Subaru Legacy's dirty little drivetrain secret???

So I just replaced my stock clutch with a SPEC 2.5. I also replaced the flywheel with another stock DMF due to a lack of after-market parts available.

 

The guy who did the work is not Subaru-affiliated and he said something interesting. While my clutch slipped badly, the disk was not worn out and the flywheel was badly burned with hotspots.

 

He advised me that it was his opinion that the pilot bearing was not the proper size for the bell-housing. It was effectively a few microns too long. The result of this was that the clutch never fully disengaged giving the effect of driving with one's foot constantly pushing the clutch just a bit.

 

While this did not matter so long as the clutch did not slip, it effectively reduced the torque capacity of the whole assembly, leading to a situation where the clutch would slip easier and ultimately burn the flywheel to the point that it would not hold and needed to be replaced.

 

Not sure if there is any truth to this or if it could affect more than just my car, but I thought I would put it out there as a possibility for anyone experiencing stock clutch problems.

the pilot bearing does not affect the clutch in this way. he must be talking about the throw-out bearing. the way to see if this is true, is to wiggle the clutch fork whith everything assembled. if it moves, then the clutch is clamping fully on the disc.

Fair enough, I may have mis-used the term, but the idea remains the same.

Are our clutches any good as far as oem clutches, if that makes any sense? What I am trying to get at is, my clutch really does not feel like it is strong enough. I swear when I take off, or even when I start a burn out or drift, it will slip and I get the infamous clutch smell. Maybe I don't know how to time the clutch yet as far as when it will properly engage, maybe, but I was wondering if anyone else has experienced this. Don't get me wrong, all of my trucks and cars were all m/t's, so I think I would know how to drive a stick. I hope:icon_bigg

Are you saying that you are trying to do a burn out in an awd car? Nothing good can come from that, might as well just ride your clutch.

There do seem to be a fair number of oem clutches wearing out prematurely. Could it be a design flaw with the throw-out bearing? Maybe it is just crappy disk material that fails to grip properly and subsequently burns the flywheel. I don't know and I wager Subaru will never voluntarily tell us if they screwed something up.

how do u like the spec clutch so far? review?

lol drifts. burn outs. Your next post: Subaru denied my warranty claim! They said it was abuse! I always granny my car!!!"

uh

my clutch holds 400 wtq daily

I think the clutch is the drivetrain's RE92, er, scapegoat. In a racing start, something has to give- it can either be wheelspin or clutch burn. Since there's nothing actually wrong with the RE92s, you're not going to see a lot of wheelspin off the line.

 

You didn't buy a dragster. If snapping off the line is what you bought the car for, upgrade the clutch. I don't think Subaru screwed anything up- they use fuses to protect electronics from spikes and they use a softer clutch than we'd like to protect the drivetrain from boy racers. My clutch is fine because I don't care to own that 0 to 5 mph zone.

if you honestly think there is nothing wrong with RE92s, you must have never driven your car in the snow...

they are downright dangerous.

Mine has trouble w/ stock hp/tq. How easy/hard is it to get stink w/ your clutch?

 

(Next person to imply my clutch is fine and my driving sucks can just STFU and DIAF right now. Been driving MT for ~20 years, have plenty to compare this one against, and this one sucks.)

weren't there 2 different types used between the 05 and 05.5s?

one DMF, one not?

uh

my clutch holds 400 wtq daily

 

 

yeah well my clutch can beat up your clutch:icon_wink

No real problems here at STG 2 but this clutch doesn't seem cosistant, I feel at time that I haven't driven my car before, if that makes any sense.

Just got some snow. It's my third winter on these tires, what of it? My first car was a 77 Sedan DeVille- with a Subaru I could get around just fine on rims.

 

With a little distraction I can get clutch smell any time, but I don't blame the clutch. If I were busily modding it then the clutch would get swapped early on (yes, tires too), but I'm not. I've been driving MT for 18 years, plenty to compare against. It's my first AWD turbo, though. More power and more drivetrain resistance than I'd been used to, so I noticed the clutch smell on day one.

I don't blame the clutch.

 

You must be very proud. Thanks for sharing.

what is your build date? my original pressure plate was crap.. replaced under warranty like a few others..

I have pretty much had to change my driving to eliminate slip. My rule now is just enough throttle to get rolling, FULLY ENGAGE clutch, THEN stomp on it. I've had the clutch slip massively once or twice and it freaked me out a bit (never had happen in a lower HP front wheel drive car). As others noted, with virtually no wheel spin (AWD) and lots of ponies, the clutch just can't take a lot of high rev off the line starts in my opinion.

 

Again, I wait until I'm fully engaged before I apply full power. If you want to drag race off the line from a dead start, get an upgraded clutch...

There really is no secret.

 

Stock Subaru trans can barely handle stock torque loads when driven aggressively.

In order to rdeuce the warranty claims on transmission failures, they use a "soft" clutch.

SOA would rather have you pay for a worn clutch then them pay for a failed transmission.

I have pretty much had to change my driving to eliminate slip. My rule now is just enough throttle to get rolling, FULLY ENGAGE clutch, THEN stomp on it.

Sounds exactly like the way any clutch should be used outside of the drag strip.

 

Ever had to replace a clutch?

If I get launch control before I get a new clutch (which could happen, as the opensource guys are already testing it), I'll be setting the launch rev limit to 2000, or maybe 2500. Anything higher would probably stink pretty consistently.

 

Is starting at 3k really too much to ask, on a hill and with a couple passengers? For TDC and Fat Charlie - would your clutch stink if you did that?

Is starting at 3k really too much to ask, on a hill and with a couple passengers? For TDC and Fat Charlie - would your clutch stink if you did that?

 

why would you start @ 3k on a hill?

typically mine wont stink

unless im bored and ripping up and down my lot

i still havent had any problems with 300+ wtq

 

btw thank you TDC for the 300+ wtq

So I just replaced my stock clutch with a SPEC 2.5. I also replaced the flywheel with another stock DMF due to a lack of after-market parts available.

 

The guy who did the work is not Subaru-affiliated and he said something interesting. While my clutch slipped badly, the disk was not worn out and the flywheel was badly burned with hotspots.

 

He advised me that it was his opinion that the pilot bearing was not the proper size for the bell-housing. It was effectively a few microns too long. The result of this was that the clutch never fully disengaged giving the effect of driving with one's foot constantly pushing the clutch just a bit.

 

While this did not matter so long as the clutch did not slip, it effectively reduced the torque capacity of the whole assembly, leading to a situation where the clutch would slip easier and ultimately burn the flywheel to the point that it would not hold and needed to be replaced.

 

Not sure if there is any truth to this or if it could affect more than just my car, but I thought I would put it out there as a possibility for anyone experiencing stock clutch problems.

 

This is very interesting because someone else (mechanic) had mentioned the same thing to my about my clutch. I have had clutch problems that were mentioned on other posts. However, I think this is related to the topic/post.

 

My original clutch went after 254 miles (day after purchase) after all highway driving. SOA replaced under warranty. The second time the clutch went was after 5500 miles (6 months) which SOA did not replace under warranty. BTW I do not launch or race/autocross. Strickly, 90% highway driving on the weekends. I rarely get any clutch smell after reading the posts on how to properly engage and shift this car.

Long story short (FYI), I just got a letter from my lawyer from SOA stating they would give me $1,000.00 out of the $1,500.00 I paid to have the clutch/componts replaced w/labor at the Freehold Subaru. Basically, SOA claims there were not any mechnical problems that would cause this other than neglect or abuse. SOA is giving me $1000.00 as a gesture of "good will." They are saying "You must have abused the clutch after 254 miles on the highway."

Also, I didn't get any slippage the 1st or 2nd time a the clutch went out. The clutch pedal got stuck on the floor between shifts both times. However, the 1st time the car was not drivable (shifter would not engage).

 

I feel that regardless of how careful I drive this stock clutch will probably go because something is causing the clutch to burn up prematurely.

 

Sorry for going on but I saw this post as I was opening up my mail and I thought it was related.