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-   -   22T or 20G? (http://legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=194032)

monkeyposeur 10-02-2012 11:44 AM

22T or 20G?
 
As many of you know I am gathering parts to swap my 22T into my wagon. I'm not sure of the direction that I will go with the build and I'm not in a rush because I want to think it through and end up with something reliable.

However, I have been checking out 20Gs on ebay and they can be had fairly cheaply. In some instances I have found a complete 20G w/trans, ecu, and wiring harness for $1600. This has me considering going in that direction instead of building up the 22T. I could sell the 22T block halves for $600-700 just by themselves.

I have a few options with the 22T that I am considering: 1. Keeping everything stock (heads, ecu, etc.), but add a tmic and tdo4, which would be plenty of fun compared to my 22E. 2. Getting some wrx heads, ecu, intake mani, and using the 22T.

Option 1 would be the cheapest, but also the most limited. Option 2 would give me tuning options and would be even more fun. But option 2 would also cost about the same as getting a complete 20G w/trans from ebay (probably need a standalone, would the 20G ecu work?).

Anyone have any opinions on 22T vs 20G? Thanks!

DOHCEJ22E1 10-02-2012 01:38 PM

How about 22T block w/20G heads, 20G wiring harness, 20G ECU/aftermarket ECU, & having FUN with that combo? You can sell the 20G block & support your hybrid even more. That would be VERY CLOSE to the 22B engine. Just food for thought :D

subikid90 10-02-2012 01:49 PM

EJ22T with the 205 heads will be a tougher engine and probably be easier to tune/wire than the EJ20G. Of course I am kind of biased lol

DOHCEJ22E1 10-02-2012 02:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subikid90 (Post 4096752)
EJ22T with the 205 heads will be a tougher engine and probably be easier to tune/wire than the EJ20G. Of course I am kind of biased lol

Truth. With 205 heads & wiring, he'll be able to enjoy easier tuning & slightly more compatibility with later hardware/software but 20G! LOL! How often do you come across a 20G? 205s can be found in almost every junkyard in this country! Which makes the 205 more appealing...

monkeyposeur 10-02-2012 09:51 PM

Thanks for the opinions guys. As far as 205s in the junkyards I have yet to come across a single one and I frequent them often. It's probably because there are so many subie enthusiasts out here that they never make it to the bone yard. I've looked for 20G heads but have yet to find any. :(

As far as tuning the 205 route, are there base maps that I could use before I got it up on a Dyno? From what I understand a Dyno tune is $500-600 each time? It would be nice to be able to drive it to get tuned the first time without it blowing up, lol.

I think I can find a 20G ecu easy enough, and then get it Robtuned. But a wrx ecu is even easier to come by, and a lot cheaper. A wrx wiring harness is also fairly easy to find. I really want to use this 22T block if I can. :)

subikid90 10-02-2012 10:37 PM

I will have a base map for mine (already have it but not sure if it is correct till I have the motor running) that I can pass along to you. It should give you a start. I am thinking about doing a speed density tune, there is a local shop here, Synergy Tuning, that does them and guys are loving the gains. They will also have a dyno soon.

Dyno time is about $75-150 an hour depending on the place, plus $200 or so for the tune. I have noticed tuners like to work a little extra for different setups, aka EJ22T w/ 205 heads, because it adds to their base maps for other people.

monkeyposeur 10-02-2012 10:46 PM

The 22T internals are pretty beefy. I'd like to use them to keep thing simple for my own benefit, but aren't you planning on doing a stroker build? What are you doing for internals?

Kennyfvholla 10-03-2012 10:38 AM

Stay with the 22T bottom end, and maybe add some ACL race bearings throughout. Put 20g heads on it. Follow all that up with upgraded fun stuff like a bit of porting, injectors, fuel pump, etc. You know what I'm talking about. Also, make sure you get a nice aluminum radiator to keep it cool.

99legacyturbo 10-03-2012 12:47 PM

I have a 22t with 20g heads and I'm super happy with it way happier than I was with just a 20g. Your compression drops from 8:1 on the 20g to like 7-7.5:1 having the 20g heads on the 22t cause of the thicker head gaskets you'll need but you'll be gaining engine size going from a 2.0 to like a 2.3ish. So in my experiance I spool alot faster and have more torque with the 22t with 20g heads. And it really wasn't hard at all to find the right parts and the wireharnes I just made myself anyway cause I'm standalone. I also could send my maps I have one for 10psi and one for 20psi. Any questions you have about doing the hybrid feel free tO ask

SpecBamf41 10-03-2012 01:07 PM

what do you think about a ej205 and 25d heads? im having better luck finding 2.slow blocks then 2.5. only thing is trying to spool my turbo with a 2.0 might be hell

DOHCEJ22E1 10-03-2012 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Swagon_Wagon (Post 4098345)
what do you think about a ej205 and 25d heads? im having better luck finding 2.slow blocks then 2.5. only thing is trying to spool my turbo with a 2.0 might be hell

Do not use 96 25D heads on a 205. The 25D head chambers are bigger than the 205 bore. The 97-99 25D heads may be a more direct fit but you'd have to place 205 gaskets on them to make sure that the chambers are within the bore.

These are 22e MLS head gaskets on the 97-99 25D heads.
Note how the chambers are enclosed within the bore with a little extra space.
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w...ton25Dhead.jpg

subikid90 10-03-2012 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DOHCEJ22E1 (Post 4098461)
Do not use 96 25D heads on a 205. The 25D head chambers are bigger than the 205 bore. The 97-99 25D heads may be a more direct fit but you'd have to place 205 gaskets on them to make sure that the chambers are within the bore.

These are 22e MLS head gaskets on the 97-99 25D heads.
Note how the chambers are enclosed within the bore with a little extra space.
http://i172.photobucket.com/albums/w...ton25Dhead.jpg

^Agree 100%. You can use heads from a smaller bore, but you should have them matched to the bore. There are a few companies that do this with a CNC machine.

Quote:

Originally Posted by monkeyposeur (Post 4097631)
The 22T internals are pretty beefy. I'd like to use them to keep thing simple for my own benefit, but aren't you planning on doing a stroker build? What are you doing for internals?

Yes I am doing forged internals. EJ257 Nitrated crank, ACL bearings rod and mains, wiseco pistons, and scat rods. I am on the verge of having custom rods made or custom pistons. GSC S2 cams, BC springs and retainers, Supertech valves and shimless bucket conversion. :wub:

monkeyposeur 10-03-2012 06:26 PM

Sounds awesome subikid!

If I used 20G heads w/the 22T can I use the 22T intake manifold or do you need the 20G intake mani? Also, do you use 22T or 20G HGs, I would think the 22Ts?

99legacyturbo, what other parts did you need? Did you use the 22T coilpack as well?

DOHCEJ22E1 10-03-2012 06:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by monkeyposeur (Post 4098863)
Sounds awesome subikid!

If I used 20G heads w/the 22T can I use the 22T intake manifold or do you need the 20G intake mani? Also, do you use 22T or 20G HGs, I would think the 22Ts?

99legacyturbo, what other parts did you need? Did you use the 22T coilpack as well?

If you use 20G heads, you must use the 20G intake manifold as well. You use 22T head gaskets. Head gaskets must match the block because of the bore size.

subikid90 10-03-2012 07:48 PM

Yes you almost always have to match the intake mani to the heads.


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