Subaru AWD Performance numbers

A random thought occurred to me as I was driving in the current northern California rainstorm this morning. It's probably not an original thought, so apologies if it has been raised here before. Also, it was early in the morning, when my brain is not fully in gear, so the thought may be half-baked. Flame away, if appropriate.

Anyway, I was thinking wouldn't it be neat if Subaru ran some performance tests in wet and slippery conditions against some RWD/FWD sports cars, competitors, etc. For example, you could get some 0-60 and quarter mile times on a wet track, and also on several inches of snow. I, for one, would be curious as to how well the Legacy or WRX would really perform, compared to other vehicles, in those kinds of conditions. For instance, could a Subaru outrun a top-end RWD sports car 0-60 in the rain? What about on a track?

There would probably be some liability concerns (about not encouraging reckless driving in poor conditions) but it could make for a fun marketing campaign, with Subaru advertising "wet" 0-60 acceleration. At the very least, it would be better than that stupid commercial with all the 2WD cars tipped on their drive wheels.

I know, very random thought...maybe I just needed an extra cup of coffee.

Hmm might need to discuss this one with the boys over at the watercooler to get their ideas but seems like a pretty good one for mine. They might call dry runs 0 - 60/100 reckless too but this is looking at the cars performance in all conditions. For mine, I know the Scoob can run against 98% of most cars in the wet at the track and will get off the line quicker than most.

Units not to tackle in the wet,

911 996TT AWD

R34 GT-R AWD

EVOVIII AWD

STi AWD

S4 AWD

Pretty much anything AWD or something with amazing DSC like the ///M or C6 for example, however u can have a lunge at most RWD V8's for example, as they will be left there spinning until their momentum gets them going enough for the tyres to maintain grip.

Ada///M.

Extremely good point.

Prehaps in the test if they had to run the same tyres including a control tyre, that might work as it would give consistant results.

Ada///M.

I totally agree aswell. Another great safety aspect of Subaru / STi and AWD.

Ada///M.

Extremely good point.

Prehaps in the test if they had to run the same tyres including a control tyre, that might work as it would give consistant results.

Ada///M.

This brings up another point. When you compare 0-60 performance and braking performance, you are usually are comparing vehicles with different tires. This is one of my biggest complaints about those numbers. "Oh look, car xyz has really bad braking performance". You have to consider track/road conditions at the time, driver's abilities, tires, etc. Slap a different set of tires on that bad boy and all those numbers could be so different. Why would "poor" weather performance numbers be any difference?

Rain racing.....go out and take on that 06 ZO6:lol: run him for pinks while you are at it:)

They should have a back to the future subaru commercial.

Marty - "But Doc we don't have any road to get up to 85mph."

Doc - "This is no Delorean Marty, this car does not need paved roads."

^ I know it would need some refinement.

Maybe they should look like they have amateur home videos of us doing donuts in an empty snowed in parking lot, screaming out a little opening in the window woooo! woooo!

and then when we stop and open the door this old old man comes out of it.

Slogan.

"Try the AWD Subaru! Get your life back!"

Maybe they should look like they have amateur home videos of us doing donuts in an empty snowed in parking lot, screaming out a little opening in the window woooo! woooo!

 

and then when we stop and open the door this old old man comes out of it.

 

Slogan.

 

"Try the AWD Subaru! Get your life back!"

LMAO, that was good

The current Audi TV commercial showing an A6 driving up a snow covered ski jump ramp with a footnote that the ramp is inclined at 37.5 degrees is a pretty impressive statement for AWD. Audi does not specify if the A6 is on snow tires, so presumably it is not. Maybe Subi should try ski ramp races (going down at full throttle). THAT would be impressive!

The Audi is on VERY LARGE STUDDED ice tires. (ice racing type...)

The current Audi TV commercial showing an A6 driving up a snow covered ski jump ramp with a footnote that the ramp is inclined at 37.5 degrees is a pretty impressive statement for AWD. Audi does not specify if the A6 is on snow tires, so presumably it is not...

Actually, in the fine print at the end of the commercial at the bottom of the screen it states that car has ice tires and is the European spec model, I believe. The first couple of times I saw it I was thinking they have to tell the truth here! Then I got real close and read the fine print.

I think AWD would most likely help the average driver in the wet...but with regards to driving fast in the rain, I think AWD is likely not as big of a factor....at least on a roadcourse. I started to believe this more after watching a race on SpeedChannel back in 2003 - Bill Auberlin and Hans Stuck finished 1&3 in their RWD PTG M3 at Lime Rock in the pouring rain...in front of the AWD Audi RS6s....the Audis were passed in the rain and never re-gained it again...driving fast in the rain takes skill. It's more driver than car, IMO.

http://www.world-challenge.com/news/images/03-lrp-gtr-7_360.jpg

http://www.world-challenge.com/news/03press105.html

"Pobst and the Champion Audi team finally got their wish, praying for “liquid sunshine” for years to utilize their quattro all-wheel-drive system in a rain race scenario. It was not to be the result they looked for though, with Galati breaking his suspension in a lap-18 crash in the “uphill,” and Pobst settling for second.

In the rain, things were not as good as I had hoped,” said Pobst, who took over the Drivers’ Championship point lead with his second-place finish. “I had quite a bit of hydroplaning. I just gave it all I had and tried not to make any mistakes like a few others were making. Then, Billy [Auberlen] was all over me. I was amazed at the grip he had.”

I think AWD would most likely help the average driver in the wet...but with regards to driving fast in the rain, I think AWD is likely not as big of a factor....at least on a roadcourse. I started to believe this more after watching a race on SpeedChannel back in 2003 - Bill Auberlin and Hans Stuck finished 1&3 in their RWD PTG M3 at Lime Rock in the pouring rain...in front of the AWD Audi RS6s....the Audis were passed in the rain and never re-gained it again...driving fast in the rain takes skill. It's more driver than car, IMO.

Ok but what if there is a clone of that skilled driver in the Audi, who do you pick the Audi or the BMW driver?

Ok but what if there is a clone of that skilled driver in the Audi, who do you pick the Audi or the BMW driver?

Good Question...probably the Audi Driver...Randy Pobst. He's one of the best...if not the best....and he did win the GT Championship that year in an Audi - which had a big engine advantage...4.2L V8 compared to the M3's 3.2L I-6

there was a TOP GEAR video of the Mistu Evo VIII vs. AWD Lambo Murcielago (sp?).. let's just say, the Evo was very VERY close in the track time trial run...

How's that for high-end dollar vs $35,000 for ya?

Good Question...probably the Audi Driver...Randy Pobst. He's one of the best...if not the best....and he did win the GT Championship that year in an Audi - which had a big engine advantage...4.2L V8 compared to the M3's 3.2L I-6

Actually, Randy won 2 years in a row with Audi (and I have met the man himself)... he's running with Mazda (6) now and he just didnt the quattro advantage to take out Cunningham (Acura TSX) for the Drivers Points race.. both cars are FWD.. Cunningham has been running the FWD platform longer..

I think when you look at that level of [professional ]driving, the driver's background becomes broad (meaning that they can drive anything with wheels).. the remaining portion of that will come down to the car to see if it's got what the driver wants.. when you talk to Randy, he will tell you that having turbos and AWD just makes it fairly easy to over take cars that are NA FWD or even some RWD NA cars due to standing starts and coming out of the corners faster (due to boat loads of LSDs pulling the car forward out of the turn).

If you get the chance to read "Pobst's Position" articles in Sports Car Magazine, he had an article [probably Sept/05 to Dec/05 issue, it's one of those] about racing in the rain.. it really came down to the driver, not so much on the car.. it's about the driver looking for traction on the track.. a car wont know where the good portions of the drier pavement will be.. it's the driver's job to point the car in that direction or area to get a better grip.. the car itself will do its best to use that drier portion of the track for its own advantage.

Actually, Randy won 2 years in a row with Audi (and I have met the man himself)... he's running with Mazda (6) now and he just didnt the quattro advantage to take out Cunningham (Acura TSX) for the Drivers Points race.. both cars are FWD.. Cunningham has been running the FWD platform longer..

 

I think when you look at that level of [professional ]driving, the driver's background becomes broad (meaning that they can drive anything with wheels).. the remaining portion of that will come down to the car to see if it's got what the driver wants.. when you talk to Randy, he will tell you that having turbos and AWD just makes it fairly easy to over take cars that are NA FWD or even some RWD NA cars due to standing starts and coming out of the corners faster (due to boat loads of LSDs pulling the car forward out of the turn).

 

If you get the chance to read "Pobst's Position" articles in Sports Car Magazine, he had an article [probably Sept/05 to Dec/05 issue, it's one of those] about racing in the rain.. it really came down to the driver, not so much on the car.. it's about the driver looking for traction on the track.. a car wont know where the good portions of the drier pavement will be.. it's the driver's job to point the car in that direction or area to get a better grip.. the car itself will do its best to use that drier portion of the track for its own advantage.

Thanks for the info...

I remember those standing starts with the Audis...it looked like they were shot out of a canon...incredible.

I personally only have experience on a roadcourse in the rain with a RWD vehicle...still have not had Legacy out on a AutoX course or a track.