Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Here is a fun game where we all try and figure out what broke with my car. First, some back story... About a week and a half ago I developed a consistent misfire on cylinder #3. We swapped coils on 1 and 3, after that I had a misfire on 1 and 3. Thinking it was a bad coil and a fouled plug, we replaced the coil and all plugs. Still had a consistent misfire on 3. Ran a compression test which showed 100 on 3 and 110 on 1, which a local shop confirmed was normal at the altitude in CO where I was. Next we pulled the injectors on 1 and 3, when applying 12v power to them #3 did nothing and #1 clicked, so we replaced injector 3. Car was running again at about 95% of what it was. When logging it showed a misfire on 3 about once per second at idle, but off idle was fine. Thought the issue was fixed and went about my business. About a week and a half later and 1400 miles the car is locked up tight and sitting in my driveway. Today I cruised out to a local Cars & Coffee that I help organize, no issues. Cruised on home after, no issues. Decided to stop off to visit my friend Ben and see his new house. As I pulled up the hill to his neighborhood, it felt very sluggish and the ABS light flashed on, off boost it would go away. Hung out with Ben for an hour or so then went to leave. Car started up fine and idled fine, drove out of his neighborhood fine. As I drove out onto the country road home I tried to do a quick pull to see if it felt normal. It did not. As soon as I hit boost it fell flat on it's face and started sputting and backfiring hard, all the dummy lights lit up. Off boost it would stabilize and the lights would turn off. The closer I got to home the worse the car was behaving, applying more throttle would result in nothing but backfiring and no acceleration. The gauges inside the car were flicking on and off and eventually stopped working entirely, no illumination. I managed to limp it up to my driveway where it choked to a stop, nothing violent or mechanical sounding. I tried to start the car again and got nothing, no clicking from the starter at all. I checked voltage at the battery and got 11.2v. Connected some jumpers and tried to start it again, starter was clicking but engine wouldn't turn over at all. Haven't pulled anything yet, haven't tried cranking by hand. All in all pretty bummed out. Not really sure where to start...? '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Alternator go bye bye. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Why wouldn't it start when jumped? '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 *shrug* But that battery voltage seems to point to your alternator being dead. When your car is running, it relies on the alternator to power the electronics. When you go WOT, it switches over to the battery if I'm not mistaken. Battery dead + you going WOT = car acts like crap when you try to go WOT. As far as the jumping thing goes, I can only hazard a guess. If the battery is sufficiently dead like it is, and your alternator is dead, you would maybe get the car to fire up okay but it would immediately try to switch over to the alternator and die right away again anyway... BTW, how are you hooking up the jump cables? Not battery terminal to battery terminal I hope? Proper method and order to hook it up is: 1) red cable on good battery (+) 2) red cable on dead battery (+) 3) black cable on good battery (-) 4) black cable on metallic part of your engine block on dead car People never do the steps right.... this is for safety reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Jumping it per your description. At 11.2v though it should see *some* manner of attempt to crank, but there was absolutely nothing. Also to put a scale on this, it went from working fine to completely non-functional in about 6 miles. '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Negative sir. 11.2 is already 0.8V below the absolute bare minimum. A battery sitting at 12V when the car is off usually indicates it's already dead. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 In that case I hope you are right! '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 I didn't check voltage while jumping, and didn't let it sit and charge either... '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Hope so too. https://www.google.com/search?q=battery+voltage+car+off&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&client=firefox-a Pretty much everyone says with the car off it should read 12.4V. If you do get it started with a jump, the voltage should be 14-14.5V which indicates your alternator is charging. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 http://jgdarden.com/batteryfaq/carfaq9.htm#vehicle ^-- Note this section regarding specifically the battery: A vehicle charging system is made up of three components, an alternator (or DC generator), voltage regulator and a battery. Occasionally when a vehicle needs to be jump started, it has NOT driven long enough to fully recharge the battery. The length of time to fully recharge the battery depends on the amount of discharge, the amount of surplus current that is diverted to the battery, how long the engine is run, engine speed (RPM), and ambient temperature. An alternator is sized by the vehicle manufacturer to carry the maximum accessory load and to maintain a battery and NOT to recharge a dead battery. For example, if 300 amps were consumed for two seconds to start a car from a fully charged battery, it will take an 80 amp charging system approximately 10 seconds at 3000 RPM to replace the .167 amp hours of power used. If 25 amps are available to recharge the battery, it will take 30 seconds at 1100 RPM and at least 10 minutes at 750 RPM at one amp. With a dead 120 minute RC (60 amp hour) battery, it would take approximately 90 minutes at 80 amps at 3000 RPM and at least five hours at 1100 RPM at 25 amps to fully charge (100% State-of-Charge) it. People in general make the mistake of thinking their alternator will recharge the battery quickly after it's dead.... it takes a LOT longer to do it than they think. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Max Capacity Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Clean the battery terminals! How old is the battery ? 7 years is about max. I replace mine at 5-6 years/ Keep the terminals clean and greased so moisture stays out of them. How is the oil level? 305,600miles 5/2012 ej257 short block, 8/2011 installed VF52 turbo, @20.8psi, 280whp, 300ftlbs. (SOLD). CHECK your oil, these cars use it. Engine Build - Click Here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Battery is 3 years old, terminals are minty. Oil is halfway between L and F. '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostride Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Just my $.02 but on newer vehicles the alternator is not meant to charge the battery only maintain. So if the battery is dead or dying the car really wont run off just the alternator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 Guess it could just be the battery also, don't know why I immediately started with the alternator. I don't think that's correct Ghostride... where did you get that information from, about new car alternators not charging? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Hooked up the jumpers again, let it sit for 15 min. Started right up. PHEW! '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 Convenient that it died in my driveway! '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 What is the voltage you're getting with the car running? Bear in mind what I said about the battery not being charged from a short drive. It takes a LONG drive at highway speeds to charge it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 7, 2013 Author Share Posted July 7, 2013 12v before cranking, 11.8v dropped to 11.6v running. '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 7, 2013 Share Posted July 7, 2013 You should be at 14V-14.5V+ with a properly functioning alternator and your car switched on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 8, 2013 Author Share Posted July 8, 2013 Thought as much. Rechecked and the battery is 2.5 years old. Checked at O'Reilly's and they want $220 for a reman, available on Tues. They are the only place open on a Sunday at this hour. Will check the other stores and dealership tomorrow. '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 how-to on replacement.... basically the same thing. should be a straight foward job. http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php/subaru-ej-series-engine-alternator-replacement-151901.html best of luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 8, 2013 Author Share Posted July 8, 2013 Thanks a bunch man! '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iNVAR Posted July 8, 2013 Share Posted July 8, 2013 Also: #3 http://opposedforces.com/parts/legacy/us_b13/type_5/engine_electronic/alternator/illustration_2/ Not sure which part number is correct. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators BarManBean Posted July 8, 2013 Moderators Share Posted July 8, 2013 iNVAR is currently winning this thread--love it when a strange issue seems to possibly be solved in an extremely short time by another forum member. OP, hope it's your alternator--would be a quick diagnosis and a relatively easy fix. "Bullet-proof" your OEM TMIC! <<Buy your kit here>> Not currently in stock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Con.Harr91 Posted July 9, 2013 Author Share Posted July 9, 2013 New alternator made it right as rain for the morning! Felt better than ever with a strong spark. But now I'm back on 3 cylinders. Son of a... '03 Forester X 5mt - Engine Seized at 262k miles. '05 LGT Wagon 6mt -MotoIQ.com Project Vehicle '13 VW Touareg TDI - Daily Torque Monster. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.