evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Owner blew up the engine. Used car dealer bought it from Subaru dealership where it had been towed and traded.. has had the engine rebuilt by Subaru dealership techs. New crank, bearings, et cetera. 63k miles on it. Black on black, manual transmission.. all things considered and assuming the interior and exterior are in excellent condition, what should I expect to pay? I have a figure in mind... just trying to gather intel and thoughts from others. ...and if I put the AVO 380 on it, what other mods will be necessary? I don't want a bunch of power, but I do want quick spool and ball bearings... journal bearings scare me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 What caused the motor to blow? With the 380 you would be looking at needing fueling, TMIC/FMIC as well as a DP at a minimum. I would probably do a full TBE, PW TMIC, 850cc injectors as well as a DW65C fuel pump. Also think about what you're going to use to tune. Cobb AP or OpenSource? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 I have no idea what caused the engine to quit. I've not seen the car in person yet, either... I'm going on word of mouth. I would assume that the subaru techs working on it know enough to check the health of the turbo and the oiling system, and likely replace the turbo, the oil cooler, the banjo screens and even the lines... They've likely seen this a thousand times by now, too. Assuming all of the parts aside from the crank were in reusable condition and all necessary bearings have been replaced, as well as all oil passages having been properly cleaned of debris... which should all be done without question if the cases were split for any reason.. The engine itself should really be in as-new condition. You're saying the 380 is too big to even be functional with everything else remaining stock? For crying out loud, I just want a ball bearing turbo.. I need $3000 in supporting mods to make basically stock power with a larger huffer on it? You're telling me that the subaru's fuel pump and injectors are working at 100% duty cycle just to keep up with the factory turbo and they did not build in any overhead? That just seems stupid. I mean, I'd have a tune done (that goes without saying) but really? everything else just won't support the 380? OK, keeping that in mind, are there any bolt-on ball-bearing turbos that don't require me to sell my kidney to fund supporting mods? I just hate that the only options are A: stock sleeve bearing, or B: $6000 for anything else and a sh*tload of supporting mods. There's no area in between??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 So I have 2 choices - A: stock garbage sleeve bearing turbo or B: $6000 worth of whydidiwastemymoneyonasubaru? Is that correct? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 No. The turbo is probably new. I would verify that. If so I would slowly work your way up to swapping a 380. Start with stage 2 (dp plus tune). Buy used DP and do an etune. ~$500. Then as you find yourself wanting more, step up piece by piece. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 The question I have is this- Can I put the 380 on and get a tune and be safe? I'm not looking to upgrade for more power, just more reliability. If a BB has quicker spool, great. The tune will compensate for earlier boost. Will a stock DP and TMIC restrict the effectiveness of the 380 to where stock FP and injectors will be safe? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Well you can detune yes. You should really talk directly to who you plan to use as a tuner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 Will do.. sorry if I come across as rude, it's unintentional. I just had a buddy of mine split his turbo shaft and replace his vf40 only to have the engine lock up due to sleeve bearing shrapnel... and his brand new vf40 fried, as well.... talk about your horror stories. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 No I understand the paranoia. Do you already have a 380 or that's just what you're planning on getting? If not, there are far more options that have better reliability for much less money. If your just looking for reliability and don't plan to build up the rest of the car look at BNR turbo's. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 BNR? Will do. Thanks for the tip! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 The BNR website is kind of confusing. Do I have supply the vf40 to be built? It's obvious that those chra's won't work with a standard vf40 housing.. are they ball bearing conversions? which one will be a direct bolton without any other mods needed? The evo 16g looks like the factory flow counterpart... but is it ball bearing? I'm still inclined to go with the AVO 380... they say on their site that it'll work with stock everything. (A tune is obviously necessary, though) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 ..so what should i expect to pay for this car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 Why do you want a ball bearing so bad? BNR's stuff has proven good in this community. Look up what fits your car via his website. 16, 18, 20, etc. After buyin you can keep your vf40 or send it back for a bit of money. As far as what it's worth, you should fine more information on the replacement of the motor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 13, 2013 Author Share Posted February 13, 2013 Everything I've ever had with sleeve bearings has ended in catastrophic failure... drills, fans, washing machine motors.. you name it. Why should something that spins at 300,000rpm be any different? I mean, I know crank bearings and cam bearings aren't ball bearing.. and that's all well and good.. I just see it as a failure point. I'll be viewing the engine build papers as son as I'm able. Just assume that everything used is Subaru OE and assembled to original tolerances. What should I pay for the car? KBB and all that is well and good, but KBB isn't Legacy-devoted subaru owners that know realistic values on them. I really like my Impreza, but I need something a bit more refined and slightly larger. I like the LGT. A LOT. I have a limited budget. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 11-12 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
V8Bait Posted February 13, 2013 Share Posted February 13, 2013 The BNR website is kind of confusing. Do I have supply the vf40 to be built? It's obvious that those chra's won't work with a standard vf40 housing.. are they ball bearing conversions? which one will be a direct bolton without any other mods needed? The evo 16g looks like the factory flow counterpart... but is it ball bearing? I'm still inclined to go with the AVO 380... they say on their site that it'll work with stock everything. (A tune is obviously necessary, though) Just to clarify for you, BNR now has 2 options. You can either send them your VF40 housing or they can send you on of their new BNR housings with no core charge. They haven't put the new housings on their ebsite yet. You don't need ball bearings, The BNR turbo are a great turbo and spool very quickly. I just purchased the HTA68 turbo from them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 14, 2013 Author Share Posted February 14, 2013 Schweet. Here's my game plan... I know what the seller paid for the car. I have a rough guesstimate how much he's got in the rebuild.. I know how much he plans to make on the car. It's shaping up to be a fair deal. We'll see what my credit union has to say at the end of the month.... My FICO is a bit low, but income I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NWSPECB Posted February 14, 2013 Share Posted February 14, 2013 Good luck! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted February 17, 2013 Author Share Posted February 17, 2013 Gonna stop by and chat up the guy again Monday... I'll follow up... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted March 5, 2013 Author Share Posted March 5, 2013 So he had it out and about... said the valve lash sounded off and he'd have the car ready by mid-March. Engine out... shim the buckets... yadda yadda yadda. Seems odd that it would need the buckets shimmed unless he put it together wrong and hadn't laid out everything and kept the parts together in a super anal-retentive way. Not sure if I should worry. He is putting a warranty on it... Anyway, well that's nice. I stopped by the credit union and got my funding straightened out, so as soon as he says "GO" I'm in like Flynn... Assuming my walkaround/crawlaround/crawlunder/test drive/test thrashing goes well. I have a process to weed out bad potential buys, and it has not failed me yet... Here's hoping! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robitrice Posted March 5, 2013 Share Posted March 5, 2013 never assume the dealer people know what they are doing. Their job is to just get it running and available for sale as quickly and cheaply as possible. I would make sure you leave with some sort of print out or everything they did with the car and what was replaced. Does seem odd that that issue all of a sudden popped up. I would be very picky but i am also a paranoid car buyer even if its brand new off the assembly line lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted March 7, 2013 Author Share Posted March 7, 2013 never assume the dealer people know what they are doing. I'm not. This guy does have a pretty good reputation, however. He's the only guy around that deals almost exclusively in the local Subaru dealers' used car sales. (the local folks don't keep any used... he gets all of them) Their job is to just get it running and available for sale as quickly and cheaply as possible. He's had the car and been working on it for over a year. The only reason he's been doing as much on it is because I lit a fire under his behind... I'm just hoping that my motivation hasn't pushed him into any carelessness. I would make sure you leave with some sort of print out or everything they did with the car and what was replaced. I've already requested that, and he has agreed to provide it. Does seem odd that that issue all of a sudden popped up. I would be very picky but i am also a paranoid car buyer even if its brand new off the assembly line lol Well he got it with a busted oil pickup, so the first it's run since he bought it was literally last week. New crank, new crank bearkings, new cam bearings, boiled the block, new wrist pins, boiled the heads, new oil cooler, new oil pickup (I wish I had been able to provide him a killer B oil p/u) new timing set... I'm sure I'm forgetting things. Anyway, the whole thing has been gone over quite thoroughly by a qualified mechanic... I can see how a lifter bucket may have lost a shim here or there, so that's forgivable... just sucks that the whole thing has to come out to replace those. The maintenance history on this piece is complete, as well, and it was a one owner car from Indiana when he got it. Apparently it's had the turbo replaced more than a couple of times in its short 63k life. I'm thinking I want to put the Infamous turbo oil supply on it like pronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted March 9, 2013 Author Share Posted March 9, 2013 Is it possible that this car is dark gray and not a Spec.B? The seller says it's dark gray (I have yet to see it) but not a Spec.B... Was there a build-to-order option on these? I can't wait to pick up my car (assuming it's without any gremlins). I'll be posting up photos of it with my ADR Flite5 Black polished 17x7's installed. http://www.wheelseasy.com/images/rims/model_flite_5.jpg Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted March 9, 2013 Author Share Posted March 9, 2013 Added bonus... Sold my 258,000 mile '96 Impreza OB Wagon for $1500 yesterday... Sounds like a lot, but it's not. Very good car, it was to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evil03mustang Posted March 12, 2013 Author Share Posted March 12, 2013 Do I pay 8k for an LGT with piston slap? Do I fear that the new crank and crank bearings are improperly installed if the rebuilder didn't do anything with the slugs or bores? ...or do I just buy it and ignore the slap? ...or do I see how cheap he'll sell it with the slap and drive it anyway? I really want this car. :-( Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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