, but I want to prevent it anyway) it may have been caused by the very tiny (0.008") ring end-gap. If there's a lot of heat due to knocking/lean condition/etc things expand, and if the gap closes completely then the ring can bind with the cylinder wall and suddenly the ring lands experience up/down hammering by that ring, since it doesn't want to move. Eventually what gives is the ring land. Just a theory, but makes sense to me.

 

So I'm filing the gap...

Top ring: shooting for 0.016" (up from about 0.008" stock - only twice the width of a human hair)

Second ring: shooting for 0.020" (up from about 0.016")

Sorry for the "outside" url, but here's what I'm talking about. Link.

Stock pistons are cast. So when you open the ring gap you allow the piston to cool more. When you have a cooler piston it is less prone to ringland failure.

Welcome to the club, good luck with your build.

Welcome to the club, good luck with your build.

 

Thanks. Being in this club is a dubious honor.

I hope this is the attitude that I have if I ever pop a motor

 

Thanks. I have to admit I'm biting my tongue a bit. Didn't think I'd have this summer project Ah well, shiny parts are good I guess.

What kinda power are you going for?

 

Not really big power. Just preserving what I had, which I would guess is around 300 ft/lbs (bnr 16g, up, dp, mid pipe, tmic, etc). If I had E85 closer to me, I'd step up to that, but the nearest is about 1 hour out of my way.

In which cell(s) were you picking up knock in your LVs?

How much oil consumption between OCI?

 

sorry to hear OP.

Hey bonbon. The cell in the LV picking up knock was the top left corner only. Oil consumption was barely noticeable.

Interesting..

yeah as BMB said, isn't it just knock at idle? Top left is idle I believe.

Did you log cylinder roughness as well?

Did you do a compression test and leak down test too?

Would that be knock during idle? And possible false knock? Or am I completely wrong there...?

 

Yes, well knock when I would blip the throttle. I couldn't actually hear the knock, but the ECU did. It only happened when the oil temp was fully warmed up.

 

Then I started hearing not a knock, but rhythmic slight thump-thump-thump. At first it sounded like what an intake backfire sounds like... sort of a muffled pop.

 

I checked everywhere for loose heat shields, or loose anything. Everything seemed secure.

 

Then when I saw the glitter in the oil, I parked it and ordered a shortblock. I realize glitter in the oil can also come from the turbo, but with this knocking going on too, that's when I put it all together and got the new shortblock.

On a side note, is this an app you are using on your phone? If yes, I want it NOW!!

Ah yes - that is a little one-off project I put together. It's an app that runs on my android phone, and it communicates via bluetooth to a small interface sitting on the k-line of the obd port. It's definitely not perfect, but very handy since it uses the SSM protocol to get all the good data we are accustomed to.

Ah yes - that is a little one-off project I put together. It's an app that runs on my android phone, and it communicates via bluetooth to a small interface sitting on the k-line of the obd port. It's definitely not perfect, but very handy since it uses the SSM protocol to get all the good data we are accustomed to.

 

K I still want it!! For reals man. You could make money off of this project.

 

Where do you live? I come help you if I can .

 

Back to topic:

Interesting..

Did you log cylinder roughness as well?

Did you do a compression test and leak down test too?

Thanks. Regarding selling it, I've given it some thought. Not sure what the overall demand would be though.

 

Regarding "back to topic"..................

 

I did monitor/log cylinder roughness, and there wasn't really any to speak of. Occasionally I'd get a count of "1" in any of the cylinders, but it's always been that way. 99.99% of the time, they are all zeros.

 

I have not done a compression/leak down test. Probably should have, but figured it's gotta be a bearing with the copper glitter

Thanks. Regarding selling it, I've given it some thought. Not sure what the overall demand would be though.

 

Regarding "back to topic"..................

 

I did monitor/log cylinder roughness, and there wasn't really any to speak of. Occasionally I'd get a count of "1" in any of the cylinders, but it's always been that way. 99.99% of the time, they are all zeros.

 

I have not done a compression/leak down test. Probably should have, but figured it's gotta be a bearing with the copper glitter

 

Then, if it is a bearing, would the engine have starved of oil at some point prior to this issue? Knowing you, I am sure you are on top of your oil level and engine's health in general, so that is really weird..

Do you still have the OEM oil pick up tube?