USA members eat your hearts out... new GT for OZ soon!

[Robdownunder]

G'day guys,

Go to this link for some of the best news yet to reach our ears. In the paper today!:p

Rob.

http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,16293123%255E21822,00.html

[axis008]

Lucky!!!

[rfd425]

Wow, very interesting. Maybe by this time next year, some of us in the USA will be trying to bring our cars up to "Oz-spec".

[gt_ltd]

i knew subaru is an australian brand!

[IwannaSportSedan]

You folks down there had better buy up EVERY UNIT in record time, above MSRP.

Make this thing noticed at FHI Japan, and SOA. Get them to build this as a regular model, and prove the business case for them.

PLEASE!!!!

[gt_ltd]

where is ada///m?

[Robdownunder]

As soon as I get a sniff on it or any photo releases, I'll post them.

Rob.:p

[red beast]

well you don't get a outback 3.0r SEDAN.

which is kind of strange.

you would think they would put the higher one in your market (for running over kangaroo's) and the lower 3.0r sedan with the 6 speed here.

i think somebody screwed-up.

[Robdownunder]

:lol: Yeah I've hit the odd kangaroo in my time where my folks come from in the country.
Rob.

[red beast]

time for one of these..


http://www.ecb.com.au/model/Outback.htm

http://www.ecb.com.au/model/outback/10%2003%20ON%20TYPE%208%20SHT.JPG

[fzanetti]

Lucky aussies....

Heheheheheheh

I really wish SOA would put something more vibrant and to compete with an M3, new S4, in the upper 300's hp... but oh well....

Good luck and enjoy your new Liberty breed...

Flavio Zanetti
Boston, MA

[Robdownunder]

I've seen that ECB gear and it doesn't look any prettier. I'd prefer the 'roo hit than that POS.
Rob.

[red beast]

I've seen that ECB gear and it doesn't look any prettier. I'd prefer the 'roo hit than that POS.
Rob.


actually we need them for hitting pedestrians here in new jersey.

it's better to whack them off to the side then let the wheelchairs get caught underneath :lol:

[sebberry]

Possibly a turbo H6??? now I am geting excited!

[Robdownunder]

The latest update from one of my friends who has a 3 ltr on order.
Rob.

Liberty GT Limited (to 300)« View previous topic (http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24560&view=previous) :: View next topic (http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?t=24560&view=next) » AuthorMessageWhy

Club Member (http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/groupcp.php?g=10547) http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/templates/WRXClub05/images/icon_minipost.gif (http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?p=323221#323221)Posted: 29 Aug 2005 19:55 Post subject: Liberty GT Limited (to 300)http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/templates/WRXClub05/images/lang_english/icon_quote.gif (http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/posting.php?mode=quote&p=323221) http://img240.exs.cx/img240/7875/smb22tr.jpg
Impreza WRX Driver

Joined: 30 Dec 2003
Posts: 316
Location: Melbourne Zoo

209kw, STi suspension, 18inch wheels, Sti exhaust, manual is still 5 speed but short shift, no sunroof, wrap around seats (whatever they are) and available in three colors Obsidian Black, Brilliant Silver and i'm not 100% sure of the last one but i think its the Violet Grey....I'm sticking with the B-Spec

Cheers
_________________
Cant wait for the Liberty 3.0R-B Wagon to arrive

[Robdownunder]

I had a chat a few nights back with one of the STI Melbourne guys who is involved in the new development of the modded GT and he says the manual goes like the clappers big time he tells.:p

They are evaluating wheels as we speak, probably something along the lines of the STI OZ racing spoke design, new ECU, new exhausts from half way back to the rear, suspension heights and ride and spoilers.

That should be something special. October is Sydney Motor Show time so hopefully it will be there with the new 06 WRX STI. We are privvy to the release of the WRX rocket on the 26th Sept at head office.
Rob.

[jarrod]

G'day guys,

Go to this link for some of the best news yet to reach our ears. In the paper today!:p

Rob.

http://carsguide.news.com.au/news/story_page/0,8269,16293123%255E21822,00.html

More like eat your wallet out....

"It is priced from $52,990 for the manual sedan and $56,990 for the automatic wagon."

[sublibwag]

I agree with Jarrod....

while we down under get a fancy GT for $60,000+ americans can buy their GTs for around US$30,000 which at current exchange rate transaltes to arouns AU$40,000

[Robdownunder]

Guys,

Here is the latest news from downunder re the GT.
Rob.
http://www.wrx.com.au/forum/viewtopic.php?t=25755&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0

[IwannaSportSedan]

Interesting article...One wonders if the upcoming revision of the Liberty (Legacy) GT in austrailia will get the US LGT's tune of the 2.5 motor. Somehow I doubt it will keep the twin-scroll turbo, which is probably the caveat with the emissions laws.

They mention visual, interior and standard equipment upgrades for '07.

Might be interesting to keep an eye out for.

[Mo_GT]

Hmmm...I don't think we'd get this for for 5 grand more would we?

This is the JDM STI tuned GT. It has : Brembo's, STI braided brake hoses, lowered springs, mufflers, pillow ball lateral links, 18" wheels, spoilers, strut brace etc

Interior:
http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/LEGACY/catalog/interior/01/imgs/top_01.jpg


Exterior :
http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/LEGACY/catalog/exterior/imgs/top.jpg

For the extra 5 grand and 10KW, I think all we'll get would be the lowered springs, spoilers, mufflers and a minor retune of the ecu...


Bye,
Mo

[Robdownunder]

As soon as I see anything on it in reality, you guys will be the first to know.

Rob.

[agctr]

I have personally spoken with the MD of SoAU and he is truly excited about the launch. Cant say too much more but stay posted...................

WATCH THIS SPACE.

Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

I have personally spoken with the MD of SoAU and he is truly excited about the launch. Cant say too much more but stay posted...................

WATCH THIS SPACE.

Ada///M.

Launch of the STi GT? or the aust built "special edition" ?

[agctr]

LibertySTi Aussie Built Ed.

Still no specific specs that I can talk about other than what has been spoken about previously although all will be revealed soon enough.
Ada///M.

[rfd425]

LibertySTi Aussie Built Ed.

Still no specific specs that I can talk about other than what has been spoken about previously although all will be revealed soon enough.
Ada///M.

Aww, c'mon...throw us a bone...tell us one little thing (or give us a hint) that's not yet known to the general public.:D

[Mo_GT]

I'm willing to bet that the Aust built car is going to have about retail 5grand of parts (from their exisiting Sti parts bin), replacing the std stuff and thats about it...


Bye,
Mo

[rfd425]

I can see a lot of pple being disapointed abt Nick Senior's "exitement"... sorry if i'm bursting anyone's bubble...

I'm willing to bet that the Aust built car is going to have about retail 5grand of parts (from their exisiting Sti parts bin), replacing the std stuff and thats about it...

I've been a sube customer for far too long to get exited abt anything that Nick or Derek market.

Bye,
Mo

I'm willing to bet that the Aust built car is going to have about retail 5grand of parts (from their exisiting Sti parts bin), replacing the std stuff and thats about it...


Bye,
Mo

Now, that's a funny screwed-up edit!:lol: Looks like somebody had second thoughts about insulting this Nick guy!:lol:

[agctr]

Trust me, it just won't be a few extra bin parts thrown on for good measure.

Personally I think Nick Senior aka MD of Subaru Australia is a great person.
Ada///M.

[IwannaSportSedan]

It will be interesting to see if this amounts to a special edition dress-up of what would otherwise be a "GT Spec B"

Bilsteins, Brembos, other suspention tweeks, BBS 18x7 forged ten-spokes, special red-stitched black leather interior, and three colors, silver, regal blue, and WR blue. STi catalog spoilers and mufflers, etc.

That is what the JDM STI seems to be. Not that it is a bad thing at all. I'd seriously consider one if they were in this country, and were the avenue to get a WR Blue Legacy GT sedan.

I wonder if they have red stitching on the steering wheel, and the STi logo airbag that the WRX STi gets... It would make sense with the rest of the interior.

I wish some of these things were available in North America. Blitzen, WR Limited, GT Spec B (regular production option) Legacy 3.0R and Spec B 6MT. Solid Red paint, WR Blue, Violet Grey, Urban Grey, black/red interior, black/blue interior, black with red stitching, grey leather and burl wood trim. McIntosh stereo options, HID projectors, and the list can go on and on.

If the economy is going to be a global economy, and since we do live in the information age, where I can read information from Japan, Europe, Austrailia, and other points, in a matter of minutes... Then why have so many different variations dependent on which market the products are sold in. Most models should be available in most markets, IMHO. It might cost a tad bit more in some ways, but having so many different distribution channels and part-sets can't be cheap either. Gotta spend money to make money, anyway.

I can see legal safety and environmental legal reasons for differences by market, even if I think they are too strict, especially in the US, but that has nothing to do with what colors are available and where, and other less crucial differences.

With proper marketing and emphasis, the Legacy, once brought to people's attention, will do well to sell itself, especially with enhanced equipment.

[agctr]

IWSS, you make perfect sense I do have to admit. When you compile a list like you have, you can certainly see the advantages that we do now get here in Australia. The colours as of yet have been "Officially Unconfirmed" but I think yr list of colours wouldnt be far off the real deal list. Apparently the LibertySTi will also debut for the first time with Xenon Lights but brake package is unconfirmed also including the style of the rims. This will no doubt factor in the shape and design of not only the rims but the boots they wear.
Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

agctr - I hope i'm wrong and the Aust added GT Ltd Ed does get a few more goodies than just the spoilers, wheels, etc. Then i can buy those parts and fit em to my car :D

IwannaSportSedan - the JDM STi tuned GT does not get the red stiched /STI logo on the steering wheel.

As for the brakes, I seriously doubt that the Aust Ltd Ed would get the brembos - the brakes would cost well over A$5000 and I don't see Sube Australia adding that AND:

18" wheels (about A$2500 atleast) the 18" BBS as on the JDM STI would cost well over A$4000 for 4.


Sti boot spoiler ( A$650aprx)


Sti front lip (A$500aprx)


Sti springs (A$250aprx) - which were designed to work on the JDM car with Beilstein shocks as std.


STi exhaust - either the mufflers with twin tailpipes or the Genome ones (atleast A$1500 - I bought a pair of the twin tail pipe mufflers for a friend and cost close to A$1800!!!)
The prices I have quoted are not what Subaru sells these items for here but what I have paid or been quoted from much cheaper sources...

The way i see it, the springs + spoilers + exhaust + wheels + an ECU tune would be about as good a package that Sube would do for an extra A$5000 - as an add on.

They could replace some of things but I don't see what else they could replace other than trim, leather colours (the JDM WR LTD get blue and black leather), body colours (we don't get the WR blue here), etc.

Well, i guess we'll find out in another few days...

Bye,
Mo

[Mo_GT]

If the economy is going to be a global economy, and since we do live in the information age, where I can read information from Japan, Europe, Austrailia, and other points, in a matter of minutes... Then why have so many different variations dependent on which market the products are sold in. Most models should be available in most markets, IMHO. It might cost a tad bit more in some ways, but having so many different distribution channels and part-sets can't be cheap either. Gotta spend money to make money, anyway.

I can see legal safety and environmental legal reasons for differences by market, even if I think they are too strict, especially in the US, but that has nothing to do with what colors are available and where, and other less crucial differences.


I understand your points very well - i asked something similar a while back when Australians were petitioning Sube Australia to import the BE5 Legacy /Liberty B4.

The different variations are due to climatic /road /fuel conditions (Sube Aust reason for our detuned motor and different suspension) and also IMO mainly due to costs.

Sube /FHI Japan, can afford to have all the variations in the domestic market as their distribution chanells are different to the ones in export markets. Like here in Aust, Sube Aust has to buy a certain no of cars in certain trim and colours - thats we we don't have a interior choice or any choice except for man /auto and colour.

And import taxes also play a part, in most countries (eg: Singapore) the various car importers import the cars in tha barest trim and add everything on after the car's have been bought according to customer's requirements - things like a/c, stereo, wheels, interior, etc. but this can be costly too.

End of the day decession makers have a make a cost vs demand decession and "tailor" a product for the specific market and them market the product as such.

Personaly, I'd given up the McIntosh stereo, sunroof and leather (which are all optional extras in Japan), for Bilsteins, alloy lower control arms(both are std on JDM cars) and a cheaper price tag but since majority of GT customers here prefered to have these options thats what Sube Aust imports...(we used to have 2 models - cloth interior, no sunroof and no McIntosh and these didn't sell - mind you these were all auto only).


Bye,
Mo

[Mo_GT]

Here's some news, this is what the Aust built Gt will have:

• Tyres Pirelli P Zero Rosso 215/45 R18 93W
• Wheels 5 X STI Alloy Wheel 18 x 7.5 55mm
• Suspension front Bilstein Strut type with STI lowered springs
• Suspension rear Bilstein multi link type with STI lowered springs
• STI front Strut brace
• Black leather seats with Alcantara inserts and STI logo and red stitching
• Black interior roof lining
• Red luminescent instrument meters
• STI rear suspension lateral links with pilot ball joints
• STI tuned engine management ECU
• Twin pipe sports mufflers
• Aluminium pedal set
• STI short shift gear lever mechanism on manual transmission
• STI Front lip spoiler
• STI Rear boot spoiler (sedan models)
• Tuned by STI badging

Full article here: http://subaru.com.au/promotions/?promoid=246

I do have to say that the upgrades are worth the $5000 extra. Well done Nick and SA, first product in the last 10 or so years that has impressed me :)

Bye,
Mo

[rfd425]

WOW! That's a nice package. It puts the USDM Spec B to shame in my opinion, and for about the same price!

[IwannaSportSedan]

+1

Still only Black, Brilliant Silver, and Urban Grey. What is with Subie knocking down the color on these cars. Does Japan reserve the right for a solid red or WR Blue Legacy? they get both, and NOBODY else gets either one?

I am gonna order that Tuned by STi badge when I get a legacy... that'll show em! :lol:

[agctr]

Fantastic looking setup and seriously a very mean looking unit. Love everything about the STi, didnt come with the brake package or xenons that I wanted but think it will have everything else as suggested. Will be in Sydney over the coming days (not Friday like I hoped) to have a look. Going to take some pics and post if ppl dont beat me to it.

+1 Order already... done.
Ada///M.

[Robdownunder]

When is the release date for downunder?

[Mo_GT]

Dunno the actual release date but you can order them now and delivery will depending on what you want (auto /man, sedan/wagn, colour).

[agctr]

Release will be Jan 1 2006.
Ada///M.

[*Jedimaster*]

KW? So, like, you guys are getting electric Libertys? I think I'll stay here where we get Liberty automatically and the toilets flush in the right direction :p

[sebberry]

Stupid of America... an Canada for that matter...

Do we even get the regular Spec B?

Something like that in North America would sell well, with proper promotion, which Subaru still doesn't know how to do.

Shoul I even begin to wish for a Turbo H6? It's hopeless....

[agctr]

I believe the only way we will ever see a H6TT is if someone does the transplant themselves.
Ada///M.

Sad but true.

[sebberry]

I believe the only way we will ever see a H6TT is if someone does the transplant themselves.
Ada///M.

Sad but true.

I wonder how the existing H6 would hold up with a turbo at 13psi of boost. I am sure that it would need some new tougher internals, no?

Also, might be a bit boring with the Auto, however the auto might be nice when dealing with 350 HP...

[rfd425]

I wonder how the existing H6 would hold up with a turbo at 13psi of boost. I am sure that it would need some new tougher internals, no?

Also, might be a bit boring with the Auto, however the auto might be nice when dealing with 350 HP...

It would have to be a lower-compression version of the H6, and probably beefed-up internals as well, but Subaru has plenty of experience with turbo engines, and I'm sure it wouldn't pose a problem for them. Packaging might be a bigger problem than engineering.

[agctr]

Totally need some new gear for the internals, just to assist extra power and longivity of the engine life. TTH6 is possible Im sure but how much would be anyones guess.
Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

I think that we'll soon see a H6 turbo - twin turbo is another story but a single turbo 6cyl is something that we can expect to see in the near future.

There's not much in need for new internals...as exisiting internals from other engines would fit. Only thing i see them needing are a stronger crank but i think the H6 crank would handle being force fed.

Only problem is space in the engine bay of current models to accomodate the turbo, intercooler, etc.

For those in Aust, whats the on road $$ for the GT with Sti bits ? What do you pay in LCT ?

Bye,
Mo

[agctr]

MO, did u go ?

[Mo_GT]

MO, did u go ?

Did I go where? The Sydney motor show? no...I'm in WA...

[IwannaSportSedan]

I don't think a turbo 3.0 or 3.7 liter H6 would be too hard for FHI. It would be harder to Fab up in the shop behind the house, due to not many people having rapid-prototyping and metalcasting and extensive fabricating facilities at hand.

BTW, if you consider the EJ257 engines bore and stroke of 99.5mm x 79mm, you get 2.4694 liters of displacement (if my math is correct, (bore*pi)*stroke= cubic millimeters of displacement x 1000 to convert to liters of volume.) for 4 cylinders. With two more cylinders of the same size...

2.4694 liters x 1.5 = ~3.7041 liters.

My ideas for a Turbo or Twin Turbo H6 are fairly straight-forward...

We know that the Transmission is the fixed point. It must stay in the same position in order to drive the front wheels. So we can use the bellhousing mounting surface as the static point to which the engine is mounted. Adding two cylinders then extends the engine forward. Not great for chassis dynamics, but necessary for drivetrain placement. Plus, we know it fits, because the 3.0R legacys and outbacks do this.

So. if the rear wall of the rearward cylinders of the H4 and H6 are in the same place, we know there is room there for an up-pipe and down pipe. Since the Legacy Turbo models are available elsewhere in the world are available in RHD, and the Turbo stays on the Right hand side of the engine (as looking at the car from the back to the front) we know the steering and other mechanicals can fit around the turbocharger, even if they have to be transposed to the left side in LHD countries, Twin turbochargers should be possible, one on each side.

Each header would mate to an up-pipe on it's own side. Perhaps a balance pipe between them, but perhaps none would be needed. Basically three cylinders would feed each turbo. OR, for a single turbo variant, meld the headers to a single larger up-pipe for a single turbo, much like the current H4 Turbos. I prefer the thought of two moderate turbos offering quick spooling, and a good amount of combined boost.

The turbos would probably need to be rotated in relation to each other, and thus a dedicated right or left turbo. (compressor outlets facing inboard, both impeller inlets facing aft/down to mate with the up-pipes and down-pipes.)

From there it could go one of two ways. FMIC, or TMIC. We'll get back to that in a second...

The intake manifolds... Instead of spanning one intake manifold across the wide horizontal block... I would go with two intake manifolds, one for each bank. A runner from front to back, mounted directly over the intake ports on the corresponding head. This would leave the center of the block open for a larger TMIC, Forced-cold-air airbox, or by canting the intake manifolds toward the engine centerline, perhaps some crossover plenum work to create a variable length intake setup.

The TMIC option would put a large core TMIC in the same general location as the LGT intercooler, with two inlets near the firewall, and one or two outlets toward the front. One or two throttle-bodies (common TB, or separate, one for each intake plenum) could be housed between the TMIC and the alternator, feeding the intake plenums on each side.

The FMIC would be slightly different. It might even be better to swap sides for the turbos, to face the compressor outlets outboard, for piping to go forward along both sides of the engine bay, to feed a common or twin FMICs behind the front bumper skin. Again, the outlet(s) of the FMIC(s) could connect with hard piping to one common, or two individual throttle bodies for the intake plenums. (TBs could even be mounted on the forward facing end of the intake plenums, right above each head. That would definitely leave some open space above the engine block. Perhaps that open space could house a hood-scoop fed-airbox and MAFs to feed the intake side of the turbochargers.

Those are just my ideas. I think they would work, but I have no way of implementing, testing, or optimizing them. It would be fun to do so.

Subaru has already shown a H6TT/5EAT in the B11S concept car, which I beleive was actually driven on at least one occaision. Subaru already has this engine. Whether it is emissions compliant, manufacture-ready, and up to their exacting reliability standards, we don't know. But the engineers have been working for some time on it...

Supposedly that car, I beleive it had a 3.0 liter TT, made in the very near neighborhood of 400hp and similar torque.

I don't know much about the 3.0R engine internals, whether it is open block or semi-closed like the EJ20 and EJ25. But I would think that it would be very similar cylinder dimensions to the EJ20. 6 Ej20 forged pistons and rods of about 8.5-9.0:1 compression, forged 3.0R/Ej20 hybrid crankshaft, and some 3.0R cam blanks carved to EJ20 specs, along with matching the EJ20's valve and combustion chamber characteristics (if not the same already) and I would think this would be very viable.

Up it to EJ25-derived specs with Ej257-derived heads, cams, and valves, forged internals, etc... and you'd have a very serious 3.7 liter Twin Turbo flat 6, significantly north of 400hp, that might give Porsche's 3.6 TT engine a little bit of pause.

As a little more icing on the cake, my ideal engine of this line would be along these lines, but essentially siamesing two EJ257 blocks, for an H8, with similar adaptations, and having each bank of 4 cylinders feeding a twin-scroll turbo. A Twin-TwinScroll, as it were. 5 Liters (4.9388) of pure DOHC turbocharged Flat-eight. It would probably 550-600hp, if done correctly. Direct Fuel Injection would allow it to have a bit higher static compression, and offer true displacement-on-demand. Shutting down various fuel injectors based on demand would turn those cylinders into air-compressors, with no detrimental effects of pushing unburned fuel into the exhaust...

That would be just about perfect for a mid-engine drivetrain, RWD with a Porsche transaxle. Subaru-powered supercar anybody? :D :D :D

[S0CalGT]

As far as the Single Turbo Flat-6 goes, PDXTuning is currently working on one. Talk to them for more details. I saw it first hand during their new shop grand opening

[IwannaSportSedan]

If they, or anyone else use my intellectual property from the above post, I'll settle for compensation of one Legacy with said engine in it... That'd be all ( :D )

[sebberry]

Is there simply no way to move the front differential foreward a few inches to bring the weight of the engine back over the front wheels?

[Robdownunder]

Guys,
Here is the latest official news about the impending new GT release for Australia.
Rob.

http://www.subaru.com.au/news/?newsid=12353

[agctr]

IWSS, I have just started a new thread re the H6TT, maybe you could put some of yr ideas in there as well for Subaru News and Rumors.

A Subaru based Supercar... hmmm doesnt sound as strange as you think.
We could give our cousin the GT-R a run for its money prehaps. AWD Vs AWD.
Ada///M.

[IwannaSportSedan]

Adam,

I'm just getting on line again after the last couple of days away... I'll certainly check it out.

BTW, about the differential moving forward...

The front differential is behind the flywheel and clutch or torque converter, in the transmission case. The only way that moves forward is if the engine also moves further forward.

The other option would be to put in a separate front differential with a driveshaft from the front of the transmission, and the differential in front of the engine...

That would require major drivetrain and chassis redesign, but does have some benefits, such as a short front overhang, maximized wheelbase, centralized weight distribution, etc. but it also is more complex, more moving parts, more oil seals, more weight, etc.

[sebberry]

Adam,

I'm just getting on line again after the last couple of days away... I'll certainly check it out.

BTW, about the differential moving forward...

The front differential is behind the flywheel and clutch or torque converter, in the transmission case. The only way that moves forward is if the engine also moves further forward.

The other option would be to put in a separate front differential with a driveshaft from the front of the transmission, and the differential in front of the engine...

That would require major drivetrain and chassis redesign, but does have some benefits, such as a short front overhang, maximized wheelbase, centralized weight distribution, etc. but it also is more complex, more moving parts, more oil seals, more weight, etc.


Ahh, defeats the purpose of the simple Subaru design...

[RacingFish]

simple??

[agctr]

Curious... any updates to report.
Ada///M.

[agctr]

The LibertySTi is LANDING soon with the STi currently being build in Japan as we speak.
The LibertySTi will be then HAND BUILT by STi Australia once they land in a Suburb here in Melbourne, unsure of any further information but as it comes to hand, I shall let you all know. Delivery is set for Mid to Late Jan but this could be brought forward depending on Australian Rules and Regulations regarding engine emissions.

Stay Tuned.....
Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

The LibertySTi is LANDING soon with the STi currently being build in Japan as we speak.
The LibertySTi will be then HAND BUILT by STi Australia once they land in a Suburb here in Melbourne, unsure of any further information but as it comes to hand, I shall let you all know. Delivery is set for Mid to Late Jan but this could be brought forward depending on Australian Rules and Regulations regarding engine emissions.

Stay Tuned.....
Ada///M.

Are u saying that the JDM Legacy "Tuned by STi" is also landing in Aust?

What exatly will be hand built here?

[Robdownunder]

From what I was lead to believe of the personal interview done with Greg Foletta at our WRX Club meeting,, the GT comes as is from Japan as a normal one like we currently have in OZ then it gets STI'd here in Melbourne using special stock items imported then assembled locally.
Rob.

[dmcgowan]

Vin said that the car comes in from Japan with the all black interior, different seats and dash fitted (plus sunroof deleted!). The suspension, exhaust, wheels and ECU tune are then all fitted by the Docklands mechanics at Altona. I can't remember whether he said the bodykit was fitted here or not?

Come to think of it - I would have guessed it makes more sense to bring the car out on the right wheels (what are they going to do with 1500 GT wheels???) so maybe i wasn't listening right re the wheels..

[agctr]

Unsure RE the Rims unless they are going to take those Rims and put them on the other Liberties and upgrade them as they did with the WRX Rims off the WRP10 units. Not a bad marketing ploy I say, but then again it would be nice to have a set of standard GT rims as beaters too.

From what I know the STi will be shipped out in full from Japan, but like the Commodore from Elizabeth in SA, the STi will arrive in Australia, then stripped of the stock parts and replaced by STi including ECU and tuning. This is very ala HSV.
Ada///M.

[dmcgowan]

I think that's the plan Adam. I suspect all of the 'zorst, ECU, etc bits will be on sale soon enough (they'd be stupid not to) but the all-black interior, alcantara trim seats and STi dash will be exclusive to the lucky 300!

We must have been down at Docklands at the same time on Saturday - I was there as Petter was totally f*cking up the centre diff of a stock WRX. Pity the poor sod who buys that car!!!!!

Thinking of doing a cruise around Altona this weekend to see if I can spot the compound - maybe we should organise a trip!!!

[agctr]

G'Day Darren

Yeah we no doubt passed eachother in the STi Complex. I didnt stick around to see Petter destroy the WRX or complaining until he was given a MY05 WRX STi. I went for the press conference and then bailed to return later to talk to STi.

Yeah the cruise could be pretty good. It would be up near GrandPrix Cars or Near Toyota or somewhere like that. The place would have to be pretty HUGE considering its the holding pen for all Subaru's once they come off the ship.

How do u think the B4 TT will compare to new STi ?
Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

So it was just someone blowing smoke up the u know what re the "Hand Building", hell in that case everyone who gets any after market part put on has a "hand built" car !!!

agctr,
don't understand your statement "The LibertySTi is LANDING soon with the STi currently being build in Japan as we speak" ???

[dmcgowan]

Adam,

I think the GT by STi will be the car I always wanted the B4 to be. I had a MY98 WRX before and loved every minute of it. Then you get married, you have kids on the way....

Seriously though, the B4 has always been good but just hard work to get results out of. I don't want to mod and after a few months you can drive around the VoD but it's always there. Apart from the non-linear engine response though the handling, fit and build of the B4 have been great.

I trust Vin's view and when he tells me the GT by STi will go harder and be much more linear I'll take his word for it. I'm banking on the GT by STi giving me the refinement / handling of the B4, the speed / grin factor of my WRX and maybe just maybe it will be substantially quicker.

It looks a great car in the flesh - i got to see it at Sydney

p.s. Mo - are you the same Mo who was / is on the Yahoo Liberty B4 forum and has been for about 4 years too?

[agctr]

Mo, from the information I have received is, OUR STi's are currently being build/shipped/landed. Hence I said LANDING SOON.

Yes from everything that I have heard from "the underground" so to speak, this will pull just as hard as the MY06 WRX STi so looking very very forward to that. By the sounds of what VIN has told you, there wont be much LAG if any at all which brings a smile to my face. Just concerned .... curious why VIN went the EAT and not the MT if he thinks the MT is that good?

Thats one thing I have been wanting to talk to him personally about as Ive been uming and arrring about EAT or MT... From the details I know, Subaru have rated the MT at 200kW but have heard its more like 209kW, so I wonder if the EAT has been underated as well?
Ada///M.

[dmcgowan]

Vin has gone the AT and wagon - he must be settling down. I just wouldn't ever consider an auto whilst my left leg still works....

Lots of rumours abound that the Manual is putting out more than 200kW? No idea whether it is true or not - Rob said Greg Folleta just grinned!!! The Geelong dealer said it was more but didn't know how much more.





Darren

[agctr]

LOL yeah that was the information I got from Rob as well..... (Rob = Wealth of Knowledge)
I wonder if they will come clean or will they get us to use the AWD Dyno @ Docklands.... at a cost of course...
Ada///M.

[dmcgowan]

I suspect it will be a bit above 200kW - not outrageous but enough that there's a bit of cache....

However, I suspect the Vin Macaro wagon will be retuned about midday on the second of January for MUCH more than 200kW if his smile was anything to go by....

[agctr]

LOL yeah couldnt imagine Vin being owned by some of his mates @ STi.
And couldnt imagine Vin driving a daily driver Grocery Getter... considering the list of rides he has LOL.
Ada///M.

[Mo_GT]

p.s. Mo - are you the same Mo who was / is on the Yahoo Liberty B4 forum and has been for about 4 years too?

Yup, thats me :D

[Mo_GT]

Mo, from the information I have received is, OUR STi's are currently being build/shipped/landed. Hence I said LANDING SOON.


Ah ok, since you mentioned the JDM STi being built etc , etc i though they were headed our way too...

[dmcgowan]

Never realised you actually bought a GT Mo - I just remember you agonising over the blue / black interior of the B4 all those years ago. Where does 4 years go LOL...

Your new GT looks pretty nice from the pics. Can't wait for mine now - wish I was a patient person.




Darren

[Mo_GT]

hahaha! Yeah, and don't forget i hated the BBS wheels too!

At that time i really would have bough the B4 if it wasn't for the leather and the wheels - i actually had money down for one (thinking it would be a limited run like the 400 2dr STi WRXs that were sold a few months before the B4's release)my WRX was abt 5 years old and it would have made great sense for me to sell it and go for the B4... But looking at the resale value of the B4's now, I'm glad I didn't tho...

I took delivery of the GT in Jan this year - actually had an order in Jan last year but had to wait for the manuals to come in...I don't have any complaints abt the GT, paid a lot less less than what a B4 would have cost me, its a car better suited to my needs ( i didn't like the twin turbo set up all that much), has everything i wanted right down to the 3 spoke steering wheel and best of all - full black leather :)

Congrats on your purchase - I'm sure you'll love it!

Bye,
Mo

[dmcgowan]

Heh heh - yeah I'd forgotten how you hated those wheels too - just remembered how much you hated the blue and black leather LOL

I'm really looking forward to the GT by STi - hoping for B4 performance without the VoD!!!!!!!




Darren

[Mo_GT]

LOL! yeah, the blue is what put me off - not a big fan of blue as a colour bu itself! I recently bought a Cusco sway bar and a front lower arm brace, both were blue - i had the sway bar powder coated in black and had the lower arm brace polished!

Compared to the B4, the GT is a much nicer car to drive over all, it pulls from about 2500rpm right to about 6500rpm and then tappers off. You might miss the kick the 2nd turbo on the B4 gives you tho...the GT is a lot smoother.

:)

[dmcgowan]

Heh heh Mo, you really must hate the blue...

I am very confident that the GT by STi will more than compensate for the lack of #2 turbo. The kick of the 2nd turbo might be missed but the VoD won't be. Only 3 days and I'm sick of waiting! January seems so far off...

[agctr]

Hmm I know what u mean Darren. I have to agree, what was the idea behind the blue and black. I was desperate to have leather but NOT THAT BAD. The rims were... yeah and would have been a real PITA to clean, not that the STi rims we are getting are much behind. I dislike cleaning the 5 spokes I have now, let alone the 12 that are coming.

I love driving my Dad's Audi allroad 2.7 TT setup. It certainly CRANKS. Its the biggest sleeper going around. Totally destroys 99% of cars on the road and track. Certainly one of the fastest cars I have driven..... But will the STi deliver ? Thats the question.....
Ada///M.

[sebberry]

Hmm I know what u mean Darren. I have to agree, what was the idea behind the blue and black. I was desperate to have leather but NOT THAT BAD. The rims were... yeah and would have been a real PITA to clean, not that the STi rims we are getting are much behind. I dislike cleaning the 5 spokes I have now, let alone the 12 that are coming.

I love driving my Dad's Audi allroad 2.7 TT setup. It certainly CRANKS. Its the biggest sleeper going around. Totally destroys 99% of cars on the road and track. Certainly one of the fastest cars I have driven..... But will the STi deliver ? Thats the question.....
Ada///M.

Faster than the Outback Xt?

[agctr]

Mate an XT wouldnt even touch it.....
Ada///M.

[sebberry]

Mate an XT wouldnt even touch it.....
Ada///M.

Interesting... all the performance figures that I can find show that it is slower than the XT for the 0-60, and slightly faster than the XT in the 1/4 mile...

Also, with a curb weight about 700 lbs higher than the XT and only 258ft-lb of torque of the TTV6, I hardly think it would be that much quicker (but then again I haven't driven one) maybe those are very conservitave numbers...

[agctr]

Seriously, get in one and drive it. ITS A PURE WEAPON. A REAL SLEEPER.

It totally owns my sisters WRX. The KICK is amazing and can seriously haul some a..
Ada///M.

[rfd425]

Mate an XT wouldnt even touch it.....
Ada///M.
Hmmm, not sure what you're basing that on, but I just did a quick Google survey of 0-60 times, and the XT seems to come in at ~5.9 seconds, vs. ~6.4 seconds for the Allroad 2.7T (both with MT).

Also, the Allroad weighs 600-700 lbs. more, with nearly identical peak torque and hp numbers.

[rfd425]

Seriously, get in one and drive it. ITS A PURE WEAPON. A REAL SLEEPER.

It totally owns my sisters WRX. The KICK is amazing and can seriously haul some a..
Ada///M.
Some cars feel faster than they are for some reason, but I'm not convinced the Allroad is faster, at least not below, say, 80 mph.

[agctr]

Trust me, an XT, WRX or GT wouldnt touch the allroad in REAL time runs.
On the track if it can destroy a LS2 6.0L V8 297kW HSV, Im sure the XT wouldnt do much better.
0 - 62 the XT, WRX and GT + the HSV might do ok, but after that, its GAME OVER, the AUDI lowers itself and says BYE.
Forget what the stats say, go drive one and u will know where I am coming from.
Ada///M.

[rfd425]

Trust me, an XT, WRX or GT wouldnt touch the allroad in REAL time runs.
Forget what the stats say, go drive one and u will know where I am coming from.
Ada///M.
What exactly are "real time runs"? I'm not trying to be argumentative here, but I'd like to see data or an opinion from an objective testing source. If there are many sources on the internet that say the Outback XT does 0-60 in 5.9, and many more that say the Allroad does it in 6.3 (that's the fastest I could find), I think the preponderance of the evidence says that the XT is faster from 0-60. Now, the difference in power delivery, or some other variable, may make the Allroad feel faster on the "butt dyno", but I can't find anything to corroborate the Allroad actually being faster.

Maybe in the 1/4 mile, the Allroad will catch up or even surpass the XT (I didn't research 1/4-mile times, so I don't know), but it can't be by much. For ungoverned top speed, I don't know -- it would probably depend on aerodynamics more than anything.

However, by any criterion, I don't believe it's accurate to say the XT "wouldn't touch" the Allroad.


Edit (since I don't want to make another off-topic post): I don't have an XT, I have an LGT, and even if I did it wouldn't be very practical to take it to Australia to race you. For all I know, you're a better driver than me anyway, which might make the car you're driving faster.

I guess without any proof, it's Adam's empirical opinion against every published source I can find. We'll leave it at that.

Edit #2: Adam, perhaps these cars are of different specifications in the USA vs. Australia, in which case we might both be right. I was referring to U.S.-spec models. Also, you don't mention ever having driven an XT. In any case, I always like to consider the possibility that I might be wrong, something you may or may not find useful. I plead guilty to going off-topic, but I was merely responding to your post #83.

[agctr]

Real time runs = REAL EVERY DAY REGARDLESS OF CONDITIONS ETC.
Get yr XT here and I will book track time.

Lets get back on topic thanks.
Ada///M.

[sebberry]

It is true that the XT runs out of steam at about 120-140 Km/hr (or at least stops pulling as hard)

I can see where the twin turbo 2.7 would provide some advantage in this range, and definately the V8.

Oh well.. I just need an accessport and I'll be all set.

( I do like the adjustable suspension, it's features like this where Subaru falls a bit behind)

Edit:

Ok... found this off car and driver:

Outback 2.5XT 5EAT:
ACCELERATION, Seconds
Zero to 30 mph: 2.7
40 mph: 3.9
50 mph: 5.3
60 mph: 7.1
70 mph: 9.4
80 mph: 11.8
90 mph: 14.8
100 mph: 19.2
110 mph: 24.7
120 mph: 32.0
Street start, 5–60 mph: 7.8
Top-gear acceleration, 30–50 mph: 3.4
50–70 mph:4.7
Standing 1/4-mile: 15.6 sec @ 92 mph

Audi allroad quattro:
ACCELERATION Seconds
Zero to 30 mph 2.6
40 mph . . . . . . . . .4.0
50 mph . . . . . . . . .5.6
60 mph . . . . . . . . .7.7
70 mph . . . . . . . . .10.1
80 mph . . . . . . . . .13.0
90 mph . . . . . . . . .17.1
100 mph . . . . . . . .21.4
110 mph . . . . . . . .27.2
120 mph . . . . . . . .38.1
Street start, 5–60 mph . . . . . .8.3
Top-gear acceleration, 30–50 mph . . ..3.7
50–70 mph . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .4.9
Standing 1 /4-mile . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .16.0 sec @ 87 mph

sorry, probably shouldn't be hijacking this thread BUT... the topic did come up :icon_tong

[agctr]

Thanks Sebberry for going to that level of detail.

I said before not to worry about that stats but now that U have posted them up, they look pretty good. As I said before, GET OUT AND DRIVE THE allroad, its a lot faster than those times predict. If Im beating cars just under the 400HP category, it has to be a lot faster than those times predict.

Anyways, moving back onto topic........ there are a few LibertySTi threads floating around at the moment with some great pics BUT still no real deal pics of the interior. Seen a lot from the motorshow in Sydney but again nothing really from inside...... always the way I suppose.
Ada///M.

[agctr]

No need to apologise or go to the 9th degree at all. Yes you are right, the allroad in Australia may have totally different specs compared to its cousin in the USofA, thats something that I dont think either of us took into consideration from the very start. Having said that, I have driven an XT and seriously it doesnt seem as fast as the allroad. Im sure u are a very good driver yrself and could give me a run for my money so to speak.........

No harm no foul. Thanks for posting up.
Great to see that ppl can have good debates without getting toooo fired up. Hey its a forum after all.

Thanks again for the info though, great stuff ...........

LOL, now back to topic.
Ada///M.

What exactly are "real time runs"? I'm not trying to be argumentative here, but I'd like to see data or an opinion from an objective testing source. If there are many sources on the internet that say the Outback XT does 0-60 in 5.9, and many more that say the Allroad does it in 6.3 (that's the fastest I could find), I think the preponderance of the evidence says that the XT is faster from 0-60. Now, the difference in power delivery, or some other variable, may make the Allroad feel faster on the "butt dyno", but I can't find anything to corroborate the Allroad actually being faster.

Maybe in the 1/4 mile, the Allroad will catch up or even surpass the XT (I didn't research 1/4-mile times, so I don't know), but it can't be by much. For ungoverned top speed, I don't know -- it would probably depend on aerodynamics more than anything.

However, by any criterion, I don't believe it's accurate to say the XT "wouldn't touch" the Allroad.


Edit (since I don't want to make another off-topic post): I don't have an XT, I have an LGT, and even if I did it wouldn't be very practical to take it to Australia to race you. For all I know, you're a better driver than me anyway, which might make the car you're driving faster.

I guess without any proof, it's Adam's empirical opinion against every published source I can find. We'll leave it at that.

Edit #2: Adam, perhaps these cars are of different specifications in the USA vs. Australia, in which case we might both be right. I was referring to U.S.-spec models. Also, you don't mention ever having driven an XT. In any case, I always like to consider the possibility that I might be wrong, something you may or may not find useful. I plead guilty to going off-topic, but I was merely responding to your post #83.

[dmcgowan]

I think the reason there are no interior pics is because the cars haven't actually been built yet? The one at the motorshow was a standard GT with the visible add-ons (wheels, 'zorst, strut brace, etc) so the interior wasn't right (I think they put the STi dash in).

The mules at Docklands are also modified local spec cars. I'm 99% sure that the interior with the Alcantara seats is what you see on the Japanese STi website - the interior package we'll be getting is definitely same spec as the current Liberrty STi.

[dmcgowan]

p.s. off topic but the GT STi will change your view on how quick the Audi is Adam heh heh

[Mo_GT]

Anyways, moving back onto topic........ there are a few LibertySTi threads floating around at the moment with some great pics BUT still no real deal pics of the interior. Seen a lot from the motorshow in Sydney but again nothing really from inside...... always the way I suppose.
Ada///M.

Here you go buddy:

Seats - red stiching (not sure if Aust will get the embosed STI logo)
http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/LEGACY/catalog/interior/02/imgs/top.jpg


http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/LEGACY/catalog/interior/01/imgs/top_01.jpg

All red instrument cluster
http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp/LEGACY/catalog/interior/imgs/top.jpg

[dmcgowan]

Mo,

Are they from the www.subaru-sti.co.jp (http://www.subaru-sti.co.jp) site? This is the interior and we should be getting the stitching I believe....




Darren

[Mo_GT]

Yup, its from the STi website.

[agctr]

Yeah seen those pics 400000000 times. Was hoping with all the pics around of the STi at the MotorShow in Sydney... surely someone took pics of the inside. Thats what I meant by real pics.

Thanks for PICing up anyways Mo. And yes we will be getting the stiching including the STi logo.
Ada///M.

[Aus_STi_GT]

Hi all, Has anyone had any experience with Alcantara seating before? What actually is it, it appears to be suede like from the photos? If that is the case I'd be interested to hear about how it stands up in terms of does it wear well, does it stain easily, etc. Will it last well or would we have been better off with all leather? Cheers, Rick

[agctr]

G'Day Rick,

Yes u are about right with the suede comments as its quite similar. Alcantara is pretty hard wearing, its the same material that is found on the M3 seats including the M3 CSL. It is pretty hard wearing, maybe not as sturdy as overall leather but it will give good wear. Stains and stuff Im unsure of, hence the reason I will be going with Subaru Protection.

A member from the M3Forum has a CSL, I will try and post up one of his interior pics. The Alcantara is also on the steering wheel. Members have complained that after 6 months the Alcantara starts to look very shabby BUT I think the steering wheel would have more abuse than the seat IMHO.
Stay Tuned.

What have u personally ordered or thinking about ?
Ada///M.

[agctr]

Here is the seat pic from the M3.
Ada///M.

PS Just remember, this CSL has done a fair bit of track work etc as well and because the material moves like suede, it will look a bit like that from time to time. If u were to brush the material back the other way with yr hand, it would look fine. Its just the angle and the movement of the material that makes it looks so used so to speak.

[agctr]

Looking at pictures of the new MY06 WRXSTi S203, this material (Alcantara)is going to become one of the most sort after pieces as it may only be used for the upmodel STi Vehicles. The seats in the S203 will be built in conjunction with Recaro and they look AMAZING. Similar idea to the CSL and GT3 seats, very slimline back etc. The S203 will be a limited STi Japan run of 555 Vehicles.

I wonder why they picked this number Sube555 aka Seth ??????
Ada///M.

[rfd425]

The S203 will be a limited STi Japan run of 555 Vehicles.

I wonder why they picked this number Sube555 aka Seth ??????
Ada///M.
I wonder if that production number was a part of their sponsorship contract with BAT, or if Subaru just did it on their own. Surely, they wouldn't give the cig company that advertising for free...

[Aus_STi_GT]

Thanks for the info and pics Adam, I feel a little better about it's wear characteristics now. Apparently it's also used in the new EVO so must be ok if so many major manufacturers are using it.

I have ordered a Silver sedan with auto trans. Just couldn't live with the manual on a daily basis and find the sport auto a suitable enough compromise.


Funnily enough I went through exactly the same thought process as yourself...........can't afford an M3 at the prices we pay in Oz so this was the next best thing. :)

[agctr]

I wonder if that production number was a part of their sponsorship contract with BAT, or if Subaru just did it on their own. Surely, they wouldn't give the cig company that advertising for free...

Surely this would have something to do with sponsorship, cant see why they would limit the run to that number otherwise.

[agctr]

Thanks for the info and pics Adam, I feel a little better about it's wear characteristics now. Apparently it's also used in the new EVO so must be ok if so many major manufacturers are using it.

I have ordered a Silver sedan with auto trans. Just couldn't live with the manual on a daily basis and find the sport auto a suitable enough compromise.




Funnily enough I went through exactly the same thought process as yourself...........can't afford an M3 at the prices we pay in Oz so this was the next best thing. :)

Just curious where about you live etc, can you provide a bit more info. Also post up in "Where are all the Aussies" and introduce yrself in there too.

Yes the ///M3 was certainly on the list but was unable to find the exact specs that I wanted. Ti or SG on Imola MY03.5 > SMGII with roughly 30K on the clock would have been nice but they are very very rare. I was seriously looking at jumping ship prior to the launch of the STi and now Im very happy. I also mod at M3Forum.com so there isn't much I dont know about BMW or the ///M (growing every day) Fleet.
Ada///M.

[ozgt]

Hi all, Has anyone had any experience with Alcantara seating before? What actually is it, it appears to be suede like from the photos? If that is the case I'd be interested to hear about how it stands up in terms of does it wear well, does it stain easily, etc. Will it last well or would we have been better off with all leather? Cheers, Rick

Sorry for picking up on this a bit late, but you'll find info on Alcantara at http://www.alcantara.com If you go to the European site you can download the maintenance instructions as a pdf

I was also a bit dubious at first. "Fake suede" was never my cup of tea. But this synthetic textile was developed in Japan and is manufactured in Italy, so is state of the art. Also used by most of the prestige carmakers, so this is a pretty good recommendation. As a bonus it also grips better than leather so you wont slide around so much when testing the physical limits of symmetrical AWD! LOL. Also warmer than leather on cold winter mornings! (my kids always complain about the leather!)

[rfd425]

Adam, don't you think this thread should be merged with the other one? Your call...

[TSi+WRX]

Alcantera is a great material in terms of feel and wear, it's suede, only much better :) - I've (un)fortunately never stained mine, though, so I don't know how well it takes to either getting dirty or subsequently getting clean.

[rkl303]

I hate looking at that interior. It makes me hate my legacy a little more every time I look at the inside.

[gead]

i have alcantara in my clio, and its really good...as mentioned you don't slide around at all, and it is pretty hard wearing...its holding up better than the leather on the bolsters which is showing signs of wear...

[agctr]

Its a material that is now pretty widely used on the WRX STi. As i have pictured above, that is a seat from a MY03 M3CSL from a M3Forum member in HK. The ///M is a daily driver for him and gets plenty of wear and tear but the seats still look great.
Ada///M.