I am fed up with this 96 OB's torque bind.

Cannot figure it out. I replaced the auto transaxle with another from a 98. Put a new C-Duty Solenoid and transfer valve from Subaru in the 98 transaxle along with a new filter and fluid. Take it for a circular test drive around our gravel yard and the rear tires are STILL doing the locked 4x4 two step. Stopped and put the fuse in the FWD socket and got half a circle and heard a loud bang from the rear end.

 

Put it back on the lift, checked the rear end fluid, still brand new, just drained and re-filled it a hundred miles ago. Nothing looks out of sorts. Is there another fluid other than what Subaru recommends for the rear, that I should be using?

 

I've never had so much trouble from one car in my life. Might be time to step away from the Subaru marque for me.

 

Tom

i think the first question is , what is the trans ID# on the original and what is on the replacement trans?

 

what car are you working on? i know you have another thread working but i can't remember.

 

the fluid is not the issue. as long as it has fluid it is fine. at least in the short term.

John,

 

I'm working on my original 96 Legacy Outback, with a newly serviced 2.5 in it. When I first got this car, I replaced the blown 2.5 with a junkyard 2.2 and removed the rear drive shaft to stop the torque bind. After getting a wild hair, I found another 2.5 that I serviced EXCEPT for milling of the heads. Big mistake. Got the heads off of the original 2.5 surfaced and re-assembled the engine. Engine seems to be running fine.

 

Found what I was told was a 4EAT from a 96 Outback, (turned out to be from a 98 Legacy Outback) put a new C-Duty and transfer valve in it, and installed it and my newly serviced engine in the 96 OB.

 

Original Transmission ID is TZ102Z2ABA-CH The Replacement ID is TZ102Z2DBA-KF

 

Tom

the trans numbers match so a mis-matched final drive ratio is not the issue, UNLESS some one swapped in the wrong rear diff. to test the final drive ratios:

 

jack up one side of the car, both wheels. unplug the largest connector on the rear of the engine passenger side, this feeds the trans. start the engine and move the shifter into N. mark both frontr and rear tires at the bottom, 6 oclock positon. and then rotate one wheel by hand. the marks on the bottom of the wheels should line up after every rotation. you may have to go 10 times to see a difference.

 

this test locks the front and rear wheels to each other, torque bind. if the wheels rotate the same the final drives are the same. if the wheel rotations do not match, the ratios are different.

 

fyi: some folks have been known to mistakenly replace the rear diff when they learn they have binding. of course it does not help.

I'm wary of the rear diff as well. Could be the wrong one. Do the test that John suggested.

 

Also, I am assuming you replaced and did a few fluid drain and fills when you bought and installed the new trans, right?

Kenny,

 

When I had the 98 4EAT on the engine stand to change the filter and the C-Duty, the fluid was bright red with no signs of varnish or lack of fluid changes. I put in new of course, and will change it again if I can get a couple of hundred miles on it before I go medieval on it's A$$.

 

Going out now to put the driver's side up on jack stands like John E suggested.

 

Tom

Well, Curses. After 15 revolutions the difference from front to rear is about 1/4".

 

Drat.

 

Tom

Disappointing, but at least you have more information towards a fix. Good luck.

Two weeks ago I could have provided you with a perfectly good rear diff for whatever you could muster up. But, alas, the parts car is gone as well as the diff and trans.

Thanks Kenny. We have lots of pull-a-part yards here. As much as I hate to admit defeat by a car. I think this is it for me and this Subie. I should have left the 2.2 in it and the rear drive shaft out of it. But NOOOO, I had to tinker.

 

Tom

Yeah, I know what you're saying. Sometimes it just time to quit and get out from underneath it. I just can't get away though. I got rid of my POS 98 GT and then I bought a 99 OBL with blown head gaskets and trans issues for $400.....

I agree, they are great cars; very well put together. I guess I just got involved with them too late in my life. Now I just want to drive, not fix.

 

Tom

They're great, as long as they've been taken care of properly. My 98 GT drove and felt BEYOND used. It felt like it had driven over 500k miles. My 96 GT drove like a brand new car when I got it at 152k. After I beat on it for 10 months and drove it 18k miles it started having all sorts of little issues. My 99 OBL still drives very smoothly at 225k, but being that old, it is starting to need a bit of work.

 

But, being sick and tired of constantly working on my cars, I bought an 04 Honda Accord EX 6MT coupe with 98k miles on it. It's a perfect DD, while the 99 is now my little side project.

They're great, as long as they've been taken care of properly.

 

But, being sick and tired of constantly working on my cars, I bought an 04 Honda Accord EX 6MT coupe with 98k miles on it. It's a perfect DD, while the 99 is now my little side project.

 

 

Those two sentences there are words of wisdom. Or for those that are age virgins, WORD.

 

Tom

Hello Tom;

Did you remove the rear diff inspection plate and look at the spyder gears? Dragging or locked parking brake? Bad hub bearings? Steven.

Steven,

 

No, I didn't remove the inspection plate (I assume you mean the rear cover). I've drained and re-filled the diff twice now, eventhough the first fluid looked brand new. The parking brake is not dragging because I have to push it around the shop and yard quite a bit and it is quite easy for me to do. The brake does work quite well because I left it on once and vehicle wouldn't move at all.

 

When I jack up the car, the wheels turn smoothly and quietly, with no sound or vibrations coming from the bearings.

 

If I take the rear cover off of the Diff, what am I looking for?

 

Tom

Hello Tom;

Get the car jacked up and on blocks or good jack stands and inspect the pinon shaft for any looseness. Then pull the rear cover and look at the ring gear for any abnormal wear. The ring gear is mounted on the carrier that is mounted on two timken bearings, one on each side. The carrier housing contains the spyder gears. Should be two large holes cut out to see these. There is four gears, two are on a verticle shaft, the other two are for each axle. Check for wear and play on the shaft. Grab the axles and twist against each other to see if the gears are flopping around. Steven.

Steven,

 

Thanks. I've already checked the pinion shaft when I had the rear driveshaft off, tight as can be, no forward/aft play or side to side movement. Since the rear cover is also part of the diff mounting system, I am hesitant to go though all the effort just for a look-see.

 

I did notice that allthough new and the same size, I have two different brands of tires on the front as on the back. I did a diameter check when I first got the car and I know the air pressure is correct all around but I might go find a nice smooth concrete driveway and do a rolling circumference measurement.

 

Tom

Well, The rolling distance is a little different between the front and rear by .070 of a foot. I would not think that would make that much of a difference, but I don't know.

 

Front 6.685 Ft

 

Rear 6.615 Ft

 

Tom

Hello Tom;

I can understand the hesitation of not wanting to pull the rear cover. Just get the rear tires off the ground and and hold one axle steady and try twisting the other back and forth and see how much play is there. A little bit is okay but alot is bad, meaning the spyder gears are shot. I have read in here that all four tires should be the same brand, size, and wear pattern or you could have troubles. Steven.

Front 6.685 Ft

 

Rear 6.615 Ft

 

the difference between these is .84 inches, this is more than the 1/4'' or .25 inches that is the recommended allowable difference. in a mile, each tire rotates about 700 times, (less for larger tires, more for smaller tires). (0.84 X 700 = 588 inches or 49 feet.) this will cause binding when driving straight, but even more so in turns.

 

rotate the tires so one of each brand is on the front and one of each is on the rear. this is not IDEAL, but it will make the average speed of the front axle the same as the average speed of the rear. it may/ should HELP your binding problem.

 

try it.

Okay, I'll try it and report back. It will probably pull towards the bigger tire side also, eh? Maybe I should put the like tires diagonal from each other?

 

Tom

No, like tires go on the same side. Larger tires on one side only. The open front and rear differentials will give you a larger tolerance left to right than you will have going front to back.

I have a similar issue, but have not tried new rear diff fluid. I shall be doing one soon at work to see if that helps. I have a new front diff, trans, front axles, and a new c solenoid in the front diff.

Dang, You are a genius John E. Matching tires one one side and the torque bind is gone.

 

Lessons learned. Listen to John Egg sooner. Don't assume like size tires are actually the same size. Measuring diameter is not accurate enough to determine if tires are the same size. And last but not least: do the easiest checks first.

 

Thanks all for the help, especially John E and Kenny. The one brand that is the oldest, now on the right side of the vehicle, will be replaced with tires that match exactly the ones on the left.

 

 

 

Tom