Subie Dumps Legacy Performance

If the info being posted is correct and you can no longer buy a LegacyGT or OBXT wagon with MT, Subaru has walked away from the sport wagon market. I would think that MT for all wagons would be critical for Euro, Latin Am and Asia Pacific markets.

 

By dropping the non-limited GT and dropping MT for wagons, Subaru has seriously reduced the reason for the "Legacy" model to exist. Why not just offer Outback? The 05 LegGTs with MT gave the Legacy line a sport market position that OBXT could not match. The combo of lower CG, bigger front brakes, sport turning ratio and lighter weight created a sport "reason for being" for Legacy. Does any Subaru model justify itself as a sedan only? Without the LegGT wagon with MT, I would buy an Outback, but in fact, I will most likely leave Subaru for the 07 BMW3tdi AWD wagon with MT.

 

I really love my 05 LegGT/Ltd wagon with MT. It is my first Subaru and I could have bought the cureent BMW325 AWD wagon with MT (I got one for my oldest son in 2002), but I bought and enjoy my LegGT wagon more. If the info about no MT for LegacyGT wagons is true, Subaru is flying in the face of their Legacy advert campaign and sending a clear message to captured BMW/Audi customers that Subaru does not want our business. Subaru no longer offers a sport wagon in Legacy or OB format.

where the F*** did you see them dropping the MT?

sorry, realized you were talking specifically about the wagon.

 

 

anyhow -- i guess we'll have to wait and see. Seems like an odd move on there part if it's true.

This is not just a wagon segment hit for the Legacy line. The non-Ltd LegGT sedan is gone. The biggest market for LegGT Sedans is the younger, price restricted buyer that is looking for performance value, light weight, aftermarket home add-on platform. Old farts like me buy LUX packs with weight and $ adding sun roofs, power seats and leather.

 

Only two reasons to buy Legacy that I can see. You only wnat sedan and have bucks to buy LegGT/Ltd MT sedan or the stripped Leg2.5i is cheaper than entry level OB.

 

What is Subie thinking? Walk away from sport wagon market and slam the door in the face of young value sport sedan buyers, but save the fantastic Baja?

 

No wonder Tide broke his own rules with an F-bomb in his last post.

I guess that means that my OBXT Ltd 5MT will be worth more one day Since they will be rare and in demand....

 

I know of 4 people here that considered other sport wagons, Volvo, Audi, etc...and all were drawn to Subie for the power AND inproved luxury. They will lose out on the market if this is a true, time will tell.

This might not be entirely bad, because it could be a sign that performance is being shifted for the Legacy saloon. Did Subaru ever make a Legacy wagon Sti? I know they did a WRX wagon Sti, which would make sense if they had to put a Sti badge on one of their USDM wagons.

I think 2007 will be the year that Subaru makes big things happen, especially since skylines and supras will flood the US market then.

I've never seen another 05 Legacy wagon on the road besides my own. Plenty of Legacy sedans, but no wagon. So I can understand why Subaru does this.

 

Besides, the rarer my MT wagon gets, the more I can recoup when I sell

If you think further about why the cloth base GT is gone, it's not very difficult to arrive to the conclusion - WRX. Yup. At a pinch more than a WRX, the LGT base can be had which offers similar if not better performance and for sure superior feature set. Sale for the 2005 WRXs have not been too encouraging.

So in the strategic march to differ the Legacy line and the wrx line, subaru is eliminating the base cloth GT. It is also possible that the base GTs are not selling as much as the ltd versions. Just do a quick random count on this board and you can see that there's alot more ltd GTs than base GT members. Subaru wants to coax the Legacy to the premium sedan segment. So might as well offer it as leather everything.

As for the reason for not offering MT wagons? Not too sure. Maybe a majority of the sales for GT wagons are autos. I personally do not think Subaru has gone to the left field with this one. We might not agree with Subaru, but then again we do not know Subaru's 5-year or even 10 year plan.....

The small price difference between the WRX and Legacy was one reason I went with the Legacy GT wagon. Although the good looks was probably #1.

When I talked to the owner of one of the three LGT wagons that I have encountered, he admitted regret in buying the automatic. Is he/are we in the minority in wanting the wagon with the manual transmission?

Subaru also dropped the non-limited Forester XT making it more expensive as well. I don't regret getting my automatic though. It's so nice to be lazy whil driving around State College.

Comparing a WRX wagon to a LegacyGT wagon is like comparing a VW Golf with an Audi A4 wagon. One is more of a hatchback entry level car and one is a real wagon with real four passenger design ability. Suggesting that the non-Ltd, LegGT was killed to save the WRX wagon is like saying the Legacy wagons lost the MT option to save the Baja. If I want a true four passenger wagon, I am not a WRX buyer.

 

Of course many more Leg and OB sedans or wagons, in NorAm are sold automatic, but you do not spend a year showing mostly wagons in your advert campaign and talking about how they are faster than a Porsche/BMW and drop the MT option. Besides, you need the MT option for the Euro, SoAm and Asia Pacific markets.

 

Again, it is a fact that BMW and Audi sell mostly Automatics, but they all have MT option. Even Honda and Benz have re-introduced MTs. Let’s hope this is a temporary brain fart by Subaru.

Is there a reason behind all these changes or someone just woke up one morning and said the hell with it?

Are they going to make up for this by making the rear seat fold down in the sedan?

Has any of this info been confirmed yet or is it all speculation ?

 

I, for one, loves the practicality of a wagon, with the performance of the manual, and I'm sure I'm not alone. SoA & SoC, are you listening ?

I'm sure they aren't dropping the manual wagon in the rest of the world--this was an SOA decision. It's a simple case of business math. Automatics have a higher margin and it requires dealers to carry a few less LG/OB flavors on the lot. That makes both SOA and the dealers happy. They should have followed Nissan's pricing strategy and offered a standard automatic and a "no charge option" of a 6spd in order to keep their margin up.

 

I'm sure it was also business math that lead them to drop the unlimited versions. The cost difference between the two versions is probably quite small which means that the extra $2700 in price goes straight to the bottom line. It wouldn't take a whole lot of analysis to figure out what percentage of unlimited buyers were in a demographic that could afford an LTD car. I would have bought the LTD version if it had been the only flavor offered, but since I could save $$ on the unlimited, I did. As mentioned above, there is still the WRX option for those who cannnot afford the LTD so I'm sure SOA feels they still have all of their bases covered.

 

It's "business math" descisions in the last thirty years that nearly killed the big three domestics because they stopped offering what the customer wanted and only focused on their bottom lines. You would think that that SOA would be a little smarter, but I guess that's not the case. The true test will be what they offer in 2007. If their sales take a dive, the selection will likely return. If sales continue to be strong, kiss the manual sedan good bye!

 

K (stoked to own an unlimted 5spd OBXT)

 

P.S. So is the reason they are still calling the only version "Limited" because you are limited to only getting your car with leather and a sunroof???

so with the elimination of the cloth base GT, there shouldn't be any Ltd distinction right? I mean all LGTs will be Ltd trim. How bizarro.

Kristian, I agree with you that this was a CFO decision, without creative input from the marketing people. This is a numbers decision that creates a lose, lose market share impact.

 

As you stated and Nissan has implemented, offering a 6MT special order option, at same price as Automatic would have delivered same or better margin objective and reduced dealer floor stock expense. Subaru could have eliminated the expense of 500 overpriced Spec Bs that only a fool with bad taste would buy and offer the Spec B suspension as a dealer option for all existing and new LegGTs. What type of buyer will buy an “empty suit” Spec B for same price as a BMW325? The sedan market is far more crowded and competitive than the sport wagon market Subaru was about to dominate. If I wanted a sedan, I would be driving a BMW330ix, not a Subaru. But then, I am one of those past BMW/Audi owners Subaru said they wanted to capture and did with the 250 HP, LegGT, MT Wagon. Right now, it looks like my first Subaru may be my last.

 

With a little marketing input, the CFO and his/her army of bean counters could have achieved their $ objectives and Subaru could have given us all reasons to spend more, love Subaru more and stay with the brand. We could be celebrating Subaru and talking about how great the 6MT option is and how great the Spec B sport suspension option is.

well subaru wants to go upscale, kind of like VW is trying to do. that means "aspirational pricing." i.e. you can't afford it until you probably can afford something even more expensive anyway. It means economy of scale and not cannibalizing your own product line. If you can't afford the ltd LGT, try the i, or the wrx. They'll ignore the fact that they aren't really comperable given the insurance hit for WRX, and the lack of oomph on the 2.5i.

 

Also, they seem to be following the new fashion in the auto industry of "ugly sells." Apparantly the theory is it's better to make someone feel passionate about the look of a vehicle than to be bland. In reality, what you want is a love it hate it breakdown with favorable numbers. This is what has worked for nissan and magnum/300 (as well as the dodge trucks). What it appears to have been turned into through the power of banal mantras is "ugly sells better."

 

The airplane grill MIGHT be salvagable. The B9 is hideous, the STi grill is kind of riced out looking, but that's in line with the target audience to some degree. But any idea I can come up with to make it look less hideous makes it look way too much like the SAAB grill. Honestly it's not that far off to begin with.

MTNSUB..

 

Would you mind posting a link to where you saw this info?

 

B4

I really doubt that an 05 MT wagon will be considered RARE at any point. Frankly I bet the resale will not be affected at all.

 

Nice to dream though.

B4_Maniac,

 

I found this info in this forum under the "2006 Legacy Ship By July" thread on the fifth page. Notice Tides response on same page. Info is also on several other sites.

 

I would be pleased to find out that Martians are not really landing and taking all our MT sport wagons back to Mars. May the right wrist force be with you.

 

This is one of those times when you hope you have jumped the gun on loose facts.

Does anyone know what the breakdown of 05 GT wagon sales were between MT and 5EAT?

 

I'm guessing that there had to have been more 5EATs sold for Subaru to make this decision.

 

Ken

Well....I got mine...I guess those that waited are gonna lose out....SUCKERS!!

 

On a different and more intelligent note: I didn't buy the Dodge Magnum because it only came in Automatic w/ leather (I don't like either), I didn't buy the Mazda 6S Wagon because it didn't have the power or AWD, the BMW 325 ix Wagon was too "gloaty", and not powerful enough for the price tag it came with. If I had to do it again, w/o the LGT Wagon...I wouldn't have gotten a Subaru. The WRX isn't in the same class, and the Legacy 2.5i isn't powerful enough for me. I don't know what I would have gotten. SOA is showing it's GM 20% with this move, and like just about everything GM has done with it's models in the LAST 10 YEARS (or so) this is a mistake that will show on the bottom line.

B4_Maniac,

 

I found this info in this forum under the "2006 Legacy Ship By July" thread on the fifth page. Notice Tides response on same page. Info is also on several other sites.

 

I would be pleased to find out that Martians are not really landing and taking all our MT sport wagons back to Mars. May the right wrist force be with you.

 

This is one of those times when you hope you have jumped the gun on loose facts.

 

Thanks, I will take a peak.

 

B4