Merged: Official "Toyota to buy GM shares of FHI" Thread [Archive]

apexjapan

10-05-2005, 07:28 AM

I'm looking forward to the Subayota Imprelica Bb5x... ;)

Though seriously, it certainly wouldn't hurt Subaru to get some of that Toyota paint quality and interiors, plus it would be lovely if SOA would support aftermarket-type options at the dealers like Toyota does. Toyota also has absolutely top-notch marketing. And Toyota needs the one thing Subaru does have, a bit of passion in the driving experience. Despite all their market presence, Toyota has yet to make a car with quite the younger-crowd appeal of the Impreza and Legacy Turbo models (below 50, that is).

Cheers,

Paul Hansen
www.avoturboworld.com | www.sevenphotos.com | www.scoobymag.com

keith05legacyGT

10-05-2005, 07:35 AM

So I am guessing the 92x is permanently dead then too?

emulous

10-05-2005, 07:45 AM

I don't know if I like the sound of this, but we'll see how it plays out.

I doubt this is the end of the 92x, Honda and Izuzu had deals without ever holding stock in eachother's companies.

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 07:49 AM

Well, I like Toyota having stake in FHI more than GM having it.

Maybe FHI saw how GM's stupidity and total lack of creativity was only likely to doom them too.. I honestly didn't really even see why Fuji needed to share anything with GM in the first place.. I know why GM needed it.. thats self explanitory.

Edvig

10-05-2005, 07:51 AM

yes...the 92x is gone.

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/051005/autos_toyota_fujiheavy_gm.html?.v=2

BrownBoy

10-05-2005, 08:13 AM

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 08:37 AM

The partnership between GM and FHI always reminded me of the relationship between Bill gates and Steve Jobs.. one did all the work, the other one stole all the work.

To bad GM took FHI's tech and still couldn't turn a profit with it.. probably why they got dumped.

Pity GM for thinking that simply buying up and taking tech from companies that do stuff right was going to make up for their obvious engineering short commings, lack of passion, and sheer lacking of managerial prowess.

GM lost touch with making cars about 10 years ago, and probably won't ever recover.

Drift Monkey

10-05-2005, 08:40 AM

It's good news indeed. Maybe Toyota will grow some balls and make more exciting cars again...

Ok, ok, far fetched....:lol:

mach_six

10-05-2005, 08:42 AM

"Fuji Heavy also said it and Toyota would study business tie-up opportunities in research and development as well as production."

OMG. Our Legacys and the Camrys are gonna look alot more alike now!:lol:

too late, newer Camry rear end looks like ours or vice versa not sure which was first. I mistaken it many times cause the is almost the same color as mine.

IwannaSportSedan

10-05-2005, 09:06 AM

The effect on the legacy could go one of three ways.

1: Toyota could say that the Legacy is too much like a Camry, redundant, and move toward diminishing the Legacy in favor of the Outback even further.

2: they could just not care about the miniscule sales of the Legacy compared to the Camry, and do nothing whatsoever.

3: They could recognize that the Legacy is much sportier and faster than the Camry, and caters much more to the "Enthusiast". Recognizing that the Camry sells hundreds of thousands of units to non-enthusiasts, they could steer the Legacy into a more performance focused car, with sportier and more premium equipment for the Legacy GT, and with Toyota's lack of a performance division, (TuRD doesn't count. Someone should be fired for that Acronym, and it be scrapped immediately.) they could steer Subarus into those roles. Semi-Premium AWD performance cars, on and off road.

The WRX/STI is immediately going to be the sportiest car Toyota is even close to, starting the day the ink dries. It will be interesting if Toyota will do much to encourage more rally involvement, since Toyota itself was once a rally participant with the long defunct Celica All-trac.

The Lexus' are going nowhere but upmarket for luxury, Scion doesn't have anything in this segment at all. Toyota proper has nothing sporty in the least, and all FWD.

Subaru could carve it's niche as a smaller semi-independent Toyota-alternative to Acura or Infiniti, focusing on competing with the 20-40k segment, and let Lexus deal with Acura and Infiniti, and higher end Euro nameplates.

I won't say that Subaru could be Toyota's "Mercury" or "Pontiac" because Ford and GM don't manage those brands all that well, and Subaru isn't going to be wholly-owned by Toyota, like Mercury, Pontiac, Acura, and Infiniti all are by their respective parent companies.

Obviously I think Option 3 is the best, and option 1, the worst.

Just as long as the Subaru corporate ugly-face and the Toyota truck corporate ugly-face don't create the ugliest vehicle evAR!

QTwo

10-05-2005, 09:09 AM

Just read that GM is unloading their 20% stake in Subaru and Toyota is picking up 8.7% of it. The rest will be offloaded over the next several months. This news also means an end to Saabarus's.

I haven't read the tea leaves yet about how this affects Subaru going forward.

An interesting thought. Some people get the Camry and Legy mixed up from the rear. Do these cars morph together? Legamry, Camacy

BrownBoy

10-05-2005, 09:14 AM

The effect on the legacy could go one of three ways.

1: Toyota could say that the Legacy is too much like a Camry, redundant, and move toward diminishing the Legacy in favor of the Outback even further.

2: they could just not care about the miniscule sales of the Legacy compared to the Camry, and do nothing whatsoever.

3: They could recognize that the Legacy is much sportier and faster than the Camry, and caters much more to the "Enthusiast". Recognizing that the Camry sells hundreds of thousands of units to non-enthusiasts, they could steer the Legacy into a more performance focused car, with sportier and more premium equipment for the Legacy GT, and with Toyota's lack of a performance division, steer Subarus into those roles.

The WRX/STI is immediately going to be the sportiest car Toyota is even close to, starting the day the ink dries. It will be interesting if Toyota will do much to encourage more rally involvement, since Toyota itself was once a rally participant with the long defunct Celica All-trac.

The Lexus' are going nowhere but upmarket for luxury, Scion doesn't have anything in this segment at all. Toyota proper has nothing sporty in the least, and all FWD.

Obviously I think Option 3 is the best, and option 1, the worst.

I actually think they'll go w/ 2. Toyota only has a ~10% stake after the sale of the leftover stocks. They will actually be looking to codevelop the next generation of hybrids. Subaru will use Toyota's hybrid technology,and Toyota will use Subaru's new Lithium batteries IN the hybrid technology. I'm sure the companies will stay far apart w/ everything else. This will definately boost the value of Subaru, w/ stockholders knowing that Subaru is Toyota-backed now, at least a little bit. Def. better than being backed by a sinking ship, that's for sure. This will pan out to be pretty interesting I must say...

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 09:18 AM

It's been rumored that SOA/FHI people read this forum.
I just wanted to take this opportunity to THANK Management at FHI/SOA for dissolving FHI's "partnership" with General Motors Corp in hopes that this 'thank you' will reach those same people at FHI/SOA

I'm a US citizen, and my Legacy is the first Non US Big 3 car I have ever owned. At first I was happy that GM decided to 'get their act together' by buying tech from what I consider to be one of the preimer manufacturers of autos. Unfortunately, as is typical of GM, they squandered the opportunity and have little to show as a result of the partnership with FHI.
I feel that GM's involvment with FHI only exposed the glaring problems that GM has been facing now for decades..and has done nothing to resolve. In the same light, the view of FHI / Subaru became more evident, that they indeed know what it takes to make cars right and satisfy their customers.

I'm glad that FHI wasn't bullied or cohersed by GM.
Thanks FHI/SOA for making the right choice!

IwannaSportSedan

10-05-2005, 09:19 AM

Maybe Subaru will actually benefit from Toyota's supply chain, and get better quality switches, and other small component parts. That could be the real help.

eles1

10-05-2005, 09:20 AM

I don't know, but I would definitely prefer to have Toyota rather than GM influencing FHI.

eles1

10-05-2005, 09:23 AM

I was under the impression that GM simply sold their stock (20% share) in FHI?? I didn't think FHI had anything to do with the decision.

Is that not the case?

Perhaps you should be thanking GM...

Trevmiesterj

10-05-2005, 09:25 AM

From what I have read, the GM and Fuji will continue to collaborate on the Saab 9-2x, but all other projects will end.

I think this is a good move for Fuji Heavy-the technology and race savvy that Toyota can bring to them may start to affect the direction Subaru goes in. I just hope that production doesn't suffer as Toyota starts to take over resources to sell it's insanely hot (meaning coveted) cars right now.

Is this the beginnings of a Toybaru?

BoxerGT2.5

10-05-2005, 09:32 AM

God I hope Toyota Keeps the RE92's. We love them! :D

franklin

10-05-2005, 09:34 AM

I don't know, but I would definitely prefer to have Toyota rather than GM influencing FHI.
+1 Could be better for us than GM . Maybe some better things with Toyota

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 09:34 AM

I read one article that makes it sound that way, read another one that said quote un quote that FHI ended the partnership.. Of course GM and American publications are going to spin it their way.. I honestly think it was FHI.. either way, it was a good move and I'm glad for it.

NYCdob

10-05-2005, 09:35 AM

Toyota will bring Hybrid tech into play with subaru. Thas why everyone wants to get down with Toyota.

*Jedimaster*

10-05-2005, 09:42 AM

Cool- Twin turbo boxer powered Supra clone! :lol:

eles1

10-05-2005, 09:44 AM

Cool- Twin turbo boxer powered Supra clone! :lol:

Or an AWD Echo :lol:

fzanetti

10-05-2005, 09:48 AM

Or even maybe a hybrid line of Toybarus!! heheheheehehh

Flavio Zanetti
Boston, MA

The B4

10-05-2005, 10:02 AM

Source?

Claw

10-05-2005, 10:04 AM

God I hope Toyota Keeps the RE92's. We love them! :D

They use RE92's too.. my Celica had them.. their Camrys use them.

franklin

10-05-2005, 10:09 AM

I actually think they'll go w/ 2. Toyota only has a ~10% stake after the sale of the leftover stocks. They will actually be looking to codevelop the next generation of hybrids. Subaru will use Toyota's hybrid technology,and Toyota will use Subaru's new Lithium batteries IN the hybrid technology. I'm sure the companies will stay far apart w/ everything else. This will definately boost the value of Subaru, w/ stockholders knowing that Subaru is Toyota-backed now, at least a little bit. Def. better than being backed by a sinking ship, that's for sure. This will pan out to be pretty interesting I must say...
This would make sense. Toyota is the Hybrid leader and the batteries are the bottleneck.

twisted

10-05-2005, 10:15 AM

I don't know, but I would definitely prefer to have Toyota rather than GM influencing FHI.

i'm not so sure thats a good idea cuz toyota honchos tend to go conservative in terms of styling which means that future subaru products could be very bland

plus toyota recently cancelled the Matrix and celica ofr next year ...those were the only 2 sporty offerings they had in the first place...instead they shud have gone back to toyota rally days and slapped the celica with an awd and a turbo...now the sportiest thing u can get from toyota is the ...um corolla???!!!!

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 10:44 AM

Toyota will own what? 8% of FHI's stock..

It's not a 50/50 merger.. I don't think Toyota is going to have much say in Subarus market direction and vice versa, and even less say over model offerings.
I take this as a partnership to help Subaru develop their alternative fules solutions, as well as market their battery technology. Both are priority items for Subarus R$D teams right now. At the very least this partenrship sounds like a two way road, where as GM was all one way, and on a dead end at that.

mach_six

10-05-2005, 10:55 AM

I would suspect this is for sharing hybrid technology. Why design your own when someone's already got it working.

QTwo

10-05-2005, 10:57 AM

Source - CBS MarketWatch headlines

Don9992

10-05-2005, 11:02 AM

So I am guessing the 92x is permanently dead then too?

According to the article: "GM will continue work with Fuji on one production vehicle, the Saab 9-2x, GM said. But other projects will end, including the joint development of a crossover vehicle, announced last year."

I guess the "Saabaru" lives for now, at least.

melayout

10-05-2005, 11:02 AM

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story.asp?guid=%7B18917D34%2D8BB2%2D404F%2DBA8A%2D 972E93065C67%7D&siteid=mktw&dist

NYCdob

10-05-2005, 11:05 AM

miles

10-05-2005, 11:17 AM

Did FHI buy the 20% owned by GM?

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 11:21 AM

GM is selling around 9% to Toyota, and offing the rest on the open market.
Now as I understand it, the move was mutually agreed to by both FHI and GM.

Again.. Good Move!! :)

gt_ltd

10-05-2005, 11:22 AM

hmmm... Lexus IS/GS STi... :)

Thrasher

10-05-2005, 11:26 AM

"Mother told me, yes she told me I'd meet girls like you. She also told me stay away, you'll never know what you might catch." Surrender, Cheap Trick.

I am glad that for whatever reason FHI is no longer associated w/GM. Subarus are wonderful cars, of far higher quality in both engineering and construction than anything I've seen from GM.

Didn't want my beloved Subaru tainted by its association.

eles1

10-05-2005, 11:41 AM

i'm not so sure thats a good idea cuz toyota honchos tend to go conservative in terms of styling which means that future subaru products could be very bland

Yeah. I hope the next Legacy doesn't end up looking like a Camry or something.

gt_ltd

10-05-2005, 11:42 AM

yes...the 92x is gone.

http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/051005/autos_toyota_fujiheavy_gm.html?.v=2

" All joint projects -- including global procurement, technology exchanges and development of a crossover vehicle between Subaru and GM's Saab brand -- will be terminated except for Subaru's supply of the Saab 9-2x model, they said."

nKoan

10-05-2005, 11:44 AM

Yeah. I hope the next Legacy doesn't end up looking like a Camry or something.

:lol: :lol:

nKoan

10-05-2005, 11:50 AM

I, for one, am incredibly happy about this new direction (as a big Toyota fan), but one thing that always chapped my hides was people seemed to think the GM/FHI deal was bad.

It was nothing but good for Subaru. It brought Subaru money (from the Chevy Forester, Saab 9-2x, Subaru Justy), cheap parts that were still well made (not made by GM ;)), and penetration into markets they would otherwise be closed from. Subaru benefited 100% from the GM deal, but GM didn't fare as well, which is why they are selling off the stock at half the market value to Toyota.

It was a business deal, not a technology deal, and in the world of business, Subaru came out on top of the GM/FHI deal.

Yukonart

10-05-2005, 11:50 AM

:D

http://www.legacygt.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19983

Trevmiesterj

10-05-2005, 12:06 PM

I actually like the Toyota Matrix. I don't know why, because in a way, the thing is kinda dopey, but cool. :rolleyes: I was looking at it for a while. I liked the price, there was an AWD version and the gas mileage was pretty decent. However, lack of power in the AWD version (123 hp:eek:) and inability to actually get one (the Matrix is *flying* out of dealerships these days) kinda put me off. And I just didn't feel confident enough in the AWD system compared to the Soob system.

But you turbo up one of those and perhaps put in sym AWD, and I might just be back at the local Toy shop dropping a deposit.

Speculation is so fun...

PGT

10-05-2005, 12:06 PM

four threads merged - let's keep all the comments here please.

PGT

10-05-2005, 12:07 PM

added a sticky...

PGT

10-05-2005, 12:15 PM

GM just can't get it figured out, that much is clear. They have/had tech or manufacturing relationships with: Toyota, Honda, Subaru and Isuzu. What good has come of it except for the Pontiac Vibe, Saab 9-2X or Saturn VUE Redline?

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 12:39 PM

Well, it's obvious that GM's issues are not completely engineering based.. a large part of it is their out of touch management.

A family friend of mine has spent the last 4 years engineering parts for the H3.
When asked "how's the H3 going to do" his reply was "Not well, my bosses are very worried".

Also Patagonian... I wouldn't exactly call the VUE "good" I looked at one and it's a typical GM car..plastic crap. In fact, I was extremely disappointed by Saturns latest offerings. I also hear that Ion RL is a total peice of crap. Vibe.. ROFL.. I looked at those too when I was after my Leggy.. say this, I got my Leggy for about 2 grand more than what a basic vibe would'a run me. And it's not 1/4 the car the Leggy is.

9-2X was the ONLY good thing that came of the GM-FHI merger.

PGT

10-05-2005, 12:41 PM

Also Patagonian... I wouldn't exactly call the VUE "good" I looked at one and it's a typical GM car..plastic crap.

Note: I said VUE Redline....it has the 3.5L Honda V-6 and 5sp automatic. At least the drivetrain is reliable...

BrownBoy

10-05-2005, 01:40 PM

oh my god. I just thought of something. my mom drives a forester, and my parents like it so much, we were gonna buy the chevy forester in india, so we would have a car for when we're there...guess that's not happening:lol: when my dad and i first saw that, we were pissed! a chevy bowtie on a subaru. craziness...but it wasnt a bad idea. subaru had no penetration/market saturation, chevys/GMs are considered luxury cars there...so it worked out okay i believe. they are pricey compared to other offerings though..

Overall, I believe that Toyota may not try to give too much input, b/c that could hurt some of their sales if they make Subaru too efficient, competitive, etc. The better suppliers will be there, the (hopefully) better fiscal planning will be suggested, and Subaru will free up more money for offering us REAL limited run cars like Legacy STis..WRX STi Spec Cs..etc:D

PGT

10-05-2005, 01:44 PM

Toyota is a BEHEMOTH compared to Subaru. They wouldn't be worried for a minute that they would cut into sales at all. Totally different market segments....

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 01:54 PM

That and Toyota really doesn't have a true everyday 'performance' car anymore without Celica or Supra. Although it is rumored that they are developing a new Supra..I doubt it'll be any sort of direct competition for Subaru.

praedet

10-05-2005, 02:04 PM

S2000

The B4

10-05-2005, 02:11 PM

10% is not a big deal...either Suzuki or Isuzu has a 4% stake or something like that in Subaru. I think this will give Subaru access to Toyota's supply chain and Hybrid tech. In return Toyota will get access to the lithium battery.

PGT

10-05-2005, 02:27 PM

S2000

You mean the Honda product, or are you referring to the old 2000GT?

mbacis

10-05-2005, 02:36 PM

Note: I said VUE Redline....it has the 3.5L Honda V-6 and 5sp automatic. At least the drivetrain is reliable...

The only difference in the redline is the suspension and some ricey exterior parts, drivetrain/tranny is identical. I own a V6 AWD Vue (non-redline) with the Honda engine. As for the "plastic crap" comment by Drakuun, if you're referring to the body panels they are the second best thing about the vehicle (1st being the engine). I absolutely love being able to bang the crap out the thing without any repercussions. Whereas my Legacy has unexplicable dents in it. If you were referring to the interior plastic, I agree wholeheartedly, cheap as can be. Their excuse for AWD sucks too.

Drakuun

10-05-2005, 02:53 PM

The only difference in the redline is the suspension and some ricey exterior parts, drivetrain/tranny is identical. I own a V6 AWD Vue (non-redline) with the Honda engine. As for the "plastic crap" comment, if you're referring to the body panels they are the second best thing about the vehicle (1st being the engine). I absolutely love being able to bang the crap out the thing without any repercussions. Whereas my Legacy has unexplicable dents in it. If you were referring to the interior plastic, I agree wholeheartedly, cheap as can be. Their excuse for AWD sucks too.

Yeah their body panel tech is very nice I admit, I agree, it's one of the best things they got going for them.. Interior is where I was instantly turned off by the VUE. I was helping my Sister look for a new SUV or Car and we were looking at VUE's and Ions, and left very very unimpressed. Not long after I got to take a ride in a Cobolt and was equally unimpressed.

PGT

10-05-2005, 03:35 PM

The only difference in the redline is the suspension and some ricey exterior parts, drivetrain/tranny is identical. I own a V6 AWD Vue (non-redline) with the Honda engine. As for the "plastic crap" comment, if you're referring to the body panels they are the second best thing about the vehicle (1st being the engine). I absolutely love being able to bang the crap out the thing without any repercussions. Whereas my Legacy has unexplicable dents in it. If you were referring to the interior plastic, I agree wholeheartedly, cheap as can be. Their excuse for AWD sucks too.

NOTE: I didn't say 'plastic crap' - someone else did, and they were referring to the interior, which like all GM is very much plastic crap.

eles1

10-05-2005, 05:11 PM

Toyota is a BEHEMOTH compared to Subaru. They wouldn't be worried for a minute that they would cut into sales at all. Totally different market segments....

Yeah. Toyota's on the verge of overtaking Ford for the #2 spot among automakers - if they haven't already.

Lil_Sol

10-05-2005, 05:11 PM

ooo camry Sti.... Echo Sti.. or TRD impreza... supercharged sti

IwannaSportSedan

10-05-2005, 08:59 PM

If any Subaru vehicle get the TRD moniker, that'll be the end.

As I said before, whoever came up with that acronym (T*u*RD) should be sacked, and that name canceled and re-developed.

I beleive I already mentioned that Subaru could be a collaborator with Toyota to produce some performance that Toyota is SORELY lacking, and I think they have noticed that.

No more MR2. (Second Gen coupe was the best) No More Celica after how many decades. No more supra for a while now. CERTAINLY nothing in the vein of the 2000GT since.

With "the Coupe" coming back, Subaru could be Toyota's business vehicle/collaborator to sell a couple of performance coupes in a slightly higher category than the tC.

With rumors of the upcoming Supra (if anything ever comes of it) it could be significantly north of M3 territory, pricewise at the very least. Toyota HAS nothing, and isn't looking to GET anything in the 20-35k price bracket (aside from maybe a base IS250) with any sort of performance.

The WRX, WRX STI, and Legacy GT are already there. An Impreza coupe, and a Legacy-based SVX replacement GT fastback could be a real plug for the huge gaping hole in Toyota's lineup, and with some marketing, and supplier/infrastructure assistance from Toyota, it could be beneficial for both.

Even with only a small fraction of interest, one would thing synergies would expand beyond "hybrid" drive systems. The world doesn't revolve around that, just yet.

Scotty

10-06-2005, 01:07 AM

GM does have a partnership with Toyota so it really doesn't change much. Toyota's NUUMI plant is a partnership with GM. The Toyota Matrix and Pontiac Vibe are both built on the same production line. There's also the more complicated relationship with the GM-Vauxhall-Lotus-Toyota-Saturn car that will be here in the near future. So it really doesn't matter who owns who because it seems everyone owns a share in everyone else.

type b

10-06-2005, 01:52 AM

Am I missing something? If GM are selling the shares to Toyota and others, then FHI and Subaru will see none of the money. A Joint Venture is a joint venture - Toyota doesn't have to buy into Subaru to set one up and it sounds to me like the Subaru hybrid development is already a long way down the track and the Toyota input would be too late for this generation.
As far as I can see nothing changes for a couple of years at least, with the exception that Subaru will stop selling the rebranded Opel Zafira in Japan.

pdw

10-06-2005, 07:42 AM

The thing people need to realize about Japanese companies is that to have any sort of control in a Japanese company, an investor has to own at least 49%. GM had bought the 20% from Nissan in the mid to late 90's when Nissan was about to go under. Nissan had no real influence over Subaru's operations and neither did GM. That doesn't mean Subaru can't collaborate with their investor and I'm sure it helps grease the skids somewhat (like it did for the 9-2x).

I wouldn't expect huge changes out of this.

For an example of what I'm talking about, look at Mazda. Ford had owned a small portion of Mazda for decades but Mazda always acted as their own company. Then, in the 90's, Ford bought more and reached 49% ownership. Now there's all sorts of platform and engine sharing between Mazda and Ford.

jarrod

10-06-2005, 12:07 PM

They're going to make an AWD, 3.0 boxer engine, twin turbo.....SUBARU SUPRA WOOOOOOOO

93formula

10-07-2005, 02:46 AM

This will change nothing in the way subaru is run, cause toyota will have no voting rights and very little say in what the company does. Hell, gm had 20% and had little say. The will make some hybrids together. I'd expect to see a prius with a 70-80mpg rating with the new batteries and a subaru hybrid in about 1-2 years. Thats all I see happening.

skibum

10-10-2005, 09:02 PM

Yeah. I hope the next Legacy doesn't end up looking like a Camry or something.

or worse yet...looking like the front end of a Suzuki Forenza :rolleyes:

BayScoobie

10-12-2005, 12:24 AM

Isn't there rumors about Subaru developing a hybrid boxer engine with 300+hp

gt_ltd

10-12-2005, 01:03 AM

whatever they create won't be available in NA for a long time.

starlabs

10-17-2005, 12:17 PM

Looks like they might be making scion Tcs at the Indiana plant as well...

http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000200063626/

stanjk3

10-24-2005, 12:39 AM

Looks like they might be making scion Tcs at the Indiana plant as well...

http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000200063626/

That doesn't make sense, I thought I remember reading somewhere Subaru plans on manufacturing the next gen Impreza here instead of Japan.
Unless they will be based on the same platform.

shortlid

11-01-2005, 12:06 PM

I am so glad that FHI dumped GM for a GOOD partner like Toyota. Now I can buy a Subaru again!!!:icon_bigg

I bought the last SAAB without GM involvement to send a mess. to GM. Leave my fav. car companies alone!!:icon_evil

IwannaSportSedan

11-09-2005, 07:37 PM

News: It looks like the new arrangement is already being utilized. Hopefully a good car for Toyota, and some cashflow for FHI's designers. This from Autoblog.com Link (http://www.autoblog.com/entry/1234000767067253)

Toyota to outsource redesigns to Fuji Heavy Industries
Posted Nov 9, 2005, 8:00 PM ET by Erin Mays
Related entries: Economy
Toyota announced that redesign work for one of its current models will be handled by Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd., according to Japan’s Nihon Keizai business newspaper. Toyota’s recent expansion has put it into a position of not having enough staff to keep things afloat, prompting the company to utilize the resources of the Subaru maker. The model in question has yet to be announced, but the Nihon Keizai has its money on a “sporty subcompact.”
The link below is to Automotive News, which is a subscription-based site. We’ll post a free link as soon as one comes available.

I guess we may see what Subaru designers can do with a coupe... for Toyota... One wonders if it will be cross-brand elligible (designed to accept a flat 4 and Subie AWD... one can only hope.)

Can we say new Toyota Celica All-Trac Turbo, and Impreza 2.5 RS Turbo coupe? :D

2hondas

11-10-2005, 02:32 PM

GOOD screw GM- Toyota rocks.

johnny_m

11-23-2005, 08:40 AM

I didn't see this already posted so....

Toyota Considers Building Cars at Lafayette Subaru Plant

Toyota Motor Corp. is considering using excess capacity at Subaru of America's Lafayette plant to expand its U.S. auto manufacturing, according to The Wall Street Journal.
Last month, Toyota paid $315 million to buy General Motors Corp.'s 20-percent stake in Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd., which owns the Lafayette Subaru plant.
The plant can produce about 260,000 cars and trucks a year but expects to build only 120,400 this year. The idle capacity would provide Toyota with a quick, low-cost way to add vehicle-assembly capacity in the United States, the newspaper said.
It said Toyota is "looking seriously at" at using the plant and has sent engineers to inspect it. The plant currently employs about 2,700 workers.

(source: http://www.wishtv.com/Global/story.asp?S=4116073)

Ninjapimp

11-23-2005, 02:33 PM

I saw the same thing, but it sounded more definite in my article...

Toyota quickens quest to unseat GM (e)

Toyota is quickening its quest to unseat ailing rival General Motors as the world's biggest automaker with reported plans to start manufacturing up to 100,000 Toyota vehicles at a Subaru factory in Indiana. Word of Toyota's ramped-up production schedule comes just days after money-losing GM said it will close 12 facilities by 2008 in a move that will slash the number of vehicles it is able to build in North America by about one million a year. The combined developments could help Toyota surpass GM in worldwide production, although it's unclear if that could happen because Detroit-based GM is growing rapidly in Asia. Toyota expects to produce 8.1 million vehicles this year, while GM expects nine million, according to Greg Gardner of Harbour Consulting, a manufacturing consulting firm. Chipping away at GM's lead will also be a new Toyota pickup truck plant scheduled to open next year in San Antonio, TX, that will add an additional 200,000 vehicles to Toyota's annual capacity. The Japanese company's output will be boosted by another 100,000 vehicles in 2008, when Toyota's new RAV 4 plant comes online in Canada.
(Canadian Press 051123)

sebberry

11-26-2005, 05:41 PM

Hmmm.. maybe Subaru should use that capacity to build that turbo H6 we have all been longing for... or the LGT wagon manual....

gt_ltd

11-29-2005, 09:35 PM

Saw this few days ago:

"The two companies also plan to exchange technologies and engineers in advanced technology, including gasoline-electric hybrid systems and Toyota may hire some of the 700 workers Fuji Heavy plans to lay off." (http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=10000087&sid=atD_twESfKh0&refer=top_world_news)

According to this Chinese site (http://www.autonet.com.tw/cgi-bin/news/news_view.cgi?qry=a5110210), there will be more layoff's.

Discuss.

shortlid

11-30-2005, 07:45 AM

I have toured the plant when I was attending Purdue University which is in the same town! NICE facility, would be great to see it up to capacity again after being mis-managed by GM.:icon_tong

2hondas

01-03-2006, 04:24 PM

Any other news yet?

suds2250

01-30-2006, 09:18 AM

I bold typed the good part

Toyota Revamps Camry to Compete With Nissan, Honda (Update2)
Jan. 30 (Bloomberg) -- Toyota Motor Corp., which sells about four of every 10 vehicles in Japan, will introduce a redesigned Camry sedan today to replace its aging model, which lags Nissan Motor Co.'s Teana and Honda Motor Co.'s Accord.
The Camry will cost between 2.48 million yen and 3.36 million yen ($29,000), in the same price range as the Teana and Accord. Toyota aims to sell 1,000 units of the model every month, it said in a statement.
Toyota, based in central Japan's Aichi Prefecture, has released the redesigned Estima van and new Rush sport-utility vehicle so far this year as it aims to increase its domestic market share to 45 percent. The last Camry model is five years old. Japan has one of the world's shortest product cycles and carmakers typically offer new designs every two years on average.
``Demand for mid-sized sedans is decreasing,'' said Toyota President Katsuaki Watanabe in Tokyo. ``But we think good models will still sell.''
Toyota may sell as many as 650,000 Camrys worldwide in 2006, including both the old and new models, Watanabe said. The Camry is one of Toyota's top selling models. It sold 593,000 units globally in 2005, down 2.3 percent from a year ago.
Cash Cows
Models that sell more than 400,000 units a year for automakers are ``cash cows and as the Camry has been one of Toyota's oldest models, it certainly makes them a lot of profit,'' said Koji Endo, an analyst at Credit Suisse in Tokyo.
The company may also build the model in the U.S. at a factory belonging to its affiliate Fuji Heavy Industries Ltd. The two companies are discussing which models to build at the Lafayette, Indiana plant.
``The Camry is a likely candidate to be built in Indiana,'' said Watanabe. ``We are in the final stages of deciding now.''
The sedan comes with a 2.4-liter engine. A gasoline- electric hybrid version will also be available.
Nissan's Teana, equipped with a 2.3, 2.5, or 3.5-liter engine is priced between 2.4 million yen and 3.5 million yen in Japan. Honda's Accord, which has either a 2 or 2.4-liter engine is priced between 2 million and 2.66 million yen.
Lagging Rivals
In Japan, Toyota sold 4,868 Camrys in 2005, down 20 percent from a year ago, while Honda's Accord sales fell 8.3 percent to 9,282, and Nissan's Teana sales fell 28 percent to 18,884 units during the same period. The newest Accord was released in October 2002, while the new Teana was released in February 2003.
Toyota has sold a total of 10 million units of the Camry since its debut in 1980. The car is produced in Japan, U.S., Australia, Thailand, Malaysia, the Philippines, Taiwan and Vietnam. The model is also scheduled for production in China in mid-2006 and Russia in 2007. The automaker's Corolla and Hilux models have also each sold a total of 10 million units globally.
The Camry, which last year became the best-selling car in the U.S. for the fourth year in a row, is one of Toyota's top- selling models. Toyota can expect to sell at least 450,000 units of the model in the U.S. this year, up from 431,703 units in 2005, according to Credit Suisse's Endo.
Shares of Toyota, the world's biggest automaker by market value, rose 1.2 percent to 6,020 yen in Tokyo.

IwannaSportSedan

01-30-2006, 09:26 AM

Does SIA have anywhere near the capacity to make a dent in the 450,000 units they predict for the US, this upcoming year?

Either subarus will benefit from the increased quality control that Toyota will demand for even a fraction of that many units...

Or subaru will be drowned out by the demands of producing so many toyotas.

Hopefully it is the former, not the latter.

Jon [in CT]

01-30-2006, 12:25 PM

According to SIA's fact sheet (http://www.subaru-sia.com/Company/sia_outline.pdf), their plant capacity is currently 262,000 vehicles per year. According to FHI's 2006 production plans (http://www.fhi.co.jp/english/news/press/2006/06_01_13e.pdf), SIA will build 118,700 Subarus in Indiana this year.

Jedi Pimp

02-02-2006, 12:05 AM

Toyota: Lafayette likely will get Camry

Details remain unsettled, but plan could add 1,000 jobs at Indiana plant

By Ted Evanoff
ted.evanoff@indystar.com
Indiana could become a key state for Japanese automaker Toyota as it works on plans to bring a Camry assembly line to Lafayette.

A senior Toyota executive told reporters in Tokyo the company is in the final stages of deciding whether to put a Camry line in the Subaru of Indiana Automotive plant at Lafayette.
"The Camry is a likely candidate to be built in Indiana,'' said Toyota President Katsuaki Watanabe on Monday, according to The Associated Press. "We are currently in the final stages of deciding.''
The proposed deal could add 1,000 jobs to the 2,300-employee Subaru plant, Lafayette Mayor Tony Roswarski said.
If it happens, Toyota would have assembly lines in three Indiana plants -- something no other state has. Toyota's two truck plants at Princeton, Ind., annually can make more than 300,000 Sequoia sport-utility vehicles, Sienna minivans and Tundra pickup trucks.
"The talks are moving along seriously, but until everything is buttoned up it's just speculation,'' Toyota manufacturing spokesman Dan Sieger said Monday.
The main Camry plant at Georgetown, Ky., would remain Toyota's largest North American facility and would continue Camry assembly. It can make 500,000 autos a year.
Last fall, Toyota bought 8.7 percent of Subaru owner Fuji Heavy Industries, leading to speculation by analysts that a hybrid-electric Camry was coming to Lafayette.
The $1.1 billion Lafayette plant was opened in 1989 by Fuji and Japanese automaker Isuzu, but Isuzu's departure has left about half the plant vacant. It can produce up to 260,000 autos a year.
If Toyota takes on all the unused capacity at Lafayette, its Indiana production capacity would total 430,000 autos a year, ranking the state second in Toyota volume to Kentucky.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20060131/BUSINESS/601310395