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-   -   accidentally moved my boost controller! help!! (http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=198837)

Diavolo 12-29-2012 03:46 PM

accidentally moved my boost controller! help!!
 
EDIT:
Update: the problem turned out to be the hinge on the wastegate door.
its actually stuck! bound up inside the turbo.
the rod that connects to the actuator's lever seems to have backed out of the turbo housing.
likely cause is the wastegate hitting inside the downpipe (divorced plate) and pushed itself out of alignment.

the non functioning wastegate is why i couldn't adjust boost.
__________________________________________________ ___


so my car has a manual boost controller.
normally i boost around 17psi in warmer weather.
now that its colder my car is boosting MORE. sometimes as much as 20psi. i don't think thats good for it.
it is hitting 1.4 bar, an then fuel cut sometimes when i accelerate, at around 5500rpm.

i remember it getting up to 18 maybe 19psi last winter, but it wasnt a problem hitting a limiter if i romped on it. since then i've installed an uppipe and had an adjustment done to my tune. so maybe that made it more sensitive this winter? anyways...

i am no turbo guru, but i heard that in winter it (manual boost controller) might need to be turned down.

i went to inspect it before looking up how to do that... i thought the end part was a cap that needed to be taken off to get to an adjustment screw. FAIL! the whole end is the adjustment knob.

so anyways i moved it, and any reference mark that was put on it by the tuner has washed off.

how do i tune my car back to normal?
do i just turn the boost way down, and test drive it, and bring it back up until it hits 17ish?

i have an accessport.

thanks!!!!

Diavolo 12-29-2012 04:37 PM

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i turned it down, until my accessport said 17.7psi on third and fourth gear at WOT.
am i overboosting still?
i dont understand "target boost"

Diavolo 12-29-2012 05:08 PM

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so i turned it down a little more and went for another drive...

at full spool in 3rd my AP said i hit 16.9 psi.
so i thought i was good.

so i did another log (see below)
but after i logged it put it in fouth gear and went to WOT and it shot up to 19.2 before i got off the throttle. i dont even think it was fully spooled up.

Diavolo 12-29-2012 05:51 PM

i went to turn it down some more...
and realized it was all the way out. i cant turn it down anymore.
so i took it to log,.. 3rd gear it spooled to 18.4 before i got off the throttle... too high i gave up on the log.
4th gear i spooled up just to see, i backed off at 19.3

why am i hitting such high boost with my boost controller turned all the way down?!??

SpecBlitzed 12-29-2012 06:32 PM

I have read about people putting on manual boost controllers. I have an 07 with the SI drive I am guessing but it could have something to do with that. I am not an expert but the way the boost controller setup is done f

EJ25subie05 12-29-2012 06:33 PM

turn it down? are you tightening it or loosening it? idk what boost controller you have (but most) to turn your boost down you have to turn it counterclockwise to make the spring softer, not harder.

SpecBlitzed 12-29-2012 06:34 PM

From the factory works well. I had my leg street tuned and the guy that did it turned my boost up to 19 psi. It's winter now and I have had my problems. I remember him sayin something about adjusting the waste gate duty cycle. Figure I give some input if you haven't solved your issue.

SpecBlitzed 12-29-2012 06:36 PM

Wow I hate using an iPod for forums. Correction I have had NO problems.

EJ25subie05 12-29-2012 06:36 PM

target boost is the boost that you may or may not hit. say for instance your tuned for 18lbs target boost but your hitting 17lbs or so, its fine but 18 is your max. anything above target boost is over boosting. thats how i understand it. i am no tuner, pm invar hes pretty good with these types of things.

Diavolo 12-29-2012 07:29 PM

Thanks for the input. I have a Hallman... it obvious which way is up or down cause it has arrows on the end and a + & -

its definitely down all the way and still overboosting.
i wonder if theres a leak somewhere?

http://www.iagperformance.com/images...age_01_600.jpg

iNVAR 12-30-2012 12:32 PM

Why are you using an MBC in the first place? Sigh. Go back to the stock BCS setup.

Kastley85891 12-30-2012 01:26 PM

Just hook a line from your Waste gate directly to the comp outlet and see if you make gate boost only, your Hallman may have the spring or ball jammed, remove it and rebuild/clean/lubricate it, also replace your vac lines with fresh while you are at it, they could have a micro split that is letting pressure blow through when stressed preventing psi getting to gate.

FYR - boost cut is usually set a couple of psi above your target, depending on your tune/wastegate % demands, you may well spike from time to time, this is ignored by the ECU IF it is a low enough level and a REASONABLE amount of time lapse.
Colder weather will make more boost due to air density and will create more engine load, with a MBC you have no ECU comps working for you, bear in mind also that giving it a foot full from low RPM will build boost spikes easier, taller gears will also induce overshoot/boost cut if not dialed correctly.

MBC have their place, I have used lots of them, also used and tuned 2 port/3 port and hybrid boost control configs, my last Vehicle I ran a 19.99 mbc as it suited my 'bang for buck' project at the time. Hallman make a good MBC but I have had to rebuild my own previously.

iNVAR 12-30-2012 02:19 PM

Quote:

my last Vehicle I ran a 19.99 mbc as it suited my 'bang for buck' project at the time.
I'm sure you know that on cars that one shouldn't just splice in an MBC and turn the knob and call it a day. That being the case, if the tune needs to be modified with an MBC already, as the OPs was, then there's no reason to put the MBC in because WGDC adjustments can be made in the tune using the stock BCS.

There are tons of reasons NOT to get an MBC, and only 2 reasons to get one -

1) Hybrid setup, which from my reading isn't a horrible idea, if not correctly. It's actually supposed to eliminate spikes pretty well since EBCS always has a bit of a spike in it due to the way PID works.

2) Laziness.

Kastley85891 12-30-2012 02:38 PM

I am sure you base your comments of direct experience in setting up your own vehicles in terms of hardware and tuning? as do I.
If not, then with all respect , you can not accurately comment on a subject you clearly know little about.

I'm not going to get into a debate, the OP asked advice, I gave some based of my 'actual' experience over a good few years of working on these vehicles, not paying someone to do it for me.

The Subaru boost control is a great tool from the factory, the ECU is very powerful, this is ample for 95% of end users, however it can be improved on for specific set ups/ power goals., this includes MBCs
Sure the OP does not need to change his controller but he has, its his choice and his car can run well with it, If set up correctly.
Unfortunately, the forums have a lot of mis information based of hear say.

iNVAR 12-30-2012 02:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kastley85891 (Post 4224541)
I am sure you base your comments of direct experience in setting up your own vehicles in terms of hardware and tuning? as do I.
If not, then with all respect , you can not accurately comment on a subject you clearly know little about.

I'm not going to get into a debate, the OP asked advice, I gave some based of my 'actual' experience over a good few years of working on these vehicles, not paying someone to do it for me.

The Subaru boost control is a great tool from the factory, the ECU is very powerful, this is ample for 95% of end users, however it can be improved on for specific set ups/ power goals., this includes MBCs
Sure the OP does not need to change his controller but he has, its his choice and his car can run well with it, If set up correctly.
Unfortunately, the forums have a lot of mis information based of hear say.

Just state facts. I'll throw some out there.
  • Hardware wise, the stock BCS can be replaced easily with a 3 port EBCS like I've done. Many options for this are available, with the cheapest being the GM BCS.
  • Tuning the stock or a 3 port BCS well requires more work than just tossing in an MBC and setting all the WGDC values at WOT to 100% and turning a knob.
  • Completely eliminating the BCS disables all the failsafes built into the ECU. If your IAM dips below 1 due to bad gas, you will still be producing full boost. In the OP's case, he hit fuel cut and should've thrown a CEL which on a BCS controlled vehicle would've dropped him to WG boost.
  • Completely eliminating the BCS disables the compensations the ECU allows for. The OP likely would've never had this problem in the first place because the WGDC temperature compensation table would've prevented the problem.
  • Partial Throttle Full Boost (PTFB) is a concern with an MBC.

As far as my own experience, I've never messed with an MBC before. Why? Because the BCS works well. The stock BCS worked well when I was dialing in WGDC myself, and the only reason I replaced it with a GM 3 port was for troubleshooting, and to also give me a little more headroom and control, and now I've dialed that in myself nicely too. And it's literally freezing cold out and I haven't overboosted despite my tune having been done during the peak of the summer 100F weather.

You don't have to get into a debate if you don't want to, that's fine. But it doesn't hurt for you to throw some facts out there too.

But don't assume that the person you're talking to doesn't know anything just because he hasn't done everything you have. I don't have to jump out of a plane with no parachute to know it's probably not a good idea.

edit: I also won't care if you decide to own me with your "actual" experience which you make it sound like you have gobs of. Seriously, it doesn't bother me in the slightest. If I'm wrong about something I've stated, correct me. I'll learn from my mistake and move on and I'll be smarter in the future from it.


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