Help: 93 AWD Legacy Wagon wont start

Hello, first timer here on the forums

 

I'm looking for any help I can get. I have a 1993 Subaru Legacy AWD Wagon. Recently it stalled going up a mountain pass, and it hasn't started since.

 

First off: When you turn the key, and try to start it. It has that grinding noise (metal-on-metal). All lights come on, Radio, everything.. but it doesn't seem to get to the engine. You can't give the engine any gas at all.

 

I tried popping the clutch, with reasonable amount of speed.. and it was no use. Tried it a few more times and nothing. After reading around the internet.. the noise given when trying to start made it seem like it was the starter drive. However, if I can't pop the clutch and start the engine.. it makes me think it can't be the starter?

 

I don't have much money, and it's an old car.. it's not worth taking it to a shop if it's going to cost a lot. So I am looking for any kind of help I can get. I appreciate it.

 

Thank you

If the starter is stuck on the flywheel, there's a good posibility that could prevent a bump start. I'd say it sounds like a starter issue. Either the servo isn't moving the starter teeth or the actual starter motor is shot.

Thanks for the help jonklein.

 

Today I replaced the starter. I happened to have another one because this past winter it wouldn't start one day, but it warmed up a bit and it started so I never replaced. So today I finally did.

 

I checked all connections to the starter after I replaced it too, got my roommate to give me a jump since the battery has been dead. Engine still wouldn't start. Now the noise it makes is a litter different though. It's no longer a grinding noise, it's more like a normal sound like when it just needs a little gas and it'll start. I still can't give it any gas, and it wont start at all.

 

I'd appreciate any help, thanks.

lost timing belt? I had that happen to me once.

well if it now cranks over, the next thing you need to figure out is if the engine isn't getting spark or fuel. to check for spark, pull one of the plug wires off of a spark plug. then insert a screwdriver into the end of the wire. place the metal shank of the screwdriver no more than one half of an inch away from a piece of metal on the engine block. make sure that none of the metal shank is acutally touching. have someone crank over the engine and watch the gap between the screwdriver and block for a nice blue spark. the engine should only have to turn over a few times for you to see this happen. the spark should be a bright blue to white, not red or orange. if you have spark, recconect the spark-plug wire to the plug. note, DO NOT hold the screwdriver while doing this, unless you like getting shoked by 20,000 plus volts!

 

To see if you lack fuel getting into the engine, first take off your gas cap and put a large funnel into the filler. put your ear next to the funnel, and have someone turn the ignition to the run position. you should hear an audible whine come from the fuel pump. if you do not hear anything, check the fuel pump fuse to see if it is blown. Btw make sure there is fuel in gas tank! ( no offense ) if the fuel pump comes on, and you have spark, but the engine will not start, something may be preventing the fuel injectors from being fired. take off the air intake hose, and spray about 3 seconds worth of carbeurator cleaner into the throttle plate while holding the throttle plate wide open. out the hose back on, and tighten the clamp. then crank the engine over to see if it will fire, or run for a second then die.

 

post your results here and i will try to help you further.

Oh thank you so much. I appreciate the help, and the instructions (much needed) as well. Thanks for taking your time to help me out.

 

I will check the timing belt, as well and try all your instructions Booch. Hopefully I can get it all figured out, but once again thanks for the help!

I'm willing to bet your timing belt snapped. It's a good thing that nothing will damage then engine when that happens. Otherwise, the more you turn it over, the more damage...but I digress.

 

Unbolt the timing cover and take a peak in there, if there's no belt on the pulley you know what happened.

I'm willing to bet your timing belt snapped. It's a good thing that nothing will damage then engine when that happens. Otherwise, the more you turn it over, the more damage...but I digress.

 

Unbolt the timing cover and take a peak in there, if there's no belt on the pulley you know what happened.

 

 

well if he did snap a timing belt while the engine was running, there would have been a greater chance of damaging the engine then. hes not complaining about any crunching noises while cranking, so im thinking the valves are not being damaged.

If it's a EJ22, non interference.... I had mine snap, and had the motor turning over forever, no damage.

If it's a EJ22, non interference.... I had mine snap, and had the motor turning over forever, no damage.

 

good point, still cant hurt to check for fuel and spark. but its easy to get that timing cover off and see if the cams are spinning/ belt is there.

whats the verdict?

Unfortunately I haven't been able to work on it. The battery is completely dead, so I need another vehicle around every time I do anything on it and between a lot of work and conflict of schedules I haven't been able to check anything.

 

Hopefully I'll get some time this week, thanks for all the help everyone. Oh and that timing belt isn't easy to get to, radiator might need to come off even.

you can pop the timing belt cover off to see if its damaged. to actually replace it sucks, checking it isn't too bad.

So I am working on the car right now.

 

Fuel Pump appears to be working, it clicks on just fine

Timing Belt didn't snap, it's nice an tight in there and when I try to start the car it's still just sitting there. Now could it be it jumped teeth and that would cause the engine not to start?

 

Hey Booch, when you told me to check the spark in the wires.. do you mean the coil pack wires? Like unplug it from the coil pack and insert the screwdriver in there?

 

Ohh and anyone think it could be sensors?

 

Once again thanks for the help everyone.

dont pull the wire off of the coil pack, pull it off of the spark plug end! fi the bvelt is still tight, most likely it didnt jump a tooth, but itis a possibility. let me know what u get on the spark and fuel test. the fuel pump may be coming on, yet the fuel injectors may not be getting controlled by th ecomputer to actually let fuel into the engine.

Damnnit I'm an idiot.

 

I just tested the wrong sparks I guess. Thanks man, I'll go check on the proper sparks now.

 

Aside from the fuel fuse, how else can I check to see if the engine is getting fuel? Is there a way to check for it on the fuel rail?

try manually adding a fuel to the engine to see if it will run. Disconnect the air intake hose at the end near the throttle body and spray about 3 seconds worth of carbeurator cleaner past the throttle plate while holding it wide open. Put the hose back on, and tighten the clamp. then crank the engine over to see if it will fire, or run for a second then die. carb cleaner is best to use instead of starting fluid, it has lubricant in it and will prevent any possible damage to the piston rings. gas usually does this.

I checked the sparks. I don't get a nice blue spark at all. It sparks pretty much like it does up on top straight out of the coil pack, Very little, but it does carry on a spark. So I am sure the spark plug is getting something. Could the coil pack just not be sparking properly?

 

Fuel pump is 100% working, I took out a fuel line and had it on pumping up some gas. So it's getting there. I haven't been able to spray the throttle because I can't seem to find that stuff in spray form. I am going to try some other places see if I can find it.

 

Someone else took a gander at it, and asked me about the mass airflow sensor. He said that could be preventing it from starting as well.

What do you think?

 

Once again thanks for all the help, much appreciated.

Did the 93's have MAF's? If so, that could be part of the issue. There should be a known voltage readout for the MAF (not sure if my manual has the 93 in it). sound like the coil pack might be bad though.

even if the maf was bad the car would still spit n cough when cranking. carberateur cleaner is available in the spray form at any local auto parts store. if the spark is weak, when u crank the moteor over, you are making it harder for spark to occur across the gap of the plug, basically the compression of fuel and air in the cylinder gives the spark plug gap more resistance. it may not have a storng enough spark to ignite the fuel/air mixture. do you ever smell gas when u crank it over repeatedly, you should smell it in the exhaust and the oil by now if the fuel injectors are working and adding gas to the cylinders. it will build up in the cylinder if not burnt and get past the piston rings into the oil. if you think the mass air flow sensor is bad, unplug it, the computer will substitute a know good value for it based on what other sensor data it is receiving. it should start and idle, but have poor throttle response when unplugged. i doubt it is the problem, but it never hurts to cover all the bases.

Throttle Plate was pretty dirty, but anyway I got the carb cleaner sprayed, tried it.. no luck. Engine doesn't fire up.

 

I went over to nappa and they want $150 for a coil pack, and no return if it's installed.. I'm going to call to see if they can test mine perhaps.

if you have a Multimeter you can test the coil pack yourself you just have to find what the resistance across the terminals is . you can try calling a subaru dealership and they can help you better test it then napa (Never Any Parts Available) could.

Check out www.endwrench.com

 

a lot of info there you may find relevant.

 

This test is from an issue that no longer shows in the archives.

 

O.

Coil pack isn't the problem. Tested, and replaced.. still the engine keeps turning over and wont fire.

 

I was told a crank or cam sensor is the problem, most likely. I don't know what the subaru's got.. if it's either or.. or both.. and how to determine which one could be bad.

 

anyone have any idea how to check these sensors?

Haynes manual should have their voltages / resistance values.